Carlos Correa Makes His Decision Clear

  On 9/30/2022 at 2:40 AM, Vanimal46 said:

Tell us how you really feel, Carlos. Sheesh. I’m still unsure he’ll get the long term deal he’s looking for. 

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Probably not the one he's looking for, but still likely more than the club would be willing to pay him...or for longer than he's willing to pay him?

About as surprising as Buxton being injured. I just hope Lewis can eventually come back and stay healthy.

Correa has been the best player in a Twins uniform since Mauer. There was never any question of how the decision would play unless there was a serious injury. The contract of three years was strictly insurance and the Twins had insurance if he was unable to play. It works both ways. The clip above just tells everyone what was already known. The Twins have an opportunity to sign Correa. They just have to decide what they want for their team. It's actually pretty straight forward. Correa is a classy player.

I’m shocked that someone who would cheat to win isn’t more tactful? No, his being arrogant or expectant of a big pay day or whatever your take is, doesn’t surprise me at all.

  On 9/30/2022 at 3:34 AM, tony&rodney said:

Correa has been the best player in a Twins uniform since Mauer. There was never any question of how the decision would play unless there was a serious injury. The contract of three years was strictly insurance and the Twins had insurance if he was unable to play. It works both ways. The clip above just tells everyone what was already known. The Twins have an opportunity to sign Correa. They just have to decide what they want for their team. It's actually pretty straight forward. Correa is a classy player.

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You nailed it!

He was going to opt out unless he had a terrible year or a major injury, he is a Boras client that was basically typed in bold on the contract. 

I think I would be ok with him at 35-36 a year for 3 or 4 years (no opt outs), but anything past that years wise is paying for decline at a premium position.  It's frustrating to watch the New York and California teams sign all the stars because they can eat the decline years, but it is what it is.  This team is only signing big contracts that are short years or older/ riskier players with limited options, they will never buy a contending squad.

Hindsight is 20/20 but I really wonder what they could have got for him at the deadline, incredibly hard move to make but that's how a team like the Rays competes consistently in that powerhouse division. 

/Deadhorsebeaten

I wonder about the context of that clip; what was said before and after would be helpful to know.  

It is in contrast to the article I read in Wednesday's paper about him wanting very much to stay long term.  He used the analogy about being married vs. dating, saying he wanted to marry an organization and was waiting for the Twins to, in his words, "pop the question".  It was a very positive article with more quotes suggesting he would like to stay here, but he did imply it would take a long term contract.  The ball is in JP's court; he has to decide relatively soon.  I have to believe the team wants him back, and Rocco would love to pencil his name in the lineup 140 times a year.  But if it comes down to nothing but money, wish him well next week, because it will be the last we see of him.    

This is all on The Fantastic Falvines. If I am Correa and I love Minnesota as much as i say, I am open to a multi year deal of say 5 years $200 mil. I dont see any shortstop on our horizon in less than 5 years. Lewis will end up being a super sub. Martin will never be a shortstop. Palacios cant hit at all, and Lee is at least 5 years away. Anyone who saw them play live when the games mattered saw what Correa brings to the game. Seager IMHO is no way the player Correa is. For the nerds, look at the spread sheet. I am sure Correa was a top 3 shortstop in 2022. i already know an ace pitcher isnt coming, why not lock up our next Captain?

People are really going to clutch their pearls over this?  Unreal.  It’s truly bizarro world around here. 

It was always delusional to think he was staying here.  I basically got called a lunatic and idiot for saying that.  If this is a surprise….it’s on you.

Why should he be “tactful?”  To lead a random group of fans to think their favorite organization isn’t a dumpster fire?  To praise an organization that just did everything in their power to drain his value by surrounding him with hot garbage?

He’s probably pretty pissed about how things went.  Heck, I’d be more harsh and I’m just a fan.  He was likely promised a number of things.  Instead, he got caught up in one of the biggest displays of trade deadline and overall administrative failures ever seen (and for the 100th time, it’s not bad luck).

Maybe if Twins media and fans also had a little belly fire instead of making excuses and lauding mediocrity, ownership would get the message.  

Its a hard pill to swallow for some.  But, I think we’re entering some dark days here.  Like late 90s level stuff.  Where our All-Star rep and best player has a season line of .270, 16 HR, 54 RBI.   Lifeless, soul-sucking baseball.

Carlos isn’t an idiot.  If he was in any way optimistic about what was going on here, he’d answer that question differently.  He can’t get out of here fast enough.  I’ve been saying that for months and have been repeatedly been told I don’t know what I’m talking about.  Not much else to say to the “experts,” on that.

Lastly, why the hell wouldn’t you want someone to be honest?  What kind of world do we live in where people demand false tact and pomp over honesty and brass tacks.  Good for you, Carlos.  Go win, have fun AND get paid. Tell anyone outraged and offended where to go.

No vitriol - just business.  His signing with us was actually a shrewd roll of the dice by the FO - maybe we catch fire and wind up competing (which, btw, we did until the other not so shrewd FO’s pitching moves, Rocco’s management, bad fundamentals and injuries caught up with us).  The FO deserves a lot of applause on the CC signing for sure.

The question (certainly inevitable now given CC’s strong post contention performance) is what does the FO do? I see five possibilities:

1. Sign CC to a minimum 8 year deal @ at least $30MM per year.

2. Sign CC to a 5 year deal at closer to $40MM per year.

3. Sign a different SS to a more “reasonable” short-mid term deal.

4. Use the cash to sign FA pitching and try to compete next year with an in-house SS strategy while waiting for a home grown SS in 2024.

5. Save a lot of cash and basically “rebuild” in 2023 developing Lee or Lewis as your SS of the future.

The first three choices are possible if the FO doesn’t see a long term SS in the organization who will be ready by 2024 and a one-year in-house stop gap solution isn’t viable. However, #1 isn’t likely - not the Twins way; #2 is what I’d hope for, but not sure CC goes for it with longer term deals on the table; and #3, to really move the dial, would take another unique situation, but we’ve now seen this film a couple of times and it’s not really worked.

The last two make more sense if Lewis or Lee or someone else (Polacios or Miller perhaps) is viewed as the long-term SS. #4 is way more likely than #5 as this FO with the Pohlads support will never be in a publicly announced rebuilding mode (see our attendance numbers) and there will be a lot of cash available with CC and others moving on. And #4 could work with the right FA starter/relief pitching signings, a healthy Buxton, and another veteran FA signing like Cruz was.

So we hope for #2, but in reality #3 or #4 are more likely and could be better options anyway. Please note, however, none of these work if the FO and Rocco don’t up their games in a big way, the new young core don’t develop, the team doesn’t somehow play better fundamental baseball, and we can’t significantly cut down on the injuries. 

Good bye, thanks for coming to visit and bringing some quality to the table.  

I applaud the Twins for getting him, I wish him good luck, but I think there will be a lot of buyer remorse in the SS long term high dollar contracts.  Remember how most felt about Donaldson and his contract after the first year?  We were glad to dump it.  

SS do not age well at their positions. And neither do pitchers.  I am sure that Dodgers are tired of paying David Price, the Red Sox have gotten nothing but injuries from Sales and below expectation production plus injuries from Story who played second - not SS.   Look at the expectations and then production the Tigers got out of Javy Baez~!  Marcus Semien moved to 2B - is his value as great there?  Fernando Tatis looks like he is just as injured by the burden of so much money as he is physically.  

I just think BB has to adjust their thinking.  I did like Correa's contract, but wish it could have been 2 years then opt out instead of one, but that might be the model the Twins have to follow.

Meanwhile SS is waiting for Lewis and Lee, and our current fill ins are not good enough.  But can we wait or do we make another move for someone to fill in and if so how does that work with the young guys are ready?

Can we over pay a good SP like we did Correa?   That might be our new strategy, lots of money, but not a long term commitment.

  On 9/30/2022 at 10:51 AM, Beast said:

Maybe if Twins media and fans also had a little belly fire instead of making excuses and lauding mediocrity, ownership would get the message.  

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This needed to be said. And needs to keep being said, All of it, actually. Great post.

When Correa was signed I was just as excited as anyone.  I thought this signalled the Twins were all in.  But when they didn't add much around him it instead signalled only another wish and hope season.  Carlos since day one has been concerned only about  himself.  It's obvious he was always going to opt out after year one.  After watching this debacle of a team and organization it becomes understandable.  His September salary drive is almost comical.  Where was he the previous 3 months?  Under different, more promising circumstances I would have been elated for him to stay here long term.  He is not a long term fit for the twins.  The twins are not a long term fit for him.  I say let him go!  We can't be much worse without him.  I mean come on he was only here one year.  The Twins as an organization will be better off without him.  

I think Carlos lost the fans and management with the Dior reference. 

If he was really honest he would say he is not staying with an organization that does not have WINNING as a priority. They have PROFITS as their priority!! They made money so Pohlad is happy!! Correa was the best 2 way SS in Twins history!

  On 9/30/2022 at 9:51 AM, FrankQuilicy said:

This is all on The Fantastic Falvines. If I am Correa and I love Minnesota as much as i say, I am open to a multi year deal of say 5 years $200 mil.

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If you were him, then he'd be you, and he'd use your body to make silly comments about taking less money.

Be honest with yourself for a second and you know you'd take the best financial option, which is more money over more years.

Wow. See where Mr. Buxton would prefer to go on his contract list of teams and unload the guy. Keep Correa. The best SS we have had in decades. Unload Sano, Kepler, a few on the pitching staff, our catchers (maybe Sanchez gets on more year), the coaching staff. Celestino plays center pretty well. He will improve his hitting. Wallner needs to improve his fielding, but he is a massive talent and young. Miranda, Arraez, Gordon are solid and with Royce Lewis ready later next year, the infield with Urshela would be untouchable. Cave could be a good reserve fielder as he has good skills, speed, attitude and can hit when given a chance. That leaves Garlick, Larnach and Kiriloff to go for the remaining outfield spots. Pitching, Pitching, Pitching.........focus on that.

Twins Geezer............out!

  On 9/30/2022 at 1:06 PM, AlGoreRythm said:

If you were him, then he'd be you, and he'd use your body to make silly comments about taking less money.

Be honest with yourself for a second and you know you'd take the best financial option, which is more money over more years.

 

 

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you dont think 40 million a year isnt more money? ummm...ok

Did anyone really expect he would opt in?  Baring an injury that was going to carry into next year, no way was he going to opt in.  The question will be, what will others offer.  We were able to sign him because he was not getting offers he expected, for whatever reason.  Maybe, he was getting good offers but he was seeking better.  

Will he continue to hold out hoping for record deal, that may not be there?  My biggest concern for him long term is I do not know how well he will age.  Right now, and for the next 3 to 5 seasons he will be one of the best SS, maybe not the best, but up there.  However, as he ages and most likely needs to move off SS, will his bat transition to 3b, the normal transition, or will he be a below value player then?  

Could the Twins spend to sign him to a deal he wants, sure.  However, they need to assess the risk of those end of contract years, and are you willing to risk having an overpaid player that will need to play because of his pay, but may not be helping us win. If you think you can win a ship over that time of peak years, or you think he will age well, then do it.  If not, then move on to plan B. 

I think he was being honest, and if I want to speculate, I suspect the FO has not approached Boras about an extension, or indicated that they would like to keep him.  I sensed a little frustration in his words so I suspect there was something behind the scenes that upset him.  What he said is true, and he gave the Twins every indication that he liked it here during the year, so it is in the Twins court to do something.  Everyone in the world knew this was going to happen, so why should we be upset that he announced it.  

I have been consistent with my satisfaction that we signed Carlos to the contract we did and in maintaining my hope we could work something out to have him stay here.  I've got no problem with his response to the question.  He was honest and straightforward.  Honesty is always the best policy.  

We have Royce Lewis and Brooks Lee on the way and another young SS (Miller?) moving up the ladder.  Alas, Palacios and Wander Javier are never gonna make it.  It will NOT take Brooks Lee 5 years to get to the big club.  I give it 3 years.  Lewis may or may not be ready next year, but as a fan, I'd just like to see him have ONE healthy season. I wouldn't be opposed to a 5-year $200 million dollar contract.  It allows for Lewis and Lee to grow and at any time during the contract Carlos could be traded and one of Lewis or Lee becomes the regular SS.

I think it's a slam dunk, no doubter that Correa is the best player on the current Twins team.  In fact, it's not even close.  Teams seldom get better when they don't retain their best player, but I'd be remiss if I didn't point out the Mariners winning 115 games after saying goodbye to Griffey, Randy Johnson and A-Rod in the span of a couple years.  But I certainly feel the Mariners were the exception.  Unless you're looking at a one-year Jose Iglesias type of bridge at SS there really aren't many better options than paying Correa.  We're not going to out-bid the Braves for Swanson.  We're not signing Bogaerts.  Turner is staying with the Dodgers (he's not going anywhere).  

I think the best course of action is to retain Correa and FINALLY get something sustained and significant from our pitching pool of young flame throwers.  Mahle, Gray, Maeda, Ryan, Ober, Winder, is a decent starting point for a rotation next year.  Rather than throwing big money at a SP I'd rather retain that Gold Glove winning, clutch bat swinging SS for another 3-4 years.

  On 9/30/2022 at 11:06 AM, mikelink45 said:

I am sure that Dodgers are tired of paying David Price

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David Price was the cost to get Mookie Betts. They're thrilled to have Mookie Betts.

  On 9/30/2022 at 4:59 AM, Seth Stohs said:

Why the vitriol? He isn't doing or saying anything that wasn't expected. 

It's actually a really good analogy, very true. 

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I think the analogy is probably what draws the vitriol. 

I've never been into a Dior store, and neither have most people reading this story. A lot of Twins fans sitting at their breakfast tables in Brainerd or Roseau or Minneapolis may not even know what Dior is. Correa reciting a metaphor that involves paying thousands for a t-shirt or hundreds of thousands for a bracelet or whatever just comes across in poor taste. 

So I disagree with you and think - for Correa's image - it was a terrible analogy. When a player who is walking away from your team talks about going shopping at the Dior store, it doesn't do him any favors. 

Personally I like Correa and hope the Twins find a way to bring him back. Don't think they will, and it's a big loss for the organization. Big hole to fill. 

  On 9/30/2022 at 1:07 PM, Jeff D. said:

Keep Correa. The best SS we have had in decades.

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This is true. Carlos Correa just had the best season by a Twins SS since Roy Smalley in the late 1970s. He was worth every penny of his contract.