ewen21

Well, he hit over .300 and by a lot and doesn't that say something? He isn't Danny Santana, bro. I don't think the over .300 average and the .400 OBP was a fluke He was actually the best hitter in the lineup for pretty decent chunks of the year. With all the talk about the potential of guys who really haven't made contributions like that on a day in, day out basis; it is actually refreshing to see a guy come up and hit like he did. It shows he has skill at doing the toughest thing you can do in sports and he is still very young. Will the league catch up? Yeah, most certainly...but he isn't going to suddenly become a dog. I have a much more positive view of his future. His defense isn't so disgusting where you can discount the .399 OBP he brought to the table. The dude gives professional at bats and that is something sorely needed to put more pressure on opposing pitchers. Guys like Buxton and Rosario have shown a propensity to give away too easily for long stretches (especially Buxton, who I am actually more concerned about).. Arraez is like .100 points higher in OBP than both Rosario and Buxton. Food for the mind. For that reason, I am not worried about his lack of power (unlike in the case of Joe Mauer who was paid to be THE man) and I am not worried about his defense either. At least not until it becomes an real issue and it isn't. Not to me at least.

Excellent point in the middle paragraph. The pool of prospects getting traded for established major leaguers isn’t the entirety of the minor leagues. It would be the ones almost certain of making it to the majors.... otherwise, what’s the point?

Don't expect much if that is all you are willing to part with. Those aren't the names anyone is going to come asking about

Since when is Aaron Hicks the benchmark for success? A .729 lifetime OPS at age 30. Seven years in the league and he's played in over 100 games twice, he's had multiple injuries and will be on the shelf until about the ASB next year. So for me? I am over that trade. We swung and missed, but it isn't like Aaron Hicks was going to take the starting job from anyone in our outfield (except Buxton). Buxton was supposed to be more than that and, in fact, he is not. Not yet and we don't even know if will ever happen.

Apparently he was too much to give up for Noah Syndergaard and there’s your problem with Buxton and this organization. He’s grossly overrated. He has played more than 100 games only once in the four seasons he had the starting CF job. Aside from a couple of hot months at the end of 2017 he has been BAD offensively. At some point we are going to need to give up the ghost with this guy. I would have last season when he was healthy. After missing almost the entire second half to injury he’s not going to fetch a guy like Syndergaard. Not with his injury history and lack of offense I don’t think many Twins fans are willing to accept this reality. Even worse, some still feel he’s “untouchable” which really boggles my mind

At what stage of the minors? That is awfully hard to pinpoint, I know....but I am talking about dudes on their way up. Not entry level guys in A. I would need a guy under 23 and already in AA doing well and a noted guy at that. It isn't about any old minor league scrub. And I agree with what you said earlier about getting multiple propsects. I generally want to find major league ready guys or at least guys close to it. Not interested in getting prospects for a guy like Rosario unless they are damn good and at least two of them. The Mets managed to get Syndergaard and Travis d'Arnaud for RA DICKEY. THey got Wheeler for an old Carlos Beltran.

This is why I was more than open for a trade involving Buxton and Syndergaard. I would be willing to explore a deal involving Rosario for Noah Syndergaard if the Mets are interested. Maybe a prospect that has had success in the minors. When you say 80% of the pitching prospects are a bust I assume you mean from the time they were drafted. This is why I pay little attention to the draft process. When you talk about prospects that already moved up the chain those numbers change. Please clarify what you mean because I would assume it means upon being drafted, not those already knocking on the door and pitching effectively in the high minors. Those are the kinds of guys I am interested in as well.

That isn't necessarily so. If you can get a guy who can pitch 7 innings consistently, is economical and can work fast there is lots of value in that because there is scarcity. To be clear, I am not advocating any particular move involving Rosario, but it is certainly worth a discussion. Outfield is a place we have what could be considered a surplus and we need pitching. Are we only to address this issue through free agency? Is every single player that comes through our system that is good or has potential conscripted to be a Twin for life? It might taking giving up something to get something. That means risk is involved, but that is what successful teams do.

Indignant is a good word, but then again so is truculence. I have not been in on these threads although I have read a lot of it. Rosario is the kind of player who will never be above the fray due to his cavalier approach. He has a strong offensive game and he has some tools to go along with it. He is durable and appears to be popular with his teammates. HOWEVER, there are some very reasonable criticisms that can be made about his game and for whatever reason this makes certain posters upset. I think maybe it is best to ignore the people who get upset at this juncture unless they want do develop a case against what has been said and I have yet to see anything much in that regard. We are getting to the point where a decision is going to need to be made with him. Is he a long term Twin? Not everyone can be or will be. This team (and its fanbase) really needs to stop believing that the players that come through the system are supposed to retire as Twins can get a special day. We need to start looking at players as assets and assets can be reallocated or sold off for other assets. With all the talk about us not getting pitching I am mystified by all this resistance to trading a guy like Buxton or Rosario. We have the most "depth" in the outfield right now. If we are not going to trade from those positions where do we trade from? I like Rosario, but my GOD.....can we have a grown up discussion without people being personally offended by the criticism that is drawn up? None of the actual criticism is controversial

I am not advocating to trade him, by the way. I was more interested in trading Buxton and if we didn't get Syndergaard because we thought Buxton was all that and a bag of chips then that was a big BIG mistake. I want to read different takes. I agree that Eddie is a reckless player in a lot of ways. I like what he brings to the table, though. However, at the same time, I would like to see people make their case. I am not interested in shuttting it down whereas these terse bitter responses seem to indicate the discussion should be shut down. WHY???? This is the hot stove. Any intelligent input should be good enough whether your or I like it or not

Is there something mean and nasty about that?

Nobody has "attacked" Rosario or is guilty of "bullying" here. These kinds of reactions are accusations that are not accurate. It is an attempt to marginalize the original post and if we are going to be a place centering on discussion that kind of thing should not be accepted. Instead of torpedoing the guy with an accusation, why not make your own point and try to have a conversation with the dude? Why insist there is some pernicious agenda against Eddie Rosario? Most of the stuff Nick said isn't even controversial. What gives? I think that is silly and I would rather have a discussion with all sides freely expressing themselves. I swear, some people are just dying to be "offended"

This is an "attack" in your estimation. He laid out a pretty fair narrative backed with lots of support. He dedicated a paragraph to how he likes the guy as well and this is your reaction? How about constructing and articulating your own view before you start with an accusation?

Bullying? Really? The overreaction to critical analysis never ceases to disappoint me here.

He is very good at striking a baseball and he is very confident in his ability to do so. As far as learning situational hitting, he has not

This right here. I recall an at bat during the playoffs and we got two runners on with none out in a tight game. Eddie came up, swing at the first pitch (which was well out of the strike zone) and he popped out. Totally took the wind of the sails. So yeah. He deserves criticism

Not saying he’s that magnanimous, but I sure as heck could live off of a two million dollar windfall for the rest of my life (I’m 53)

Maybe...just MAYBE Jake doesn’t need any more money and he will walk away from baseball after this season. It is possible to live off the money he’s set to earn this year (even if he nets only half) with the pension. Just sayin

The players would be terminally stupid if they think they could weather another work stoppage.

It didn not rebound for me. I was primarily a hockey fan for about five years and then I finally caved THe players better be careful. If they kick up a fuss and there is a work stoppage the are going to screw themselves in the process. I will wait for a new generation of players and kiss off baseball for a number of years if they do it

It is like using Tom Brady as a benchmark for quarterbacks. For every Verlander there are literally hundreds of others every generation who’ve hung it up by the time they reach his age. I would not draw comparisons to him with any free agent arm out there now.

Jake is still an option. We can’t say they’ve moved on from him. Do you think Gibson is better?

And I wanted a big red fire engine for Christmas in 1972 and ended up getting an Etch-a-Sketch box

You would say Gibson is better than Odorizzi? I don't know about that one

I think the message was it’s going to take more than throwing money at free agent pitching By the way, Houston got their pitch through trades and the Cubs big signing (Darvish) has been a disaster. There were people screaming that we should hand him a blank check! Caveat emptor. Like I said in my last post, the culture has to change if we are ever getting anywhere in the postseason. Getting to the postseason seems to the objective and then hope for the best. As if we are waiting for fairies and angels to grant us luck ...and if they don’t OK we made it to the postseason, so that’s good enough. That mindset isn’t cutting it. I thought it was dead and buried but it’s not. Rocco confirmed that by telling us he’s just fine not winning a game in the postseason