Baseball on Cable

[Eris]

I am a transplanted rural Minnesotan living on the east coast, with no cable and no intention of getting cable  I listen to the games on the radio just like I used to listen to Herb Carneal. 

 

Another MLB negative is that playoff games are now late in the evening, often ending near or after midnight on the East coast.  This issue is almost as significant as all the games being on cable, because most young children/early teens would not stay up late to watch the games.  This is quite different from my youth when many playoff games were in the late afternoon/early evening.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

 

Cable isn't going to go away for a long, long time and sports are a major reason for that.   I do agree, however, that smart leagues are going to start doing more to provide programming online at much lower rates.  It's just much further off than people seem to think barring some major technology change.

 

You are probably right but I'm with Brock. The networks ruled for the first 30-40 years, cable took over for 30-40 years, and now it's the internet based content providers. It's a natural progression. Younger folks are cutting the cord.

 

Cable needs sports - you are absolutely right. Who knows how long advertisers will stick around. Despite its profit, all cable has going for it is an obsolete political structure. Comcast won't even let go of its customers. Expect a bumpy ride.

[Paul Pleiss]

Someone earlier mentioned MLB.tv, and MiLB.tv, both of which are awesome services, but MLB.tv doesn't get you the playoffs, not unless you're already a cable subscriber for the required channels, and on a select list of cable providers. And the big bummer about MLB.tv is that you can't watch games for your home market. I've lived in Seattle now for the last 2+ years, and haven't been a geographic member of Twins Territory for the better part of a decade, so MLB.tv is a great deal for me, I get all the Twins games without having to deal with actually paying to have a cable package with FSNorth, and for the rare time when the Twins are playing in my market, I just fork out some money and go watch them at the ball park.

 

I don't know if cable is dying, but people are unplugging from cable and streaming content from the internet. Hopefully as network contracts expire, new deals will be made that may include internet streaming options, especailly for people in their local market area.

 

Maybe there's not a market for putting these games on over the air channels. Maybe FOX and CBS and NBC and the like don't want the games because they don't draw enough. I'll never really understand because to me playoff baseball seems like a huge draw. Hard for me in imagine not wanting to consume it. But I understand the world is not filled with crazy baseball enthusiasts. Some people out there even prefer the NBA (Whoa, what? yes).

 

Baseball is a business. And if someone wants to pay them billions to have exclusive broadcast rights for their games, it makes sense to take that deal. I just wish the playoffs were more accessible.

 

I don't have cable, and part of that decision was related to having streaming options for TV shows, but also an understanding that when I wanted sports on cable, I'd have to head to the local pub, or head to a friend's house who rationalizes the need for spending money on cable.

 

If I didn't love beer so much, I could probably spend that money on cable, and viewing access for post-season baseball.

 

I don't know what the answers are, but I hope Rob Manfred is at least thinking about the questions.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Sure, but unless a league signs a 50 year deal with a cable network they're probably going to be fine.

Definitely but unless leagues are cautious, I see them being one of the last holdouts and hurting their fanbase for a long time. Cable companies are going to hold on to sports for the reason I listed earlier and they'll try to hold on to them at the league's expense in the long-term. They'll continue shoveling money at the leagues in the short-term but the league will continue to lose that vital 18-34 demographic - the demo that powers sports for an entire generation.

 

In the short-term, we'll continue to see teams and leagues sign contracts that make your head spin in size and dollar amount but I question whether it's going to hurt them in the long-term. By isolating the youngest demographic and locking them out of your product in greater and greater numbers, you're potentially hurting your business for the next 20+ years.

 

I hope that one of the major leagues realizes this sooner rather than later and takes a proactive step toward opening up digital streaming to those willing to pay for it. They'll certainly hurt their bottom line in the short-term but what leagues need now is long-term thinking or they'll put themselves in a bubble that's going to pop more violently the longer they wait.

[Badsmerf]

I'm very much with you Brock. Like many, I ended my subscription with direct tv this year. I'm not paying 100 ****ing dollars to watch baseball and the discovery channel. What is going to happen is the broadcast stations will need to start streaming. I can see a day that cable and dish as we know it is completely obsolete. I think the industry knows it too.

 

This demographic you're talking about is going to catch up with baseball. The less free games they air the more isolated they make the fan base. We have more entertainment now than ever before. The emergence of roku and devices like that are going to change everything the more they evolve. Just like HBO changed tv, change is already happening. I embrace it, as I'm tiered of passing for channels I don't want.

[biggentleben]

I'm very much with you Brock. Like many, I ended my subscription with direct tv this year. I'm not paying 100 ****ing dollars to watch baseball and the discovery channel. What is going to happen is the broadcast stations will need to start streaming. I can see a day that cable and dish as we know it is completely obsolete. I think the industry knows it too.

 

This demographic you're talking about is going to catch up with baseball. The less free games they air the more isolated they make the fan base. We have more entertainment now than ever before. The emergence of roku and devices like that are going to change everything the more they evolve. Just like HBO changed tv, change is already happening. I embrace it, as I'm tiered of passing for channels I don't want.

 

Absolutely agree.  With my Apple TV, I now have aps for Fox and ABC to watch their primetime shows, and CBS is supposed to be released soon.  Most of the channels I'd watch on cable non-sports (History, Discovery, etc.) already have aps, and I have an ap for MLB, NFL, and NBA that I can pay for content on

[drjim]

I hear all what you are saying Brock, but I doubt that what is happening now will really have all that much impact on 18-34 demo in the long run. Baseball is primarily a regional sport, with fandom based on how the local team is doing with some spillover into the playoffs if you are a diehard. I'm skeptical that 18-34 (of which I barely am one) sit down and watch an entire game no matter what sport it is. If they like baseball there are plenty of ways to engage in the playoffs even if they don't plunk down for cable. If they don't like baseball they wouldn't be watching more than a couple of minutes either way.

 

Doesn't mean that the cable model isn't dead in the long run.

[nicksaviking]

Yeah, I hate to say it, but I don't think this is an issue with MLB being greedy.  Network televsion doesn't want MLB unless it's on the weekends and not going up against more than one NFL game.  Fox used to have most if not all of the games.  Fox didn't get out bid by ESPN, and they certainly didn't get outbid by their minion station FS1.  Sports are popular, but they are still a niche attraction, particularly baseball.  Network TV does not cater to niche programing.  They have dumbed down fair to try to grab the lowest denominators.  It's the reason any television junkie will tell you that almost all the best written and produced scripted shows are on cable now. 

 

Network TV just doesn't want baseball anymore.  I suspect that will now only change if MLB changed the playoff rules so the games only fall on weekends.  Even the big bad NFL has this problem.  Don't forget that Monday Night Football got dropped from ABC and got relegated to ESPN. 

[Kirby_waved_at_me]

I think having the option to watch live online is really the way to get more people to watch the games. Blacking out the local games, when the subscriber is paying for the service, really seems like counter productive. It's certainly kept me from paying for MLB's online options. If I can't watch the Twins, I don't want to pay for that privilege. I already can't watch the Twins for free!

 

More people want things on demand, appointment televison is not really a thing anymore. Sporting events are still wildly popular, but getting people to tune in at home at a specific time is less appealing.

[biggentleben]

I hear the "baseball is a regional sport" thing often, but it just doesn't bear out.  There are teams with regional fan bases, and the Twins are absolutely one of those, but there are a number of teams with a strong nationwide fan base, like the Yankees/Red Sox/Cubs/Braves/Dodgers.  Some of those have to do with television coverage available on cable, actually, but watch the little league world series every year and listen to the favorite player of the USA teams.  A lot of the players mentioned won't play in the team's regional area.

[Badsmerf]

I think this discussion is larger than just sports on cable. In reality, I think it is anything on cable. How do you justify 50+ dollars being spent per month when you can stream pretty much everything for half that price? Especially since a basic package doesn't include a dvr or the ability to pause! Direct TV had a bunch of great features and I enjoyed being able to watch sports (MLB, NFL, NCAAF, D1 wrestling ect.). Problem was, they wanted me to spend so much money to stay a customer. If the price significantly dropped I would be fine with it. 

 

I hope many of you budget and really look where your money is going. I bought a house in May and did 15,000 worth in renovations. Some of it paid in cash, some of it in credit. Direct TV was cut immediately in April when we knew we were heading down that road. Now, I pay 20 for movie channels and local broadcast. I could pay another 20 to get basic cable channels (including the twins) but I'm not really sure I want to. I might just get an antenna, get a roku and subscribe to mlb tv and hulu. I might be in the blackout area though, so it is an issue I'll look more into next spring.

[Mike Sixel]

The antenna is a bear.....I have to move it for different channels, but it is in the basement.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I hope many of you budget and really look where your money is going. I bought a house in May and did 15,000 worth in renovations. Some of it paid in cash, some of it in credit. Direct TV was cut immediately in April when we knew we were heading down that road.

This is why I don't have cable TV at all. I recently moved to T-Mobile because it saves me $60/mo on my phone bill. I don't have cable. I pay interest on one thing... My house (and I overpay on that monthly). We recently paid for a $20k renovation in cash.

 

I look at the price of cable and the enjoyment level I would get for that $70/mo just doesn't make sense. I get most of what I need by spending $24/mo on Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon Prime. I would gladly pay an additional $8/mo for HBO Go should it ever be offered separate from cable TV.

[Paul Pleiss]

I have a digital antennae, and sometimes I do have to move it around to lock in quality picture for a show depending on the channel, but really the only network tv I watch is the NFL. I have Netflix/Hulu that I split with my brother, half way across the country (which is a pretty sweet deal).

 

It would be pretty neat if I could pay to stream FSNorth so I could get pre-post game coverage instead of just the game that I get w/ MLB.tv, but I'm not even sure I'd be willing to pay any siginificant amoutn for that when MLB.tv already gives me so much baseball for such a small investment.

 

I just really don't like that the post-season is behind a paywall that MLB.tv doesn't give me access to. Even if they had a playoff package that I could subscribe to, as they have done in the past, I'd be a much happier camper.

 

-P

[JB_Iowa]

How much would you be willing to pay for a post-season on-line package?

 

Just curious,

 

I've watched most of the AL playoffs and some if the NL ,,,,via Dish.  I'm a dinosaur.

[biggentleben]

How much would you be willing to pay for a post-season on-line package?

 

Just curious,

 

I've watched most of the AL playoffs and some if the NL ,,,,via Dish.  I'm a dinosaur.

 

I think around $10-25 would be a good price range, and I'd favor a lot closer to the $10.  I'd like to be able to pay for it at the start of the season with my regular season package and lock it in.

[USAFChief]

I gladly pay for direcTV and can't stand streaming anything. I guess I'm a dinosaur too. But I can watch the playoffs in HD on my big screen TV.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I see cable going away personally, and I'm waiting for content on demand, though I see a lot of people fighting this.  I was cable free for a good 4 years up until about 6 months ago, when the cost of switching to Uverse essentially allowed me to dump my really sucky ISP and get Uverse and a basic cable package for the same price as I was paying for internet.  That said, I never watch it and when the contract is up, I'll dial it back to just internet.  I have over the air TV and Netflix.  I really don't need cable.  I think pay for content is coming, but it won't come without a fight.

[Brock Beauchamp]

How much would you be willing to pay for a post-season on-line package?

 

Just curious,

 

I've watched most of the AL playoffs and some if the NL ,,,,via Dish.  I'm a dinosaur.

They should simply extend the MLB.tv package for an addtional month at its $20-25/mo price. I'd gladly pay that to see the playoffs WHEN I wanted to watch the playoffs (which would often be the next day).

[Brock Beauchamp]

I gladly pay for direcTV and can't stand streaming anything.

Uh... Why? Streaming is easier than watching normal television if you have an Apple TV, Roku, or Amazon box. I queue up something on my phone, click a single button, and it's playing on my television (or I can use the device itself to select what I want to watch).

 

No hunting for channels, no commercials, no irritating and slow interface, just a couple of taps on my phone and I'm watching television.

[nicksaviking]

Uh... Why? Streaming is easier than watching normal television if you have an Apple TV, Roku, or Amazon box. I queue up something on my phone, click a single button, and it's playing on my television (or I can use the device itself to select what I want to watch).

 

No hunting for channels, no commercials, no irritating and slow interface, just a couple of taps on my phone and I'm watching television.

 

Well from my experience, frustration levels with when the streaming suddenly stops and has to reload every 10 minutes is pretty unbearable.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Well from my experience, frustration levels with when the streaming suddenly stops and has to reload every 10 minutes is pretty unbearable.

Fair enough but that almost never happens anymore if one has the standard cable internet package (somewhere around 20-30mb download).

 

But if you're still on an ancient DSL line in the 1.5mb range, yeah, that will be an issue (but that doesn't even qualify as "high speed internet" anymore so that's a bit like complaining that a gallon bucket won't hold five gallons of water).

[USAFChief]

Uh... Why? Streaming is easier than watching normal television if you have an Apple TV, Roku, or Amazon box. I queue up something on my phone, click a single button, and it's playing on my television (or I can use the device itself to select what I want to watch).

 

No hunting for channels, no commercials, no irritating and slow interface, just a couple of taps on my phone and I'm watching television.

I disagree that streaming is easier...like I said, I'm a dinosaur. I still have a home phone too.

 

I have (had) a Roku. I have high speed Internet. I tried mlbtv. From my perspective, it sucks. Give me extra innings every day of the week.

[nicksaviking]

 

Fair enough but that almost never happens anymore if one has the standard cable internet package (somewhere around 20-30mb download).

 

But if you're still on an ancient DSL line in the 1.5mb range, yeah, that will be an issue (but that doesn't even qualify as "high speed internet" anymore so that's a bit like complaining that a gallon bucket won't hold five gallons of water).

 

 

I think that depends on where you live though. I don't have DSL and I have a reasonably new modum but everytime I try to stream a show from Netflix, my streaming gets interupted.

[biggentleben]

   

 

I think that depends on where you live though. I don't have DSL and I have a reasonably new modum but everytime I try to stream a show from Netflix, my streaming gets interupted.

 

I don't know.  You have to play with the settings some, but I lived in the middle of nowhere, South Dakota, for 7 years before moving into town this year and getting cable internet.  I had about the least predictive internet ever (over the air antenna), and I watched many Netflix movies and loved mlb.tv out on the farm.  I did have to adjust for lower quality streaming, but I used both there and enjoyed.

[biggentleben]

I disagree that streaming is easier...like I said, I'm a dinosaur. I still have a home phone too.

 

I have (had) a Roku. I have high speed Internet. I tried mlbtv. From my perspective, it sucks. Give me extra innings every day of the week.

 

Serious question: how much of the "it sucks" had to do with any blackout issues?  I'm just curious as that's the primary reason a lot of people are frustrated with the service, but no one apparently lets MLB know this.  I had a very good interview with one of their media execs that I'm trying to get cleared for publishing where he basically stated if there was enough market for mlb.tv to offer a "super premium" package that eliminated blackouts, they'd make it work as nearly every TV deal allows them some flexibility with their online products.

[nicksaviking]

I don't know.  You have to play with the settings some, but I lived in the middle of nowhere, South Dakota, for 7 years before moving into town this year and getting cable internet.  I had about the least predictive internet ever (over the air antenna), and I watched many Netflix movies and loved mlb.tv out on the farm.  I did have to adjust for lower quality streaming, but I used both there and enjoyed.

 

If I have to play with the settings of my wireless service, I'm out.  I nearly exhausted the extent of my technological knowldge when I typed the word modem.  I had no idea there were settings for wireless access other than connect/disconnect.

[Willihammer]

There are some really annoying things about mlb.tv. For one, they still haven't figured out nexdef. There's still no live pausing or replay, as they claim (at least, its never worked for me). I would gladly put a game on pause for an hour, do stuff, then watch the game commercial free, if this feature worked. Of course, you have to keep an eye on the timestamp at all times because if the window has to reload for any reason (which happens multiple times per game), you'll be re-started at the live point in the game. Or, if you're watching an archive, you'll restart at the beginning.

 

This never happens on amazon, nflrewind or netflix.

 

Also I'm caught in a weird dilemma where if I watch the game on a firefox browser, the flash player will crash about once per game, if not more. But if I watch on chrome, frequently the player will give me the circling load screen of eternal doom and I get nothing. Maybe I'm doing it wrong but there do seem to be a lot of bugs and it requires a lot of micro-management to make it work in my experience.

[biggentleben]

There are some really annoying things about mlb.tv. For one, they still haven't figured out nexdef. There's still no live pausing or replay, as they claim (at least, its never worked for me). I would gladly put a game on pause for an hour, do stuff, then watch the game commercial free, if this feature worked. Of course, you have to keep an eye on the timestamp at all times because if the window has to reload for any reason (which happens multiple times per game), you'll be re-started at the live point in the game. Or, if you're watching an archive, you'll restart at the beginning.

 

This never happens on amazon, nflrewind or netflix.

 

Also I'm caught in a weird dilemma where if I watch the game on a firefox browser, the flash player will crash about once per game, if not more. But if I watch on chrome, frequently the player will give me the circling load screen of eternal doom and I get nothing. Maybe I'm doing it wrong but there do seem to be a lot of bugs and it requires a lot of micro-management to make it work in my experience.

 

Very interesting.  I've not had similar experiences, especially with Chrome.  I've loved the pause feature with my AppleTV as well as I've done exactly as you're describing and come back to the game waiting for me to finish, and that was both on the crappy farm internet and the current internet both.

[Mike Frasier Law]

I think we are going to see changes to MLB.TV and blackout restrictions as soon as next year. I've been meaning to update the article we wrote this spring about the antitrust lawsuit against MLB. Short version is that it's not going well for the MLB. MLB and the teams finally tried to have the case thrown out and the judge decided that the antitrust exemption does not apply to the broadcast rights. A week later, we started seeing rumors of MLB easing blackout restrictions.

I bet they start doing what HBO currently does. HBO allows you to stream shows if you already have HBO - you just need to create an online account. So for us, this means it solves the blackout restrictions, but you still have to buy cable.