How Does the Twins Outfield Get Sorted?

[PatPfund]

Celestino really isn't a tough one to figure out. He was jumped over AAA for emergency reasons, and he plays like it, so send him to AAA and find out if he can develop. If somebody asks for him in a trade, and you can get a useful return, sprain ankles jumping on it, but I'm not holding my breath. (Gallo and Kepler can both play better defense to backup Buxton.)

Kepler has little trade value, plays great defense, and really isn't worse offensively than most of the OFs mentioned here (low bar until the youngsters prove something). I'd rather have most of the youth (other than Gordon and a healthy Kirilloff, if he IS healthy) start in the minors. And force their way to the majors the old fashion way. (And if Max starts to hit more with the shift gone and increase his in-season trade value, I'd love that.) Having the younger set catch fire, and actually create a problem would be fabulous, because until they do our problem in the OF (other than Byron staying healthy) is quality, not quantity. And trades would just be ditching quantity since they are all discount bin material. (If you want a real return, you would need to trade something really valued like Polanco or Arraez or Miranda or Brooks Lee. Or pitching. And I don't want to go there yet.)

[JD-TWINS]

6 hours ago, Reptevia said:

Let’s be clear:  Buxton played 57 games in CF. That’s only about a 1/3, and the confetti hasn’t hit the floor yet. Is that seriously enough for a “starter”?

Celestino simply wasn’t a MLB hitter last year. 
Gallo’s calling card is his bat???  A career .199 hitter???  Ok…

Gordon-Agreed. 
Kepler- It’s been a good ride. Good luck wherever you get traded to. 
Kiriloff-  IF he can play. IF his wrist holds up, he should be on roster. 
Larnach- IF he can stay healthy and learn to hit a curve ball…he could be a 5th OF. It makes more sense to send him to St Paul and find an RH upgrade (starter) who can play CF 2/3 of the games on the trade market. 

 

So we have Gordon - Buxton - Gallo & who else? Larnach has to be in OF mix as well as DH. Assumption of health.

I see Kirilof at DH - 1B - 20 games of OF. Assumption of health.

Kepler is gone as you state.

Walner in St. Paul to get everyday at bats - be prepared to take Gallo’s spot at some point.

We need a major league hitter - defender from right side of the plate. Needed particularly with Gallo’s potential weak BA.

Who is it?? Can we assume we have a better player on the 40 man or 60 man better than Celestino? Certainly not pushing for Celestino but don’t know the answer.

Duvall, formerly of Reds/Braves? Anyone else now that McCutchen is gone?

Anyone in organization potentially ready this spring? RH bat?

Can Farmer play RF?…….can’t imagine it 

[roger]

There was a short mention of AK in yesterday’s STrib.  Or was it this morning?

Although he is limited in the quantity of swings, he said it felt so good taking a full swing with no pain.

 

[JD-TWINS]

7 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Buxton started 51 games last year, so Celestino stays, although it would be best for him to play every day  for the St. Paul Saints until he is needs to be called up.

Gallo and Buxton are certainties and Kirilloff has almost no value until he can show his game. I also believe he stays at first base until or unless needed elsewhere, which hopefully doesn't happen. Gordon has so much utility and improved quite a bit last year so I think he stays unless another teams puts an inordinate high value on him.

That leaves Kepler and Larnach. The Twins can just roll with what they have in fear of the bad luck of last year or these two get traded.

Wallner will start in St. Paul unless he too is overvalued by another team. I believe in Wallner and see a physical guy who is just growing into his body with enormous potential to hit for average and power while drawing walks. The K's are a concern, but I think he can only get better in the field.

Walner needs AB’s everyday in St. Paul

1)Gallo got signed to play - can’t expect him to play much against Lefties. He’s in RF 90 games & in CF 30 games.

2)Buxton has to start 80 games in CF along with 45 games as DH.

3) Gordon…….28 doubles & 9 HR in 405 AB’s & .272 BA last year. He’s in the line-up. With Farmer on club, & CC playing everyday SS, Farmer is the utility infielder. Gordon is an outfielder (period) outside of an emergency! Gordon starts 50 games in CF and 90 games in LF.

4) With assumed health, Larnach is 4th OF. LF when Gordon is in CF or resting. Gets Larnach 60 games in LF & another 50 games as DH.

5) Unknown. RH batting OF. Plays right when Gallo sits against lefty starters & when Gallo plays CF. Probably 60-70 games in RF & maybe a handful in LF.

Kepler is gone via trade & hopefully Celestino & Pagan are gone too.

Can we cover #5’s games with Farmer & Kirilof in OF.

Only FA I like is Adam Duvall - former Red/Brave…….might work out?

[Beast]

Do we really have a problem here?  Are any of these guys, outside of Buxton when healthy (which isn’t enough), really that good?  We’re likely not seeing the same Alex K. we saw before the wrist.  Gallo looked useless at the plate last year.  Gordon is nothing to write home about as a starter.  Who knows what will happen with Larnach, last year was weird and he’s seen his struggles.  Kepler hasn’t hit since 2019.

The FO and management maybe have some tough decisions.  But, it’s not because of a glut of talent.  It’s more avoiding the land mine of cutting the wrong one loose.

[FlyingFinn]

10 hours ago, ashbury said:

My one worry is that we have only 2 catchers on the 40-man.

No problem here. Twins signed a few catchers who can go and up and down between St. Paul and the Twins when they need them. Just use the Paddack roster spot when they put him on long-term IL. Canterino could be used the same way but the Twins don't like giving service time this way.

[dxpavelka]

8 hours ago, Fred said:

They're not getting rid of Kepler because he is due $10 million. They are spending slightly more on Gallo for an upgrade of nearly 50 points of career OPS, and an increase in power (Kepler 1 HR every 22 ABs, Gallo 1 HR every 13 ABs). Both are nearly equal defensively, with Gallo having 2 Gold Gloves, and Kepler being a finalist a couple of times. They don't need 2 guys like that on the roster, hence they trade Kepler.

By the end of the year it's quite likely that they indeed do NEED 2 guys like that.  Especially with the propensity of other to not stay on the field.  I won't even mention how happy Yankee fans were to see Gallo leave town in the midst of a playoff run, OR his .199 career batting average.

 

[Wizard11]

13 hours ago, High heat said:

The 2 catchers doesn’t matter because as soon as the season starts Lewis and Paddock go on the 60 day DL and we have 2 open 40 man spots. 
Tony Walters is a very solid 3rd catcher on a minor league deal!

Actually 3 open spots as Canterino will go on the 60 day

[nclahammer]

Gilberto Celestino does not belong on a MLB roster at this point in his career.    The kid needs some seasoning at AAA.   Gallo and Gordon can provide CF depth, "if" needed.

[rv78]

Farmer is catcher #3. He won't get any reps there unless Jeffers or Vazquez get hurt and even then it will be very few. As for the outfield, you need twice as many when most of them are part-timers, hurt or can't hit. I long for the days when we had a Gladden, Puckett and Brunansky that played every day instead of the cobbled up crap we see today. It is depressing to have a FO that signs a Gallo, who is a worse hitter than Kepler to apparently replace Kepler who also can't hit. Hope and a Prayer eventually for maybe an outfield of Martin, Lewis and Rodriguez and a Manager that will let them play everyday........... if they can stay healthy.

[Karbo]

20 hours ago, AlGoreRythm said:

I agree with everything you've got here other than Larnach's defense.

Larnach and Gallo seem to have very similar defensive profiles. They're massive guys whose size almost masks their athleticism. They're both able to make plays up against the wall that smaller defenders can't get to without climbing it. The defense doesn't look flashy because they appear to be big plodding guys, but their size often make plays look more routine than they'd be for other players because of their height and reach.

From what I saw of a healthy Larnach the past 2 seasons give me confidence that with more reps at Target Field, he'll provide Kepler level defense, with a better plate approach.

Totally agree with the Celestino analysis and the plan for Lewis on his return.

Maybe not Kepler defense, but I agree he is better defensive OF than he gets credit for.

[Karbo]

18 hours ago, dxpavelka said:

Two guys who can't stay on the field.  PLUS Buxton.  Celestino's a 4th OF.  Wallner has 65 career plate appearances.  Gordon's an infielder.  Somebody's gotta DH.  Apparently, we've gotta trade Kepler cuz he bats left handed.  I always love how our fan base want's to get rid of guys when they get to the point where they're making $10 Million (not a huge amount in this day and age) and then bitch because we don't spend money. 

I don't see Kepler being bashed because of payroll, its because of performance, mainly hitting!

[stringer bell]

It really is about health with Kirilloff and Larnach. Both have been injured more than not for the last year and a half. There is opportunity at DH and first base for at bats for corner outfielders. I do agree that Larnach was and could be more than capable in either right or left field. A healthy Buxton could be spelled occasionally by Gordon without the need to carry Celestino on the active roster. 

Specifically regarding a Kepler trade--he is expendable because he is replaceable. Gallo is probably his (near) equal defensively and a healthy Kirilloff or Larnach could be expected to equal his offensive contribution of his last two years. 

 

[saviking]

Just wait until June and the Twins will have enough outfielders on IR to sort all of this out. It's the last man standing scenario. 

[Bigfork Twins Guy]

Have heard lots of people saying we need a RH corner OF bat.  Now that Correa is signed Farmer can handle some time out there in addition being an emergency catcher.  We also can bring up Garlic if needed.  Lastly, Lewis can be our RH OF guy once he comes up.  Let’s not be so ready to jettison our OF talent just yet.

[oregontwin]

Am I remembering correctly that Kepler has played some 1st base? With Kirilloff probably testing his wrist in St Paul and Miranda moving to 3rd it leaves Arraez who has his own shortcomings as a first baseman and is one of our more "delicate" players as well leaving him not suitable for everyday play in the field. If correct, I could make a case for holding on to Kepler.

[dxpavelka]

11 hours ago, Karbo said:

I don't see Kepler being bashed because of payroll, its because of performance, mainly hitting!

Joey Gallo:  .199 BA.  CAREER.  Even Sano's got a .234 career BA.

[Karbo]

11 hours ago, dxpavelka said:

Joey Gallo:  .199 BA.  CAREER.  Even Sano's got a .234 career BA.

I agree about Gallo. Can't understand that deal at all.

[Riverbrian]

Sorting out the OF is pretty easy. 

A fair open competition for playing time. Let the players decide with actual performance on the field. 

Don't double down on Gallo (or Kepler) if they are the same player they have been the last two years.

They can't be allowed to block potentially better play by getting their name in the lineup everyday despite consistent bad play. 

The nightmare scenario isn't paying Gallo 11M.

The nightmare scenario is paying Gallo 11M to play poorly and not letting someone else have the job. 

Signing Logan Morrison wasn't the mistake. Those types of mistakes happen.

Playing Logan Morrison every day when he wasn't good. was the mistake... not giving anybody else the chance to be better was the mistake.   

 

 

[dxpavelka]

16 hours ago, Karbo said:

I agree about Gallo. Can't understand that deal at all.

I don't have an issue with signing Gallo but just don't see him as an upgrade over Kepler or even vintage Sano for that matter.  Think many are reading way too much into Sano's dismal performance in an extremely small sample size last year and the somebody will sign him and end up with a hell of a bargain.  Maybe not David Ortiz like but maybe Ortiz lite.