A Case for Signing Yasmani Grandal

I'm on board. If (when?) the big money SPs go elsewhere the Twins will have plenty of money to spend on the lineup. To me Grandal (or another C) makes the most sense.

I could easily get behind this idea.......

Like Garver, but I think last year might be a one hit wonder year.  He'd be great to rotate in behind the plate and for late inning pop off the bench.  Maybe get him playing ist or DH.  Grandal is a big upgrade

No - concentrate on pitching, work with Astudillo, Jeffers, Rortvedt.  These are good hot stove topics, but what he will want takes him out of the platoon catcher discussion and no way do the Twins want to slow down Garver.  

Garver is actually getting to the age where many catchers drop off.  He hit is stride at an older age than most and my concern for the Twins is in 2 - 3 years.  Make sure the young catchers are ready.

Looks at most of the available catchers, and they are all on the wrong side of 30.  I would welcome a Grandal signing.  You could probably just let Cron walk, if that happened. A Garver, Grandal, Sano, Gonzalez, Adrianza rotation at 1B would be completely sufficient.

With that said, it needs to be an AND signing, not an OR signing.  The pitching upgrades must be paramount.

Sign Wheeler (let the pick go)

Trade for J Gray, Archer or M Gonzalez (if available)

Resign Odorizzi

Sign Grandal

The Twins would look well-stocked heading into 2020.

I would rather focus on pitching than throw insane money at a catcher. This move would make no sense other than it could get the Twins to move Garver to 1st. Why not same 12M a year and sign Martin Maldonado or Robinson Chirinos?

If the Twins devote any significant resources to acquiring a position player, I think catcher is the spot.

Jeffers and Rortvedt can not be counted on to be ready at any time this season. It just takes longer to develop as a catcher. Telis has been playing AAA since 2014. His AAA numbers the last two seasons have been good but those come with lots of experience at the level. I wouldn’t count on him as a reliable in any long stretch in the majors.

They need to focus on starting pitching but starting pitching plus Grandal would really help.

So, the Twins will splurge on a reason to play their second best hitter even less? Don’t know why anyone thinks Rocco is inclined to play catchers at first on their ‘off’ days..when he had the perfect opportunity to do so last year, and went out of his way to NOT do so. The ‘talk’ referred to of utilizing Garver at first more is coming from everywhere...except the Twins organization.

Given the other priorities, the only way I’d get behind this move would be if a full-time conversion to first base happened for Garver.

Grandal will be too expensive for a part-time player. Garver should get 120 games behind the plate if Delli plays him correctly, barring injury. Astudillo can easily cover the other 42 games. If an injury occurs both AAA catchers Telis and Sawyer who are 28 years old should be able to be backups. That being said the Twins will likely go out and sign a Drew Butera type to be their 3rd string catcher.

This speaks to me as a similar discussion in the Rondon OP. Strengthening what you already have is not a bad idea.

But the Twins have something pretty nice in Garver. I would much rather pay for Castro to be back at half the price, at least, and worry about growth and depth elsewhere.

Price shouldnt be an issue. If you guess that Grandel gets 20mil a yr, and we sign him instead of cron, then you are basically not paying Cron 8 mil and your not signing Castro back at 6 mil a yr. So you are looking at upgrading to Grandel at the cost of 6 mil for next yr. Not sure of future years but for next year? I would be a fan. Plus, the roster flexibility would be incredible. Assuming Willians is the 26th man we would have

3 players for catcher

6 for first base

4 for second base

2 for ss

4 for third base

4 for left

3 for center

3 for right

4 for DH

Essentially the only position player tied to a single position would be cruz at DH. You could make the argument Polonco could only play short but I would be surprised not to see him at second base at all

He was minor league player of the year, and hit at every level. Why don't people believe he can hit?

Did not say he couldn't hit, but it is entirely possible that last year turns out to be his best year.  He looked so exposed in the playoffs and his home run rate spiked massively last year.  Power is his main strength as he doesn't particularly hit for average.

Just saying I do not expect him to hit home runs at such a ridiculous rate.  Maybe you do and that I just swell

I'll pass.  Garver beat out Castro with his bat. Castro is still welcome back, but in a diminished role and I think he will look for a starting gig elsewhere. That puts Astud as the prime back up. OK, sure. We could live with that and really, do we want to spend $20 million on a part time player? Methinks we can use that to get a starter on the mound. That is our priority.

If you think about the games where Garver gets rested, Astud fills in.  Beyond that we need maybe 10 additional starts from a catcher, barring injury.  We can call up someone for that or give one of our top prospects a call up for a couple games. We could get by with that and/or signing a defense first catcher for the days Garver rests and Astud gets a break too.  Butera where are you?  But seriously.  That is too much for a part time player. Think of it this way, $20 million for a guy that plays maybe 60 games --, graded on a scale -- is like paying $30- 40 million for Cole or Strass.  I'd rather have one of them because it means more to the W-L record and playoff chances

Please stop playing semantics here, Mike.  I said "last year might be a one hit wonder"

Last year was the first year he was a reasonably effective one and he turns 29 in January.  Grandal is only a year and a little more than a month older and he has accomplished a lot more as a catcher AND he can hit for power as well.  A seasoned catcher can do more for our pitching staff than you or I can even quantify right now.

I love my offense, but one place I sacrifice a little would be at the catcher position.

Stop trying to play AH HA with me.  I am not by any stretch of the imagination disparaging Garver, nor do I think we should simply discard him.  I am interested in having a solid, established catcher.  Grandal fits the bill

I'll pass.  Garver beat out Castro with his bat. Castro is still welcome back, but in a diminished role and I think he will look for a starting gig elsewhere. That puts Astud as the prime back up. OK, sure. We could live with that and really, do we want to spend $20 million on a part time player? Methinks we can use that to get a starter on the mound. That is our priority.

 

If you think about the games where Garver gets rested, Astud fills in.  Beyond that we need maybe 10 additional starts from a catcher, barring injury.  We can call up someone for that or give one of our top prospects a call up for a couple games. We could get by with that and/or signing a defense first catcher for the days Garver rests and Astud gets a break too.  Butera where are you?  But seriously.  That is too much for a part time player. Think of it this way, $20 million for a guy that plays maybe 60 games --, graded on a scale -- is like paying $30- 40 million for Cole or Strass.  I'd rather have one of them because it means more to the W-L record and playoff chances

Thank you. Well stated. Well reasoned.

I'm sorry, but I guess when I read "might be one hit wonder".....that implies to me that you don't think he's going to play well next year. So, I'll ask, which is it?

 

do you think he's going to be above average at catcher, or not? 

 

One of the best things I learned in communications is that message sent, is not necessarily message received. Clearly, I received your message as doubting Garver. Nothing more or less, no "gotcha" or anything on my part.

I do not know what to expect from Garver in 2020 so he could very well be a one hit wonder.  He's a 28 year old that arrived last year and then suddenly this past season he hits four times as many home runs.  It would be rather silly for me to expect that his first real season (his 28 year old season) to be repeated because he has no history as a major leaguer apart from last year.  We have to be careful assessing last season as the norm for him

I respect you for allowing me to clarify.  YOu will notice in my first post I said I like him so I was not disparaging him.  I am just unsure about what he really is.

Grandal is not going to take a backup catcher role... mute point. Twins will use in house guy or find a career backup that provides good defense. Don't overthink the room. 

If they even sniff at Grandal, the faith Falvine has earned since their arrival will start to erode. This implication that this would even be something to be considered this offseason given the price tag that he's sure to command with 4/5 of a rotation needing to be filled would be irresponsible at best and bordering on silliness.