ewen21

I cannot get around the fact that we have lost the last 13 games we've played against them in the playoffs. For that reason color me a hardened skeptic

Circumstances dictate actions. If we are playing Wrigley you want him playing the same way? He might die if he didn't learn to adapt. I don't like the idea that he doesn't need to change. What he is right now really isn't all that impactful. He's played in about 40% of the games over the last two seasons. Playing the way he has resulted in 115 games in two seasons isn't the ticket. Not for a guy who was 24 and 25 years old during those seasons.

The real numbers on Buxton for me are as follows: 46 92 140 28 87 Those would be the number of games he's played each season with the Twins. We can throw away the first one since he was called in June that season, but the last two are like big red flags. To call to question his style of play and inability to stay on the field because he keeps crashing into things (walls mostly) is no longer anything that can be called "negativity" I wholeheartedly disagree with anyone who feels "he has to play this way". No he does not have to play the field like he has and YES he needs to absolutely modify his game. Just as Eddie Rosario needs to learn how to take more professional at bats, Buxton needs to learn how to keep himself on the field. I think there was a tendency here to act as if he were more than human. He isn't. He is made of the same things we all are and this idea that he needs to change nothing because he is so awesome really makes no sense to me. None. He provides no value to us now and it is the by-product of him (once again) crashing into a wall.

With all due respect to Bert and Kaat, no way can Berrios perform like that. Pitchers today simply cannot go as deep into games and I believe it has a lot to do with the reality that there is no way a pitcher can keep their muscles loose to pitch for much over two hours. Games are so damn long now and the human body just isn't made to go deep in today's game. The average length of a ballgame today as compared to the 1970s is forty minutes longer. I think we hit a tipping point a while back. Not only that you have a guy like Berrios who works out like crazy, but does he really do the proper working out? Food for thought

This was the kind of thing discussed in the thread about Rosario posted last week. As much as I have liked Eddie (I would take him over Buxton any day), he has things to work on and he provided. This is the kind of at bat that should give him very low marks in plate discipline. If the coaches are worth their salt they must address this kind of thing.

Yes and I really only had seven channels because 1 through 13 didn't broadcast something on every single number. Channels 1,3, 6, 8, 10 and 12 were nothing but static and if you could find something on the UHF dial good luck. I also remember being at my cousins house one summer night. He, my brother and I were outside playing with walkie-talkies and my uncle came out to tell us to stop because he could not watch TV. Apparently what we were saying was getting broadcasted over the channel he was watching. This had to be sometime around 1974/1975 the changes that occurred between those years and say 1982/1983 are unbelievable when I think about it.

Ahh. Class Clown. I remember having that in vinyl back in the day. He amended the list to include dozens of words and phrases. Put me down for that.

You're such a Kidder

This right here is what I am talking about. I think almost every avid Twins fan I know feels this way. And I wouldn't call this "complaining" I don't get this "we must be positive" stuff. We are in first place and it's a beautiful thing. There are always things to improve. That's how I view things in my own life and I don't view it as being "negative" Quite the contrary

What? Are we only to discuss the shiny happy things and leave it at that? Rosario is a good player and the original poster would acknowledge that, but why shouldn't he learn to go up there with a plan sometimes? What exactly is did the original poster say that was out of hand? I don't see this kind of analysis as "complaining". It is a discussion about a good player who can be a little better if he sharpened up a few things. The assessment offered by the original poster was accurate and fair so I am not sure what the problem is

It's often worse. Look. I think the guy is actually a good pitcher. I have to qualify these comments with that, but like you say the pitch count thing is hard to take. He pitches at such a slow pace sometimes, too. It is just so darn hard watching him sometimes. He could give up a run in five innings, but if he is on pitch 100 as he walks off the mound after five innings that isn't a successful outing to me.

I agree and furthermore... Why are we itching to extend Buxton? Is it because of his potential? How long do we talk about potential while this guy keeps landing on the disabled list? In five seasons he has thus far played over 100 games once. Like you say, he has 4 more years to go until free agency so we have plenty of time. Quite frankly, I would have dealt him and Lewis for Noah Syndergaard if the Mets would have done it. I am afraid we are going to see a lot of what we are seeing now with Buxton. Over time, if he doesn't tweak his defensive approach to be more discerning and responsible, this will only get worse. This is not me being negative. It is a realistic forecast. No less realistic than the "positive" forecasts people feel must be made. I wouldn't bet on him long term. It is tough to say that but I cannot ignore the red flags

I would rather PM you than carry on a sidebar discussion with you here. You OK with that?

Love Kaat, but he turns 81 in November

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=miTnvbvrjxY

I certainly have noticed that and the other day he just didn't look right

I am not doing an analysis it was a cautionary statement. How long do we extend out the timeline for potential? That is the question.

We won't find that out, will we? There is the trouble I have with Buxton with all these injuries, mishaps and setbacks. His main talent is speed. He isn't above average anywhere else. He was billed as a five tool guy and he is missing two very important tools. You know, Alex Ochoa was supposed to be a five tool player...….. When we start talking about what we hope for and what could have happened it concerns me. Am I wrong to be concerned about this player?

Buxton's WAR this year (fangraphs) He has played in 81 games and has made 215 putouts. This falls in line with historical data of EVERY centerfielder in baseball during the modern era. For all the great plays he makes we really need to stop assuming ONLY BUXTON can make that play. Lots of players can make many of the great plays he makes and that makes just a fraction of his web gems that are unique to him. I am not discounting defense. I am just trying to understand how anything can think the W-L record is attributable to his glove. We try to have serious conversations here. How does this pass for serious?

I just looked up Buxton's fielding record. In games where he recorded two putouts or less the Twins have been 29-12, 16-9 when he has one put out or less and 6-3 when he didn't make a single putout. That said, I want him out there because he makes us better defensively. HOWEVER, it serves to illustrate how talk of his glove meaning THAT much to the record the Twins have when he plays isn't a good measure of how much he means to the team. He is an important player, but in my opinion Nelson Cruz has meant more to this team than Buxton has this year and he doesn't even own a glove. His bat and his professionalism makes him valuable Defense matters a lot so I cannot be labeled as someone who doesn't care about defense. The problem I have here is with the analysis. Ted Williams never got to a World Series. Dan Marino never won anything. Mike Trout never won anything. In fact the Angels are 6-3 without him this year and 58-69 with him. What does that mean? What are we supposed to glean from that? Buxton wins us maybe two or three games a year with his glove. There are a few other CFs in baseball who do that as well. He has a great glove, no doubt....but let's not act like his glove cures cancer.

Zevon had a small section in Hunter Thompson's last book. Apparently those two vibed and were ocassional drinking buddies

Odorizzi has been frustrating. He's actually a good pitcher, but he is up to 100 pitches in the 5th inning most of the time and we can't live with that. It's the kind of thing that kills bullpens

Send lawyers guns and money

There is your problem right there. Why subject yourself to a Glen Perkins podcast? I mean really

According to FanGraphs, Buxton has 10 defensive runs saved in 686 innings. Breaking that down further it amounts to one run saved every 68.8 innings. Even if plays everyday that isn't even a run a week. I am not saying he isn't a super-talented centerfielder. What I am saying is one man in centerfield just doesn't get a whole lot of opportunities to make a difference. As I said earlier, historical data says that centerfielders make just under 3 putouts a game on average. For him be able to make the kind of impact you're talking about balls would need to be hit to miniscule zones on the field where Byron Buxton can make catches most other centerfielders cannot. That isn't anything that can be controlled and it isn't anything that happens with regularity