I've commented on this several times as well.  With the Marlins as a trade target, the Twins have both Garver and Jeffers who should be VERY interesting to Miami.  MLB Trade values currently has Garver at 18.1 and Jeffers at 27.9.  If the Twins are looking for someone like Sandy Alcantara it would take Jeffers and Larnach.  I'd do that.  If the Twins are willing to go for someone like former Golden Gopher Max Meyer (28.1) Jeffers in a one-for-one swap pretty much does it.  If the Twins want to go BIG and ask for Meyer AND Sixto Sanchez (9.5) then a little something extra would need to be added with Jeffers.  The thing is, Jeffers is a solid defensive catcher with power (14 HR's in under 300 PA's) whose younger with more years of team control.  The Marlins catching situation is a disaster and one they will need to address this off season.  Is Jeffers really worth more than Garver ?  I don't think so either, but it depends what the Marlins think.  With Rortvedt about a year away, I see the Twins dealing Jeffers and picking up a Jason Castro type for a backup.  The Marlins have an embarrassment of riches with young pitching and a black hole at catcher.  Larnach is just the type of young hitter a team desperate for offense should take a chance on.  I'd hate to part with Larnach, been a fan ever since I saw him get clutch hit after clutch hit in leading Oregon state to an NCAA baseball title.  But his value is much higher than Kepler's, so Kepler is worth more to the Twins at his currently depressed value, making Larnach available.  Maybe Max figures out what he needs to do to hit better, maybe not, but the Twins can't trade guys like Kepler or Buxton when their current value is so low.

I trade Jeffers to the Marlins in a package for young SP.

Totally agree with TopGun. You should be our GM.

33 minutes ago, TopGunn#22 said:

I've commented on this several times as well.  With the Marlins as a trade target, the Twins have both Garver and Jeffers who should be VERY interesting to Miami.  MLB Trade values currently has Garver at 18.1 and Jeffers at 27.9.  If the Twins are looking for someone like Sandy Alcantara it would take Jeffers and Larnach.  I'd do that.  If the Twins are willing to go for someone like former Golden Gopher Max Meyer (28.1) Jeffers in a one-for-one swap pretty much does it.  If the Twins want to go BIG and ask for Meyer AND Sixto Sanchez (9.5) then a little something extra would need to be added with Jeffers.  The thing is, Jeffers is a solid defensive catcher with power (14 HR's in under 300 PA's) whose younger with more years of team control.  The Marlins catching situation is a disaster and one they will need to address this off season.  Is Jeffers really worth more than Garver ?  I don't think so either, but it depends what the Marlins think.  With Rortvedt about a year away, I see the Twins dealing Jeffers and picking up a Jason Castro type for a backup.  The Marlins have an embarrassment of riches with young pitching and a black hole at catcher.  Larnach is just the type of young hitter a team desperate for offense should take a chance on.  I'd hate to part with Larnach, been a fan ever since I saw him get clutch hit after clutch hit in leading Oregon state to an NCAA baseball title.  But his value is much higher than Kepler's, so Kepler is worth more to the Twins at his currently depressed value, making Larnach available.  Maybe Max figures out what he needs to do to hit better, maybe not, but the Twins can't trade guys like Kepler or Buxton when their current value is so low.

I trade Jeffers to the Marlins in a package for young SP.

Jeffers is not as good a catcher as Astudillo but Willians got few chances this year, while Jeffers was continually chasing balls that go by him.

Garver is the best of the three and I would hazard a guess that other teams put a higher value on Garver than Jeffers. The hope is that the Twins are better next year, at least above .500 and hopefully in a dead heat for the AL Central lead. In order to improve the team needs starting pitching. Miami and Oakland seem to be two possible trade partners and I'm looking at Alcantar and Meyers from Miami and Montas or Bassitt from Oakland. The question is what do the other teams need and want. Garver, Larnach, Sands, + for Alcantara and Meyers? If the Twins can settle the Buxton contract, then Celestino or others to sweeten the deal? Miami fans are suggesting Lopez for Abrams and Campusino from San Diego. It all gets a little crazy as we play with who would benefit our Twins and what players would be attractive to another team from the Twins roster.

Garver is a good player and worth keeping, but at some point the Twins need to attempt to gain a pitcher. If Miami prefers Jeffers, who I believe will improve next year and beyond, then substitute Jeffers in the trade.

Lastly, Rortvedt is the best defensive catcher of the three and he can make some adjustments at the plate. He is a mighty strong dude and seems to want to crush everything. A little experience, manage the swing, and he can become a decent hitter, in my opinion.

I agree tony&rodney.  Rortvedt may need a solid year at AAA but he's a Twins catcher going forward either in late 2022 but certainly for 2023.  Myself, I value Garver more than Jeffers because of the offensive ability but until MLB Trade Values places more value on Garver, I'm trading Jeffers and Larnach for Alcantara.  Or Jeffers and Larnach for Max Meyer and Sixto Sanchez and Anthony Bender/Dylan Floro (potential closers).  And I agree with the A's as a potential trade partner but they don't need a catcher.  I could see Arraez and Canterino for Frankie Montas.  

With Carlos Rodon's "shoulder issues" and his less than stellar 2nd half, I'm cooling on him as a potential Twin FA signing.  I'm leaning more toward an Eduardo Rodriguez type.  4-years and $15 million per year could possibly work.  If the Twins added Ed-Rod via FA and acquired Alcantara and Montas their starting staff would be Alcantara, Montas, Ed-Rod, Ryan and Ober.  If they brought back Pineda that's a 6th guy and they could conceivably limit Ryan and Ober's innings.  Throw Dobnak into the mix and there's the makings of some "depth."  I think a rebuilt pitching staff like that could put the Twins in the mix in 2022.  And the division is not Dodgers, Giants, Padres strong.  We SHOULD be able to compete.  Each of Alcantara, Montas and Ed-Rod are YOUNG.  If Balazovic, Duran and others develop then you have true pitching depth.   

17 hours ago, RpR said:

Jeffers is not as good a catcher as Astudillo but Willians got few chances this year, while Jeffers was continually chasing balls that go by him.

are you just trolling in every thread now? Jeffers is a far superior defensive catcher by basically any possible metric, including the eye test. Astudillo got few chances at catcher this year because the Twins know he's not really any good back there. (Jeffers, even through his struggles, was a more valuable hitter at catcher as well)

Astudillo is a fun player and obviously a likable guy, but he's not any kind of solution at catcher and doesn't hit or defend enough to deserve a spot on the 40-man, let alone the MLB roster.

2 hours ago, TopGunn#22 said:

I agree with the A's as a potential trade partner but they don't need a catcher.  I could see Arraez and Canterino for Frankie Montas.  

 

Yes, I agree the A's are not interested in a catcher. They want infielders and sluggers. I'm not sure what to add to Arraez and Rooker, but would give Duffey, maybe Dobnak  and a minor leaguer like Steer or Cavaco.

The idea we agree on - add pitching. I looked at the trade value site months ago but while it has some value the GM's almost certainly have totally different views on players. Garver is the perfect example. While I really think Jeffers will improve, Garver is clearly a better player for now and the next two to three years. The Twins could strike early with a few trades like what we hope to see and even overpay if necessary to complete the deals.

Buxton's contract, however, is a key and may put a hold on things. I'm afraid if the Twins need to trade Byron that they might find it difficult to return the value they need from losing his talent. The Twins would need to allow teams an opportunity to talk contract with BB to increase his value. Hopefully the Twins are on this right now because getting resolution is not too important for the player but is crucial for the team.

Jeffers was a rookie in 2021 as he had only 55 at bats in 2020. He never played at the triple A season before this year when he made a total of 103 plate appearances. It was worth noting that Jeffers started 77 games at catcher for the Twins this year, more than Garver has started in any season at any level. Hopefully in 2022 he won't suffer a sophomore slump. This may be why he is rated higher than Garver.

Both Atlanta and San Diego would be interested in Garver. Seattle might also want him.

Honestly, the number of teams interested in a good defensive catcher who can OPS .900 is pretty long. There's a reason a 28 year old Realmuto got 5 years and $115MM.

Garver has the same issue as Buxton right now, missing half the year all the time. He just needs to put together 2 qualified seasons, keep playing like he has and Garver will be in line for a six figure deal.

On 10/14/2021 at 2:00 PM, DJL44 said:

Both Atlanta and San Diego would be interested in Garver. Seattle might also want him.

Yes, but how interested? Ian Anderson interested? C. J. Abrams interested? 

Thanks for the discussion guys! Like most of you, I think Garver is worth more to the Twins than he is to another team at the moment because Rortvedt isn't ready. Jeffers is younger, more team control, higher defensive upside. Basically if we trade Garver, they get him this year and then he hits free agency. I like (which means hate) the idea of a Larnach/Jeffers deal - I could see some bites for that. I think we'll see Arraez get some trade queries this offseason too, and as much as I'd hate to see him go, we need a pitcher. 

19 hours ago, the_neds said:

 if we trade Garver, they get him this year and then he hits free agency.

No, it's two full seasons until Garver qualifies for free agency