kab21

I also took the riskier higher upside Cuban. All of my favorites disappeared and it came down to him and Seager.

The problem is that a 6 man rotation almost certainly means that the team would have 13 pitchers on the team. The bullpen isn't going to be used less and if you are concerned about injuries then you shouldn't be randomly using any of these pitchers out of the bullpen. Pick 5 starters and have Gibson/Harden ready to go in AAA.

I'll disagree on the RP'ers. Wasting money is when you start signing mediocre arms for 5M/yr in the bullpen. Getting average bullpen arms for 2M is a great value regardless if you are a rebuilding or competitive team. Burton's trade value is greater on a reasonable 2 yr contract (w/ option) than if he's a pending FA at the deadline. The only way that this is money wasted is if Burton blows out his arm next season. The Frasor equation is even simpler. Frasor (as a Twin) has more trade value than not signing anyone and keeping the money. The kids will have plenty of chances to pitch in the bullpen.

Actually it's not the thread but the posters that overdo it. I would like to add a guy like Frasor even if it was a 2/4M deal but there's no reason to act like it's the end of the world. You can tell when they are just blowing off steam when they start minimizing guys like Worley and May. These aren't great players but that was an outstanding trade even if it didn't fill org needs.

Complaining about complainers... I think Frasor would have been an excellent signing for the Twins. This is obviously a case where a team like the Twins would have to offer more money but he would be a good deal even at 2/4. You see a lot of very avg RP'ers getting 5+M (hello Capps) but being able to get a good 7th/8th inning guy for 2M (or less) is a pretty good deal and there isn't a lot of depth in the bullpen particularly if the Twins can make a nice deadline deal for Perkins or Burton.

I like the trade for Psuedo due to Avila and the #1 pick. However Lincecum could make this a huge win for Dave. After the Perkins trade I'm back to +1 MLB'ers. I'll probably shop Bass/TWood although each could be a solid starter.

I've thought for awhile that a big reason for his recent struggles was lack of strength and conditioning work in the offseason. This is one reason that you only trade Morneau now if you get something good for him. The money isn't important since the Twins won't spend it anyway.

Sale > CC - even with injury concerns 23 > 32 I actually am happy with all of the deals also. I gave up some good prospects but I got back some well above average currently good players that aren't old. I remember the Votto trade from 3 yrs ago. I'm still waiting for JMontero and Drabek to become good players. Perhaps I traded away a stud but whatever. I've also moved enough guys that I won't have any tough cuts. I got Sale Weeks - I never thought I would have owned him Pablo Harvey I gave up 4 stud prospects Sano Skaggs Myers Bogaerts and some good but not great prospects Arcia - he could be better than all of the above though Heredia Ventura Odor Alonso Erlin hendricks

I think it's even more absurd to have home and away batting practice hats.

Actually your point and others in this thread was that the Tigers were going to get bad fast. We've been expecting that for several years and they are still very good. It's not going to happen as fast as you think unless they lose Verlander and MCab in back to back offseasons but that would kill most teams. I countered with the discussions from the last 5 years that we've been having about the White Sox inevitable collapse and they've managed to win 88 and 89 games in recent seasons (conveniently below your 90 win mark). While I agree about the White Sox and Indians I would certainly trade places with Detroit.

I think you need to review all of those high picks that they were drafting when they were terrible. Pretty much the only high pick that turned out was Verlander and they were able to trade two others for the right to give MCab a Johan type extension. I also strongly dislike everything the Sox have done building their but they haven't collapsed and despite having horrible farm systems for years they have produced some good players.

I just pulled off my 3rd big move in the last 6 months to complete the destruction of my farm system. I still have a few prospects but it's getting thin compared to usual.

The point wasn't that Chicago has been great but rather that they haven't crashed (like the Twins) despite having awful farm systems. We've been expecting them to crash for as long as I remember. We've also been expecting the Tigers to crash for several years now and we're still waiting. Other than Verlander the Tigers didn't hit on any early picks in the 2000's so that's not why they were good.

luck? Those teams had a good core and they knew when to throw their chips in and they got lucky. they tried a similar approach last year signing a bunch of vets and their team crashed and burned. That was their occasional go for it and now they are in terrible shape.

While I agree with what the Twins are doing long term it should be pointed out that the White Sox have consistently had one of the lowest ranked farm systems in baseball. I've expected this crash for a long time and yet they have continued to be competitive and have even turned out a few homegrown players during that time. The Tigers have also had weak farm systems for a long time and they haven't crashed either but they have had a stronger MLB core.

Teams get rid of aging veterans and try to limit signing aging veterans when they rebuild. That's why payroll goes down. It sucks that the Twins are bad but going nuts in FA isn't going to turn this team into a contender unless you go nuts like the Dodgers.

I dropped Carlos Martinez for the 5 player draft when he was unknown. I thought I could pick him up again later but one person knew who he was.

I really don't understand this infatuation that so many have with Brandon Mccarthy. He wasn't very good before he went Oakland, he's pitched >120innings once in his career and he suffered a devastating injury last season and it wouldn't be shocking if he wasn't effective again. The only argument is that he's likely better than Correia (I don't like Correia at all). The same goes for Blanton and Saunders. All you're doing is complaining about which mediocre starter the Twins picked up. The Twins probably picked the wrong one but none of them are that good so it's not a surprise that they chose the cheapest one. I think Neal slightly missed with the article when it should be noting that the Twins won't overpay for average pitchers like Edwin Jackson since he got 52M and he isn't that impressive other than he throws hard and is durable.

You're not raising payroll by going after <5M/yr guys. All signing those guys would do is reshuffle Correia and Pelfrey out of the backend (neither of which that I really like). If you want to raise payroll which is your complaint then you have to sign the high dollar guys. If I had my preference I would pick Dempster because if that contract doesn't work out then at least it's gone in two years. My first preference is Marcum though since indications are that he's not going to get more than 3 yrs and it won't be much above 10-12M/yr.

I think it's awesome how people complain that the Twins don't spend enough in one thread and then complain about how ridiculous a player's new contract is in another. I'm completely unimpressed with Corriea and Pelfrey and would have liked other relatively cheap options but there weren't many good options available and they got a lot of money. Here are the 10+M/yr FA's off the top of my head. there's spending and there's spending only for the sake of spending. Marcum - ? Guthrie - 3/25 - almost 10M/yr and he's not that good Dempster - 2/26.5 Jackson - 4/52 Sanchez 5/80 Greinke - 6/147.5 Haren obviously signed a below market one year contract with a team of his choice so he wasn't an option unless of the Twins traded for his option with the Angels.

This is at least one good thing about not signing anyone this offseason. Go nuts on this signing JR.

I would be 100% for trading Willingham for a very good pitching prospect and signing Swisher. It's not a great contract but he seems like a guy that will age relatively well and I think the contract will hurt less than many of the pitchers that some wanted the Twins to sign.

The Cubs have put together an alright rotation since Garza and Samardzija are better than anything the Twins have. I also like the Baker and Villanueva moves a lot more than Corriea and Pelfrey. All the Twins have is Diamond and Gibson imo. But the Cubs lineup is awful. their offense consists of Soriano, Castro, Rizzo, Dejesus and an ugly mess. Perhaps they have a shot at 80 wins but they still have a long way to go.

The Twins getting a stadium isn't much different from all of the deals that are made to attract big businesses (like cheap land or major infrastructure improvements). The Twins just have more visibility. I've said it in another thread but I don't really have a problem with what the Marlins did. They were terrible and they got rid of two BIG contracts and a guy that was a FA in a year. Some dismiss the prospects that they got back but there are a couple top 100 prospects in the deal. It sucks that it happened a year after the Marlins opened a new stadium but most of that is due the Marlins having no plan. They just signed those two BIG contracts last season due to opening the new stadium.

Most sites have ranked May with Gibson, Berrios and Kepler and these prospects are barely cracking top 100's. I have no problem with your one quibble. i agree. People have focused so much on the pitching issue that they ignore the MI/C (and potentially even 3B) lack of depth. I also think they overestimate the strength of the OF'ers and 1Bman in the system. The Twins have Hicks, Arcia and Parmelee (and maybe Benson) that are close to the majors. The next group Buxton and Kepler were in rk ball last year and are probably 3+ yrs away. Trading a guy like Arcia puts the OF in a pretty scary situation for awhile imo.