Crackedfungo

The 'sign or trade for an Ace' narrative is REALLY tired. Robbie Ray was proposed (fail), the Ryu/Toronto was another (fail), Bumgarner (fail), DeGrom (fail 2022 and TBD). In the past, it was Darvish (fail for several years), and there have been others. In short, you need to grow your own (draft) or be very lucky in terms of foresight in a simple trade. Your odds are better in drafting your own Ace if you take chance with more high draft picks to try (which they Twins rarely do at present). I would try this year with the #5 - they have many young hitting prospects, and there should be 1 of the 3 best college pitchers, or the best HS pitcher available at that spot; rinse and repeat until you have one. Otherwise, spend whatever it takes on scouting and pitcher development. Any other route generally fails (barring 1-2 years of success), and is VERY expensive - assuming a premier Ace will even sign in MN.

What this means (if serious injuries are avoided) is some trades and a NEED to focus on one of the Top 2 pitchers in the Draft this year, and going forward. This wish for signing an ACE is NOT going to happen. We are not a destination, and the best WILL NOT come here. We need to grow our own by any means necessary.

I S H.....No thanks to any and all. We aren't a rest home for the washed up and "never were's"

Pretty simple. We are NOT getting a top ACE in free agency to come to MN....period. So, the route they have taken, some 2nd-3rd tier options like a Gray, or trading from surplus for prospective 2s (but mostly 3s or 4s) is the only small market path that is realistic. Beyond that, they absolutely MUST develop their next Johan Santana and learn how to manage this type pitcher, and all other types to maximize results. To that end, I agree with another thread that an ACE would never be enticed to be managed by Baldelli, nor compelled to sign with the Twins. So, we are left with trading for a gem (Santana) and/or developing them.....Why was that really that so confusing? Moreover, the more we keep throwing older, previously accomplished pitchers in the way, the less opportunity we will have to see what we have from the minors. (As an example from the RPs: Where would Duran be with Taylor Rogers still gobbling up innings? I said in April on this site that Duran would have better numbers than Rogers by the end of the year, and I do believe Rogers leaving, the injury to Alcala, and the removal of last years riff-raff is the only reason Duran was provided an early opportunity that he maximized). I would like to see several of the young SPs get some time up in the next 3 years to see what they have (more so than I would support rolling the dice on a Cueto - even for 1-2 seasons - this team is not championship quality). BTW: In another league (AL vs NL), and on the Twins (with their archaic handling of pitching), I am not sure Rodon or Cueto has the same year. There are simply different variables (and climate) at play during the year, which may cause a very different result. You cannot equate performance in one place at a point in time, with another, as if it is a SURE THING. It is just speculative....Lastly, if you keep stabbing for an ACE every year (or every other), you end up with many albatross contracts that prevent you from signing another prospective ACE, or your own core in a small market. That does not ever enter the thought process of the rubes beating the drum for signing a Top SP after every season; but is a very real consideration.

For those thinking that I am going to jump on the free agent or trade train for SP.....I am NOT. Everyone on the board was clamoring for new 'proven' pitchers (by trade or free agency). In fact, Frankie Montas was on the top of many's list for a trade. Take a look at his performance since the trade, and the MRI now being run on his shoulder; sounds like Mahle, or a lesser outcome than Paddack is possible. While Luis Castillo has panned out, clearly Motas has not (nor has Mahle BTW). Moreover, when many on the board were screaming for Stroman (and others) in FA over the past two offseasons, the outcomes on each of these 'high value' targets has been mixed (to poor) at best. Rodan for next year - nothing but a crap shoot in terms of repeat performance for high $$$ - and a history of injuries. Verlander and other 'sure things' are just never going to happen, as we aren't a 'destination' for these rare SPs. Also, with all the 'attempts' as I will refer to them this year; Gray, Paddack, and Mahle (by FA or Trade), I don't think outcomes are near as predictable as many believe (we are 1/3 here so far). In fact, I would guess 50/50% for SP in the 2nd tier (non-'Ace', Cole Verlander, Kershaw) on performing to contract and expectations. In short, this necessitates the need for Twins management to develop a steady stream of their own annually, and find a solid #2-4 every 1-2 years (and hope for some 'luck'). Additionally, it requires the team to better manage injuries and learn how to manage SP......which we are horrendously poor at doing. Outside of Santana, and Liriano for 6 months, I don't recall an ACE ever pitching for the Twins (and none have every signed here in almost 60 years). So, can we stop with the fantasy every year that consists of us signing a top 10 ACE? It is just ridiculous, and NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. Feel free to FIRE AWAY.....

Embarrassing pitching performance by Leone. At least throw a fricken ball over the plate, but I am sure the Twins will take it?

Too bad the Giants burned their best reliever in the 9th....now finish this

He is D F A fodder on any decent playoff contender. He has had more chances with the Twins than a 'woman of the night' in Vegas with a hammered group at a bachelors party

Smart play by Correa.....That's why you want a top notch SS

Any sign that MLB will ditch the runner at second in extra innings nonsense? It is the STUPIDEST change to the game that they could have possibly made. Bastardized Baseball

Shocked that Cave delivered....He and his sub .200 and sub .600 OPS. Glad it worked, but the decision to have him bat in the playoff stretch run is asinine.

I hope we have heard the last of the whining about Rogers. He is NOT the pitcher anyone thinks he is anymore. He looks great in stretches, but begins to put together really bad streaks. I said at the start of the year that Duran would outperform Rogers, and half-way through, I was correct. Move on from Rogers. We weren't going to sign him and got what we could for him (with a few years to see if that was a good/bad/abysmal return).

That's why you don't wait until they have burned many bullets in the minors and growing gray whiskers before bringing them up (as was the case in the past)?

Duran looks like he is playing 'catch' because he is. He barely grunts when dealing; straight at 102, or filthy at 96. He is a STAR in the making.

DURAN looks like he is THE Closer we have looked for over the last several years. Home Grown, and virtually unhittable (when he is ON). Just filthy stuff. His health is my only concern., He is an ALPHA on the mound, with the stuff to match

I know Jr Babe Ruth players that wouldn't butcher two plays like Araez and Garlick (just DFA him already) did. Trashed what would have been a solid inning for Duran, whose stuff is just FILTHY in every inning, and is worth a ticket just to watch.

Liriano rookie year type STUFF (and throws harder). Can he put together a year like Liriano and avoid injury......This will be the KEY

IMHO; it is NOT time to add a bunch of additional pitchers. Too many P are pushing the 40 man. Either sign/trade for someone who can be a marginal #1, or go young with what you have. I would also trade Donaldson, Garver, and Kepler (you won't get much for Arraez). These 3 are not going to be a meaningful part of the next wave (Donaldson), are blocking someone (Donaldson, and Kepler), and you don't have enough room for 3 catchers (Garver, Jeffers, Rortvedt - who won't hit in the majors) that need to play more than the current split allows (and it crowds the DH and 1B opportunities for other players). Baldelli also needs to quit running a 'rest home' every week, as well - we have had just as many injuries as everyone else - it ain't working, and those Sunday lineups with players playing out of position and Tortuga across the diamond are just embarrassing and a give-up of too many games.

The Experience lives on. About as hot as you can get. 11th straight game with a hit. 2-3 now with 3 run HR. Twins made a mistake here.

Rosario now 2-3 tonight with a 3 run HR. How hot is hot?!?

Astudillo is a glorified pinch hitter. I would rather have BR in that spot - he IS 26. Astudillo is BAD at all positions. He is becoming this Mgmt Teams version of Punto - e.g. no business being on the roster and the ultimate low-talent 'dirty jersey' player. Name me 20 other teams that would waste time on these type of guys with the logjam or prospects we have behind them?!? I didn't think so.....

So....We were SO ready to move up AK, BR, and TL that we went with Kyle Garlick in LF versus Rosario for another year!?! This will bite us in the a$$ at some point - either by wasting time on Garlick, having Rosario beat us in games, or in having even more Rule 5 challenges upcoming without knowing what we have (and behind AK, BR, and TL - see Badoo now gone). Logjams at Triple AAA and MLB have a trickle-down impact. I am not surprised that AK, BR and TL did not TAKE the job this Spring. They basically had ALL of last year off in terms of games. Garlick and Astudillo are wasted roster spots and just create logjams. If you are moving on from Rosario; go with the rookies that you moved him out for. SMH

I think this is just idiocy. Bauer is NOT going to come here without another debilitating contract like Donaldson. He is also a major HEAD CASE. Rosario and Sano have their faults, but to get rid of them both for a prospect or two (that has also missed a year of development) and expect that the add of Bauer will improve our regular season and playoff record over what it is (while starting every 5th day) is just daft. Also, why would you go all 'youth movement' at core everyday positions and WISH for the best, but not bring up a talented 5th started like Duran, and save the later years Bauer money to keep some of the now/future core, when Duran can only impact you negatively every 5th day (versus the rookie regulars almost every day). This, to me, is simple. You have 3 solid starters. You sign a lower priced 'prove it' pitcher like a Teheran, and allow Duran and Dobnak to compete for the last two rotation spots. You also have a very impressive line-up that struggles with injury (Donaldson), or playoff performance - take your pick from: Kepler, Polanco, Rosario, Sano, Buxton, Garver, etal. Which one or two of these players performed the past two years in the playoffs? I would argue that Kepler has performed the worst. Yet, he seems untouchable in all these discussions, and I am not convinced you wouldn't get more back for him (than Sano or Rosario - and I would not give up Rosario for nothing like a DFA, as he is an asset). I would still give the core one more year, or consider trading Kepler and using some of the $ for a tender to Rosario, keeping this asset until it pans out or we can unload it later when it has value (once the 2021 prospective impact is known or experienced). I would also lose Gonzalez, Adrianza, Cave,Avila, Bailey, Hill, Romo, Clippard, and May (he wants out), and go in-house to replace them. I would re-up the rest, and sit/trade from among Rosario, Sano, and Polanco the minute their performance is off in 2021 before trade deadline (with Lewis, Kiri, Rooker, and Larnach filling Adrianza/Gonzalez, Donaldson's, Cave, and Lamont's spots and ready to take over full-time the minute one is not meeting expectations). ......FIRE AWAY at my suggestions, but at least they are realistic. We also NEED to bring along a young starter or two next year that will be relied upon in 2022 (and I don't believe this will be from among Smeltzer, Thorpe, or even Dobnak).

This is idiocy. You don't just cut loose your best hitter for a slight power drought month in this strange year. I love the prospects in the pipeline, but other than Rooker, neither AK or TL has 'earned their way' out of AA (and even AAA). I would bring them up for an injury. I might event bring them up to replace a Kepler or Rosario (if one were traded). What I would NOT do, is not re-sign Nelson, thinking we need to find room from all three of these players next year.

The one I am very intrigued by not mentioned much here is Alcala. He has the stuff, and is developing the control and confidence. That trade looks much better as he develops. I like his focus and fire too - necessary as a closer. Could he produce in a big game against the Yankees? Time will tell, but he has the stuff. I think we lose May after this year. I think Rogers rebounds, and Alcala becomes a RH force if he maintains command/control. I do want to see Colina and Chalmers (if he improves control soon). Colina has high-end gas, and Chalmers has an almost unhittable couple of pitches IF he has control. His BBs are well-known, but his BAA is just sick at times. Future is not dim if we lose a few of our mainstays.