I can agree with much of what you say, until this: I have to take exception to this statement. Here is what bothers me and a lot of people about the current "Gardy has nothing to work with" train of thought -- the flipside of the "no manager can win with this team" argument is "no manager could have lost with the earlier teams" and if we had a WS Ring in there, I think this whole debate would look different. Here is what we had in the 2000s, not to mention some weak AL Central competition most of those years: - Joe Mauer, 3 batting titles and 3 Gold Gloves - Justin Morneau, MVP 2006, - Mauer, MVP 2009 - Johan Santana, Cy Young 2004, 2006, - Joe Nathan 260 saves in 7 seasons - Torii Hunter, perennial gold glove Ex-Twin Honor roll: - Matt Garza, Delmon Young, ALCS MVPs - RA Dickey, 2012 Cy Young Michael Cuddyer, 2013 NL batting champ (let's hope!)