On 1/7/2023 at 4:50 PM, MN_ExPat said:

But what about Marcel Ozuna?

He should be out of the league as well. What aboutism just uses bad actions to justify more bad actions.

On 1/9/2023 at 3:27 PM, MN_ExPat said:

Bauer has apparently shown little of that

Bauer has shown NONE of that and actually quite the opposite.

” for next to nothing cost wise.”

I think there would be a huge cost. True, little monetarily toward his salary, but there would be a huge backlash to his signing that would be very costly, imo

On 1/9/2023 at 5:20 PM, Richie the Rally Goat said:

Domestic violence is a crime. What the criminal courts, civil courts, and what the MLB does are all independent of each other.

I agree with you Ritchie that the courts are different than corporate rules. Courts are where the defendants are innocent until proven guilty. Where investigations by law are non bias, only proven facts are allowed, hearsay is not allowed and those who lie for any reason are punished.

Corporate rules are controlled by corporate. Unions might have some say on the matter depending on how strong they are. But now days, it's not very much. If they want you guilty you are guilty, no matter how innocent you are. Investigations are ran by them where they get to choose the information they want, whether it's hearsay or not. Corporate is the judge, jury & executer, They don't have to reveal their findings. And those who lie are not necessarily responsible for their actions. They need not be punished & in some cases rewarded.

Bauer was not convicted in court on Domestic Violence, Many MLB players who have been convicted in court have had much lighter suspensions than Bauer. IMO Bauer's domesic violence suspension was excessive and a panel of MLB, Union & Independent arbitrators (mitigated a compromise that immediately halted the suspension) thought the same. There is no secret about Manfred's feelings towards Bauer and that he'd like Bauer permanently out of MLB.

I'm not a fan of Bauer & I'm not advocating for him. I'm advocating for justice.

On 1/7/2023 at 1:40 PM, Doctor Gast said:

Bauer wouldn't be a great clubhouse guy but neither was Morris & he was key for us to win the '91 WS. Bauer wasn't charged by the court, Most of the Dodgers clubhouse & fans want him back. Dodgers FO don't want him.

Bauer at $270M is a bargain. What are the odds for the Twins to land him off waivers? IDK? LAD don't want any of their competitors to have him so LAD would prefer an AL Central Division team like the Twins to end up with him. So our best bet is to trade for him because LAD will find someone who'll be interested in him, why not the Twins. We have the Dodgers pay the $22MM & we pay the $270M & a lotto ticket.

Bauer borders on crazy, can Twins fix him? Maybe, but I doubt it. Could the Twins convince him to play it cool, would be in his best behalf? I'd like to think so. Bauer would be a front -line pitcher on the cheap that we desperately need. I'd like the Twins to give him a chance to prove himself if he can't, trade him or release him we're only out $270M

I bet Bauer clears waivers. If the FO is desperate enough to sign him, it should be at league minimum for 1 year and a team option for additional years based on regular counseling and personal performance reviews. Thrown in a bonus for every playoff win. Hopefully some other FO gives him that chance, not us.

10 hours ago, AlGoreRythm said:

He should be out of the league as well. What aboutism just uses bad actions to justify more bad actions.

I don't disagree, he should (as well as Aroldis Chapman and others). However the league did itself no favors by the disparate response and punishment of each and set horrible precedence in each case.  Hence the arbitrators ruling that the league's punishment in the Bauer case was excessive and reinstating him immediately upon the ruling.  That was my sole point with that reference.

On 1/9/2023 at 1:55 PM, JDubs said:

Miss me with the bs about not being charged -- only a small fraction of people who commit sexual assault ever get convicted. This is like saying Pol Pot was never convicted in a court of law, so how are we to say if he was bad or not?

But the second chances bit is also incredibly weak, because second chances are for people who a) apologize and b) grow or change. Bauer has not come close to doing either, and instead has continued to double down on all the stuff he was doing before when everyone thought he was just a regular jackass and not also a sexual predator. To repeat myself, there's got to be a line somewhere, and if "unrepentant rapist" ain't the line, then you probably just don't have a line.

Bauer did say he learned from his mistake and is going to be careful about who he allows into his circle outside baseball from now on. On his youtube channel. I'm sure he's definitely grown and changed from this experience. 

On the second chances bit-Jorge Polanco, Nelson Cruz and Michael Pineda all violated league rules and served suspensions. Then they played again and Twins fans welcomed them back with open arms. Bauer served more than three times the sentence they served, without actually being confirmed to have done anything wrong. It is your opinion that he is a rapist and sexual predator, and it's fine to have that opinion, but since Bauer did serve a suspension from MLB, he is eligible to play baseball again, right now. He deserves a second chance just as much, if not more, than Pineda did. 

I think the clubhouse chemistry is a bigger deal than anything, because the sexual allegations piece is going to die down after a couple months with his new team this season, but if he truly is a bad teammate, that's not going away. 

33 minutes ago, dex8425 said:

Bauer did say he learned from his mistake and is going to be careful about who he allows into his circle outside baseball from now on. On his youtube channel. I'm sure he's definitely grown and changed from this experience.

His choice of (female) friends was the problem, not his own behavior? LOL. He's virtually promising not to grow and change.

Look, the law sets the bar very high before depriving someone of their freedom. If the California legal system didn't see fit to bring criminal charges, that's a fact I'll accept and I'm not asking that he be jailed.

Doesn't mean I can't also set the bar pretty high as to wanting someone like him on my team. If 30 teams choose to look at things likewise, that's not collusion, that's marketing under good old fashioned free-enterprise capitalism, rah rah rah.

Maybe some "Minnesota Nice" would do Trevor some good.  Be nice, be kind and don't be not nice.

15 hours ago, ashbury said:

His choice of (female) friends was the problem, not his own behavior? LOL. He's virtually promising not to grow and change.

Look, the law sets the bar very high before depriving someone of their freedom. If the California legal system didn't see fit to bring criminal charges, that's a fact I'll accept and I'm not asking that he be jailed.

Doesn't mean I can't also set the bar pretty high as to wanting someone like him on my team. If 30 teams choose to look at things likewise, that's not collusion, that's marketing under good old fashioned free-enterprise capitalism, rah rah rah.

yesss.....but she did take nude photographs of herself with a big smile on her face after the encounter and bragged to her friends via text that she had slept with Trevor among other things and that they had done it together.  All of that made it into court proceedings if anyone really cares to look.  What happened afterwards appears to be an attempted shakedown, which is not the first time that has happened. 

All of that came up in court and was part of the reason the judge and jury dismissed the charges and he was acquitted at the end of the day.  I am not making excuses for the guy, but i am not simply going to make stuff up that he is automatic guilty because of whatever chip exists on my shoulder about the subject matter.  I also have zero illusions that other star athletes with millions of dollars at their finger tips aren't doing the same thing or involved in something similar such as Sano ahemmmm.  I watch them play baseball, i don't care about what they do in the bedroom as long as it isn't illegal and affects his play on the field.  Not that it matters as the Twins aren't going to sign him anyways.  

15 hours ago, dex8425 said:

Bauer did say he learned from his mistake and is going to be careful about who he allows into his circle outside baseball from now on. On his youtube channel. I'm sure he's definitely grown and changed from this experience. 

On the second chances bit-Jorge Polanco, Nelson Cruz and Michael Pineda all violated league rules and served suspensions. Then they played again and Twins fans welcomed them back with open arms. Bauer served more than three times the sentence they served, without actually being confirmed to have done anything wrong. It is your opinion that he is a rapist and sexual predator, and it's fine to have that opinion, but since Bauer did serve a suspension from MLB, he is eligible to play baseball again, right now. He deserves a second chance just as much, if not more, than Pineda did. 

I think the clubhouse chemistry is a bigger deal than anything, because the sexual allegations piece is going to die down after a couple months with his new team this season, but if he truly is a bad teammate, that's not going away. 

Sano would be another one, but he got a pass, hmmm i wonder why?  

On 1/11/2023 at 6:32 AM, Doctor Gast said:

I agree with you Ritchie that the courts are different than corporate rules. Courts are where the defendants are innocent until proven guilty. Where investigations by law are non bias, only proven facts are allowed, hearsay is not allowed and those who lie for any reason are punished.

Corporate rules are controlled by corporate. Unions might have some say on the matter depending on how strong they are. But now days, it's not very much. If they want you guilty you are guilty, no matter how innocent you are. Investigations are ran by them where they get to choose the information they want, whether it's hearsay or not. Corporate is the judge, jury & executer, They don't have to reveal their findings. And those who lie are not necessarily responsible for their actions. They need not be punished & in some cases rewarded.

Bauer was not convicted in court on Domestic Violence, Many MLB players who have been convicted in court have had much lighter suspensions than Bauer. IMO Bauer's domesic violence suspension was excessive and a panel of MLB, Union & Independent arbitrators (mitigated a compromise that immediately halted the suspension) thought the same. There is no secret about Manfred's feelings towards Bauer and that he'd like Bauer permanently out of MLB.

I'm not a fan of Bauer & I'm not advocating for him. I'm advocating for justice.

Yes i agree.  I think the suspension had more to do with his outward and vocal accusations about cheating in Baseball which he leveled against several very prominent ballclubs (he's done it several times) and players, with the Yankees being one of them.  That's treading on dangerous waters especially considering the firestorm that ensued on Twitter between Bauer and several prominent athletes, something Jose Canseco knows a great deal about. 

I also am advocating for Justice as well and i actually don't like the dude personally, but the court acquitted him and that's that.  Maybe some fans might want to pause and think instead of rushing to cast judgment and condemning him just because of the subject matter.  Think back to what happened to Sano and his alleged accuser.  Why the double standard?       

31 minutes ago, laloesch said:

Yes i agree.  I think the suspension had more to do with his outward and vocal accusations about cheating in Baseball which he leveled against several very prominent ballclubs (he's done it several times) and players, with the Yankees being one of them.  That's treading on dangerous waters especially considering the firestorm that ensued on Twitter between Bauer and several prominent athletes, something Jose Canseco knows a great deal about. 

I also am advocating for Justice as well and i actually don't like the dude personally, but the court acquitted him and that's that.  Maybe some fans might want to pause and think instead of rushing to cast judgment and condemning him just because of the subject matter.  Think back to what happened to Sano and his alleged accuser.  Why the double standard?       

Thanks Lalo... It's good to see rational positive counter points to both sides of a discussion rather than what sometimes appear to be strong emotional reactions.  While I can understand, and often appreciate where those come from, emotions do little to provide positive direction for a discourse on any topic.

2 hours ago, laloesch said:

Sano would be another one, but he got a pass, hmmm i wonder why?  

True, although Sano was never suspended. Bauer certainly has a more public profile, which creates some enemies for him. 

2 hours ago, laloesch said:

yesss.....but she did take nude photographs of herself with a big smile on her face after the encounter and bragged to her friends via text that she had slept with Trevor among other things and that they had done it together.  All of that made it into court proceedings if anyone really cares to look.  What happened afterwards appears to be an attempted shakedown, which is not the first time that has happened. 

All of that came up in court and was part of the reason the judge and jury dismissed the charges and he was acquitted at the end of the day.  I am not making excuses for the guy, but i am not simply going to make stuff up that he is automatic guilty because of whatever chip exists on my shoulder about the subject matter.  I also have zero illusions that other star athletes with millions of dollars at their finger tips aren't doing the same thing or involved in something similar such as Sano ahemmmm.  I watch them play baseball, i don't care about what they do in the bedroom as long as it isn't illegal and affects his play on the field.  Not that it matters as the Twins aren't going to sign him anyways.  

Yep, there's a video from her phone of her winking and kissing at the camera in bed, then the camera pans to Bauer sleeping next to her. The video was taken after he allegedly choked and hit her. Needless to say she appears pleased with herself. 

On 1/7/2023 at 1:34 PM, JesusisLord7 said:

But when you have gone two plus decades without winning a game that matters we need to try something.

Even if Bauer were capable of taking a team like the Twins and elevating them instantly into contender status (which he is not capable of doing by a country mile), is it worth it? Do we have red lines we're not willing to cross in order to get a title and piece of hardware anymore? Or has the American Way gone the way of the dodo in America's Pastime? 

On 1/11/2023 at 6:32 AM, Doctor Gast said:

I'm not a fan of Bauer & I'm not advocating for him. I'm advocating for justice.

While I can appreciate the devil's advocacy here, the fact remains that Trevor Bauer only had one "good" season as an AL pitcher -- 2018, when he ended Cleveland's run by allowing 4 hits and 3 runs in just 1 1/3 innings. 

They shipped him off the following season. I wanna reiterate that -- a team that was a title contender traded Bauer for a couple of "prospects" that haven't even sniffed the big leagues five years later, a below-average reliever now in the Rockies' MiL system, and Yasiel Freakin' Puig, who lasted all of 49 games with Cleveland before heading off to the KBO. 

Now you got the Dodgers -- perennial contenders -- throwing him out with the trash and willing to eat millions in the process just to be rid of the guy.

It doesn't take Billy Beane to tell something's not right there. If talent like Trevor's can't speak louder  than his actions, is that someone anyone wants regardless of title drought?