Twins Daily Roundtable: Closing Time

I’m with Jeremy on this one, the “closer” role needs to go the way of the dinosaurs.

IF I had a closer it would be May, no contest.

I just watched Hildy close the last game. Guess what he did...he kept the ball in his glove a little longer! Not only did he hide the ball better, it kept his package tighter, so he was delivering with a little more snap. Better zap on the heat, better deception on the change. He could close just like that.

 

Trevor May has the stuff to close, and I've suggested it before. If not May, I'd try Busenitz. He's got classic closer stuff - down plane heat, hard slider. If Booze can learn to spot corners, he be the man. Same with May. 

I like some of these ideas, the problem is we have a manager who subscribes to the theory that there must be a designated closer on the team and they must pitch in a save situation every single time. 

 

Some of the best closers were made by failed starters. Aguilera, Eckersley and Nathan come to mind (Smoltz too, but he was not a failed starter, just lost endurance after surgery).

 

We kinda know that the Twins do not have anyone in the pen who marginally flashes dominance (May excluded.)  Same with AAA.

 

So, what I would do, would be to see what Odorizzi can do as a closer just with the fastball and slider (both have scored pretty well) while dropping the "thing" and the curve that suck.  He is under contract for another season and clearly the Twins have better options in the minors (and majors) than him for 2019.  See if changing the role might change his effectiveness.

 

Alternate version of that:  Kohl Stewart.  Might even make more sense at this point, since his FB has ticked a tad higher than Odorizzi's.

I like the idea... Odorizzi could be a very good reliever and he's got the stuff to get a lot of K's in the 9th. At the moment I can see the team trying that out, though.

Gotta go Belisle with a three year extension.

Trevor May checks all of my boxes to be the closer, except, I doubt he currently is in a position to pitch two, or sometimes 3, days in a row. Busenitz is my second option.

To me, Pressly was the ideal candidate. Start an inning, blow people away, blow one every once in a while, but it happens. But he's gone now, unfortunately, and I get why.

 

Yes, the pen has changed, to some degree, in regard to high leverage situations vs the actual end of a game. But I don't believe the game has changed as much as some make it out to be. We talk about "cheap saves" when you have a couple run lead and maybe face the bottom of the order. But how can anyone predict that your closer will actually have a couple run lead, much less face the bottom of the order, or have to face a quality hitter, or two, off the bench?

 

I like Hildenberger a lot! So he's hit a rough patch of late. He's shown what he can do! A couple rough games or two can distort perspective and numbers for a RP, we all know that. But I like him better in the 7th or 8th because he brings such a different dynamic to what is presented.

 

I have argued in the past that a healthy May should absolutely be allowed to stretch himself out and build on what he showed previously before his pen move, and his ST in 2017 before TJ. I have changed my tune. Partially because of his stuff and potential, but also because May himself told the organization earlier this season that he felt more comfortable, while recovering, in the pen. And he excelled at Rochester and has done so in his SSS thus far back up. Long term, is he a closer or a top set-up man? I'm not certain.

 

Reed confounds the issue. Is he healthy? How come we suddenly get the low velocity, inconsistent Reed after having such a great career and track record before this season?

 

Sorry, hope I'm proven wrong, but I've lost faith in Duffey. Decent FB and killer curve who could maybe mix in another pitch here and there, but seems the curve inconsistency has left him. Busentiz, Reed and Curtiss need to be up ASAP! Hildenberger would be toiling still in AAA without opportunity. So let's let opportunity reside in the ML the next month or so and then make some off season decisions. Bullpen by committee to close things out, pun intended. Is it really so hard?

 

*Have to admit, NEVER saw Odorizzi as a closer option! Ever! But Danchat got me thinking...lower than ideal IP, but decent stuff and SO ability...especially since he "gets" the idea of the high strike with so many low ball, launch angle hitters today, might not be so crazy.

I'm getting really, really good at forgetting to respond to Cody. Oops!

 

Anyway, my answer to who should be the Twins closer... "Whoever."

 

It doesn't matter to me. I'm good with Hildenberger getting the first shot. Now that he's had saves in back-to-back games, if there is another save opportunity on Thursday, maybe I'd go with May, or Duffey, or Rogers... or Magill. Or, whoever. Later in September, could be Busenitz or Curtiss or Anderson or Reed... Or, whoever. It's good for all of them to get high-leverage spots at this point.

I would concur with the the idea of giving other pitchers a shot at the job, regardless of whether a Hildenberger had two games back to back or not. But does anyone really think the reigning MOY would do that? He is still in 7th game of the WS mode, managing for wins, not development.

I have never understood all the love for May. Yes he has good stuff no he has not blossomed in the major leagues yet. I know it's injury that has held him back but I want to see him longer before making a decision. I also really want to see some of the minor league relief pitchers get an opportunity. And I don't mean just one day up and then get sent back down.

 

I’m with Jeremy on this one, the “closer” role needs to go the way of the dinosaurs.

 

I see a lot of people are in May's corner for said role.  With his mix of pitches, I could see him being the extinguisher type that then goes on to pitch 1-2 more innings.  I hope Molitor can open up his mind on bullpen use.  Perhaps an offseason exercise of watching Milwaukee games would be of benefit.

 

Some of the best closers were made by failed starters. Aguilera, Eckersley and Nathan come to mind (Smoltz too, but he was not a failed starter, just lost endurance after surgery).

 

We kinda know that the Twins do not have anyone in the pen who marginally flashes dominance (May excluded.)  Same with AAA.

 

So, what I would do, would be to see what Odorizzi can do as a closer just with the fastball and slider (both have scored pretty well) while dropping the "thing" and the curve that suck.  He is under contract for another season and clearly the Twins have better options in the minors (and majors) than him for 2019.  See if changing the role might change his effectiveness.

 

Alternate version of that:  Kohl Stewart.  Might even make more sense at this point, since his FB has ticked a tad higher than Odorizzi's.

 

 

I see a lot of people are in May's corner for said role.  With his mix of pitches, I could see him being the extinguisher type that then goes on to pitch 1-2 more innings.  I hope Molitor can open up his mind on bullpen use.  Perhaps an offseason exercise of watching Milwaukee games would be of benefit.

 

Both of these. I'd like to see May in that fireman/stopper role, and I want the pitcher in that role to be able to go more than three outs.

 

Ideally, I also want my closer (or/and setup man) able to go more than three outs depending on matchups, and I think Odorizzi could work well in that role...although I have no idea how he'd pitch coming in with men on base.

 

Mejia might be an option for one of these roles, too, but I'd keep him as a starter until either he or a starter in the minors forces the issue. Still, would be nice to have three pitchers that could step into one of those roles so that no one gets overused in May, Odorizzi and Mejia.

 

Even if you moved Odorizzi and Mejia to the pen, and didn't make any trades or FA signings, you could still open 2019 with a rotation of:

 

Gibson

Berrios

Pineda

Romero

everyone else

 

I'd go hard after a #1 this offseason, but that's a different topic.

 

So to the topic at hand, I want my closer able to go more than an inning and want to see May, Odorizzi and possibly Mejia (when healthy) in high-leverage outings of more than three outs the remainder of the season to get an idea of how they'll slot into my pen next year, or who I might need to go after from outside the org over the offseason to fill those roles if the internal candidates aren't up to snuff.

I think a closer has to be the guy that has the mentality that he is going to "shut it down."  A great closer can shorten the game. Mariano Rivera came in and it was game over. So I don't believe a closer is "whomever."But guys like him are rare. 

 

I think the vote might come down to ....who is most likely to strike out the side in the 9th.  We don't have one of those guys on this roster. So it is like a rotation thing.... Ok, but we still need to look for that guy. 

 

I'd like to see some of the young guys come up... like Jake Reed. 

There are a lot of interesting ideas posted here.
For example, I'm far from the only one startled, but intrigued by the thought of Odor being turned into a reliever.
But--- nearly all of those intriguing options depend on having a Mgr who's open to trying these things- and that is NOT the guy in the Twinks' dugout. In the absence of Belisle (thank heaven), it already looks like he's settled on Hildy, and is just going to keep on keepin' on shoving the same pegs into the same holes til this woeful season ends- with no evidence generated about future pitching stocks for next year and beyond.
None, repeat, none of the above ideas are likely to happen with MoY in the dugout.

 

There are a lot of interesting ideas posted here.
For example, I'm far from the only one startled, but intrigued by the thought of Odor being turned into a reliever.
But--- nearly all of those intriguing options depend on having a Mgr who's open to trying these things- and that is NOT the guy in the Twinks' dugout. In the absence of Belisle (thank heaven), it already looks like he's settled on Hildy, and is just going to keep on keepin' on shoving the same pegs into the same holes til this woeful season ends- with no evidence generated about future pitching stocks for next year and beyond.
None, repeat, none of the above ideas are likely to happen with MoY in the dugout.

 

I feel you on this. And it's frustrating. So frustrating.

 

Use of 'openers' in the minors does give me some hope that changes in pen usage could, maybe, possibly be coming at the MLB level. If those changes ever do happen, though, they'll undoubtedly come as directives from the FO, not from Molitor.

The point isn't really if May can go out there two or three days yet, time will do that. The question is can he mentally handle the closer role. And there is something to that concern for any pitcher. The closer role may become passe, but there is a different stigma to giving up a walk off win in the ninth, than giving up the lead in the seventh or eighth. And some guys can't handle that. You dont have to pitch 3 days in a row to find that out.