Celestino, Beckham Sent to Minor-League Camp

I think it is best Celestino plays regularly at St. Paul.  He really showed well there last year, and I think to give him another half year or year to continue to improve and gain confidence is the right call.  It will be interesting to see how the pitching falls out and whether Winder and Duran break with the Twins.  I think Rocco might want them both from the get-go.

I'm a little disappointed that Celestino didn't grab the 4th OF spot by the neck, because if he hits anything like he did at AAA last season he's wonderfully suited for it. But he didn't, so playing every day in AAA isn't the worst thing in the world. I still have hope for him that he can be a quality bat who can play all three OF spots.

It kinda feels like Cave sticking around in MLB camp is just some epic-level trolling of Twins fans. I have trouble believing that they would add him back to the 40-man just to have him around for the first few weeks of the season, even if he has turned in the kind of quality spring training ABs you would expect from a 29 year-old veteran with 4 seasons of MLB experience. If anything the twins are more likely to scour the waiver wire to see if anyone else is going to sneak someone through during last cuts rather than jam Cave back on the 40-man, but there's no question his presence is making some people around here twitchy AF.

• Catchers: Ryan Jeffers, Jose Godoy, Gary Sanchez
• Infielders: Miguel Sano, Jorge Polanco, Carlos Correa, Gio Urshela, Luis Arraez, Nick Gordon, Daniel Roberton (NRI)
• Outfielders: Brent Rooker, Alex Kirilloff, Byron Buxton, Max Kepler, Jake Cave (NRI), Kyle Garlick (NRI)
• Pitchers: Sonny Gray, Bailey Ober, Joe Ryan, Dylan Bundy, Chris Archer, Taylor Rogers, Tyler Duffey, Caleb Thielbar, Jorge Alcala, Jharel Cotton, Jhoan Duran, Griffin Jax, Joe Smith, Cody Stashak, Jovani Moran, Jhon Romero, Josh Winder, Danny Coulombe (NRI), Jake Faria (NRI), Devin Smeltzer (NRI)

16 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

It kinda feels like Cave sticking around in MLB camp is just some epic-level trolling of Twins fans.

Someone needs to come in as a defensive replacement after Buxton gets his two at-bats.

7 minutes ago, Sconnie said:

If Kirillof is the starting LF and Sano is the 1B, then Sanchez is the defacto DH?

I'd rather play Sanchez at 1B than Sano. Sano might be the worst first baseman on the team.

8 minutes ago, Sconnie said:

If Kirillof is the starting LF and Sano is the 1B, then Sanchez is the defacto DH?

It depends on how much they want to put Arraez in the field at 3B vs urshela I think? Early on I can see it being primarily Sanchez while they're carrying a 3rd catcher. Once they go down to 2, you may see Arraez (and others) get more time there. It's...fine?

• Catchers: Ryan Jeffers, Jose Godoy, Gary Sanchez
• Infielders: Miguel Sano, Jorge Polanco, Carlos Correa, Gio Urshela, Luis Arraez, Nick Gordon, 
• Outfielders: Brent Rooker, Alex Kirilloff, Byron Buxton, Max Kepler,
• Pitchers: Sonny Gray, Bailey Ober, Joe Ryan, Dylan Bundy, Chris Archer, Taylor Rogers, Tyler Duffey, Caleb Thielbar, Jorge Alcala, Jharel Cotton, Jhoan Duran, Griffin Jax, Joe Smith, Jovani Moran, Josh Winder

I’m going 13 hitters, 15 pitchers.

Send down Godoy, Rooker, Cave; add Robertson and Garlick to the 40 man roster, and you have 13. (Jeffers, Sanchez, Sano, Polanco, Correa, Urshela, Arraez, Gordon, Robertson, Kirilloff, Buxton, Kepler, Garlick.) (Please, Rocco. Never DH Jeffers or Sanchez until they are hitting over .225. Then you don’t waste a roster spot on a third horrible bat.)

For pitchers, you have Gray, Ober, Ryan, Bundy, and Archer in the rotation for five. You send down all the non-rosters as depth for failures/injuries. You DFA Stashak and Thielbar to make room for adding the position players above, sending the two down if they clear waivers. Cotton, Winder, and Jax can go long; Rogers, Duffey, Alcala, Smith, Duran, Moran, and Romero can go short. One reliever of the short group needs to go; I’d let the last week of camp decide that. (I’d probably ship Romero if I had to pick today, but mostly because I know least about him; can’t remember if Jax has options, but if he does, maybe he’d be the guy.)

49 minutes ago, Seth Stohs said:

My Opening Day roster: 

• Catchers: Ryan Jeffers, Jose Godoy, Gary Sanchez
• Infielders: Miguel Sano, Jorge Polanco, Carlos Correa, Gio Urshela, Luis Arraez, Nick Gordon, Daniel Roberton (NRI)
• Outfielders: Brent Rooker, Alex Kirilloff, Byron Buxton, Max Kepler, Jake Cave (NRI), Kyle Garlick (NRI)
• Pitchers: Sonny Gray, Bailey Ober, Joe Ryan, Dylan Bundy, Chris Archer, Taylor Rogers, Tyler Duffey, Caleb Thielbar, Jorge Alcala, Jharel Cotton, Jhoan Duran, Griffin Jax, Joe Smith, Cody Stashak, Jovani Moran, Jhon Romero, Josh Winder, Danny Coulombe (NRI), Jake Faria (NRI), Devin Smeltzer (NRI) 

Agree with this, when they drop back to 26, are there any pitchers with options left besides Duran and Winder? It would seem weird or maybe bad roster management to have to cut pitchers/put them though waivers when then roster drops down instead of sending pitchers back to AAA? Would that maybe give Moran a better chance of being on the opening day roster than say Jax, Cotton or Stashak? Or maybe the thought is every team will be doing this so it would be easier to get guys though waivers?

Or could Sanchez be given the DH job as a prove it, and if he doesn't he is one of the cuts?

This FO has a "love affair" with Cave that has been disasterous through the years. Like any disasterous "love affair" it keeps us from finding and losing (ex. Baddoo & Wade) more desirable suiters, and the best way to solve this mess is a clean cut. This FO has failed in this aspect again by not making a clean cut this offseason with Cave. Now they left the door wide open for this temptation to resume in this disasterous relationship that leaves us wanting in CF back up. Cave, Garlick and Rooker are terrible as 4th OFs.

If Celestino isn't ready (which is fine) quit fooling around! go out and find a viable short term MLB CF sub, FINALLY!  If they are serious about winning, this is the absolute move to make. Otherwise it's all noise.

1 hour ago, Sconnie said:

If Kirillof is the starting LF and Sano is the 1B, then Sanchez is the defacto DH?

1 hour ago, Sconnie said:

If Kirillof is the starting LF and Sano is the 1B, then Sanchez is the defacto DH?

That would be like the poor woman who backed into the airplane propeller:

“Dis-assed-her”

34 minutes ago, Karbo said:

 I would keep Duran over Winder because it seems he is more suited for a relief role at this point and he's a lefty. 

Duran is more suited to relieve but he's not a lefty.

Quote

 find a viable short term MLB CF sub

They're not going to find one better than Max Kepler

53 minutes ago, Sconnie said:

Agreed, DH won’t be as static as it used to be.

If Sano isn't the everyday DH there's going to be a lot of yelling at the radio in my house.

The baseline for 1B defense (and left field) just went up with the introduction of the DH in the National League. The AAA depth players weren't there because they can't field, it was because they couldn't hit well enough to DH.

1 hour ago, MN_ExPat said:

• Catchers: Ryan Jeffers, Jose Godoy, Gary Sanchez
• Infielders: Miguel Sano, Jorge Polanco, Carlos Correa, Gio Urshela, Luis Arraez, Nick Gordon, 
• Outfielders: Brent Rooker, Alex Kirilloff, Byron Buxton, Max Kepler,
• Pitchers: Sonny Gray, Bailey Ober, Joe Ryan, Dylan Bundy, Chris Archer, Taylor Rogers, Tyler Duffey, Caleb Thielbar, Jorge Alcala, Jharel Cotton, Jhoan Duran, Griffin Jax, Joe Smith, Jovani Moran, Josh Winder

This is exactly where I am at.  I would keep Moran over Stashak. 

1 hour ago, Alex Schieferdecker said:

• Catchers: Ryan Jeffers, Jose Godoy, Gary Sanchez
• Infielders: Miguel Sano, Jorge Polanco, Carlos Correa, Gio Urshela, Luis Arraez, Nick Gordon, Daniel Roberton (NRI)
• Outfielders: Brent Rooker, Alex Kirilloff, Byron Buxton, Max Kepler, Jake Cave (NRI), Kyle Garlick (NRI)
• Pitchers: Sonny Gray, Bailey Ober, Joe Ryan, Dylan Bundy, Chris Archer, Taylor Rogers, Tyler Duffey, Caleb Thielbar, Jorge Alcala, Jharel Cotton, Jhoan Duran, Griffin Jax, Joe Smith, Cody Stashak, Jovani Moran, Jhon Romero, Josh Winder, Danny Coulombe (NRI), Jake Faria (NRI), Devin Smeltzer (NRI)

Yeah this would be my pick as well.  I think they take a closer look at Jhon Romero and see if he fairs better against MLB hitters.  The only questions mark for me will be if they choose Winder over Moran.  If they really do want to piggy back starters Winder could be a good fit for that.

Looks like Seth thinks the Twins will try and pass Romero through waivers.  Good luck with that.  Would much rather have Romero over Stashak right now.

8 minutes ago, Sconnie said:

I predict a lot of yelling at the Radio in your house.

Every time Sano butchers a play at 1B, so probably every other game.

1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

I'm a little disappointed that Celestino didn't grab the 4th OF spot by the neck, because if he hits anything like he did at AAA last season he's wonderfully suited for it. But he didn't, so playing every day in AAA isn't the worst thing in the world. I still have hope for him that he can be a quality bat who can play all three OF spots.

It kinda feels like Cave sticking around in MLB camp is just some epic-level trolling of Twins fans. I have trouble believing that they would add him back to the 40-man just to have him around for the first few weeks of the season, even if he has turned in the kind of quality spring training ABs you would expect from a 29 year-old veteran with 4 seasons of MLB experience. If anything the twins are more likely to scour the waiver wire to see if anyone else is going to sneak someone through during last cuts rather than jam Cave back on the 40-man, but there's no question his presence is making some people around here twitchy AF.

 

>> It kinda feels like Cave sticking around in MLB camp is just some epic-level trolling of Twins fans

Exactly...

Let's move Cave to a coach so Rocco can continue to have him around.  We have so many coaches I could not even list their positions let alone their names.  Then let's get serious about the OF.  I cut Rooker - we do not need more Ks - we have Sano and Sanchez for that and we do need a glove - something Rooker has not figured out.  All the nonroster guys are easy cuts. And then I cut Stashak.  

What will be really interesting is what happens when they go from 28 - 26.  Then it is based on Duran and Winder's effectiveness and the need for Godoy.

2 catchers (Jeffers, Godoy) if Sanchez is serious about improving he'd go to AAA to work on both his hitting & behind the plate.

4 OFs (Buxton, Kepler, Kiriloff and a CF via trade)

5 INFs (Correa, Polanco, Sano', Arraez, Urshela)

1 Utility (Gordon)

5 SPs (Gray, Archer, Bundy, Ober, Ryan)

11 RPs                      6 long relief (flex) (Duran, Smeltzer, Cotton, Jax, Romero, Alcala)                                    5 short relief (Talyor, Duffy, Smith, Thielbar, Stashak)

Smeltzer had a good ST, I'd bring him up to start, if he sours I'd DFA him - he should clear waivers again,   Stashak not sure of, I'd DFA him if he doesn't work out- here again he should clear waivers.                         Alcala could also be used as short relief                                                                                                               Winder is my 1st call up at either SP or long relief.