Twodogs

I feel it's a steal!

What's a contract offer to Cobb look like?? How many years? How much money? How many opt outs, any incentives? etc...

I'd say that if I had to put money on it, I'd say to watch a team like San Francisco, they are so old that if they aren't kicking everyone's butt's going into July they might just fall apart, they will have injuries and other things happen to them, I believe they have probably what would be projected as the oldest starting lineup in baseball. Now imagine if they start to slip in June or July, that team will have to close up shop and start the fire sale because they will realize they aren't going to bounce back next year so they will be getting rid of guys like Samardzija, and Cueto along with the geriatric position players they have all over the place. But that is just one team that i forsee might need to get rid of someone. Tampa Bay also, if they are getting pounded in the East they might start to look to get rid of guys like Archer and Odorizzi a little more seriously at that point in time; right now they are in a position where they don't need to move them, so their values are preceivably higher right now, those values might drop a little going into August if they are out of the running. Other teams that have some decent guys that could have to move guys to get younger and more competitive would be Seattle, Toronto, heck Arizona could have a bad year and need to unload some things? If the Mets can't get it put back together they may need to unload some things. Teams like the White Sox, Royals, Oakland, Pittsburgh, Detroit, Miami already seem to be in full rebuild so they won't have much, those teams seem to have gone young already. But now could you imagine if a team like the Red Sox faltered this year?? If for some reason they took a dump, they'd have some nice pieces up for bid??? Those are just some ideas, yeah I think I'd sigh Cobb or Lynn and wait to make that trade when I know if I'm actually in it or not?? Thats just my thoughts. But if the Twins do it that way they will know a little more about their prospects too, and they will know if a guy like Gonsalves will actually make it or not. Also for giving up a 3rd rounder for Cobb or Lynn, the Twins don't know who they would draft with that pick anyway, they might be able to get the guy they wanted with the 4ty pick?? Also that pick is a complete unknown right now whereas the trade chips they got right now they know who they are and what to expect?? Again just my opinion.

My point is this. I'm not against trading prospects, even great ones, but they can make that trade in August. Until then they need a Lynn, Cobb, etc... To get them through the season. There will be a lot of teams that will be out of it and they will have some really good starting pitchers that will become available. They will be trying to get rid of them, just like the Tigers did with Verlander this year. Now if they get Cobb now, get Santana back in May, have Berrios develop a little more, have Gibson not do terrible and then add that so called Ace in August. Then the Twins will end up with two better pitchers to put in the rotation. Now you have your so called world series contender. But if you trade a bunch for a guy like Archer now, they will be done and won't be able to add that extra guy in August because you can't sign free agents in August. Sign that free agent now, Cobb, Lynn, etc... And get the Ace at the trade deadline.

I say you stack the odds in your favor by keeping the chips you have until the final hand at least. When I play poker I don't go all in on my first hand or two. Trade those chips to put yourself over the top when you realize your gonna actually get there. Not before. Also if you build to win it all or maybe not even make the playoffs, you do realize that if the Twins don't make the playoffs that they will probably tear this whole thing apart and start over again. Come August, when the twins are 10 - 11 games under they start trading away all their good guys to teams that need them and get a bunch of new young guys that none of us have any idea how good they will be. Be careful for what you wish for.

You have to get to game 163 first. Who knows, Darvish might be hurt by then?? Rotation depth is always a concern, Lynn, Cobb, even Garcia makes the Twins better. Also it's possible that another good year and some progression Berrios becomes that guy who can take on Sale etc.... The Twins might already have that guy, but if they finish 72 - 90 then they will never know. But I say keep the prospects, especially the ones that are close, like Gonsalves, Romero, etc.... Because they could be the next wave of top starters, or when they are 10 games over .500 in August and need to make that trade to put them over the top, that's when you play those chips. Until then get Lynn, Cobb, etc... Someone to help out, especially now that Santana is down for awhile.

I saw the Darvish deal was 6 for 126 on the MLB channel. I think the twins missed an opportunity, they should have gone for it. Hey he held out and got what he wanted. Yeah I guess the twins didn't blink, but they are also left empty handed. I'd prefer not to trade for anyone, I'd like to see the twins hang on to their prospects so they can possibly use them at the trade deadline. Go get Lynn, Cobb, Garcia, someone to stick in the rotation that will make them aveage and hope that these young pitchers develop and can become a factor next year. Until then we need to sit around and hope they can get in to the wild card game that they can lose, but hopefully at that point we are talking about these young guys and how they will be ready for 2019??

My thoughts are that if he turned down the twins offer then the Twins will probably be putting out an offer for Lynn or Cobb pretty soon. That's how we will know if he turned down the Twins. Again JMO

Probably should stop blaming the player on this one as he isn't the one going in and negotiating. I feel that most of the responsibility lies on the agents with all of these drawn out negotiations. JMO

If gibby can throw 160 - 170 innings with a 4.5 - 4.6 era he'd be an ok 4th starter.

What was Milwaukee's offer? Wasn't it more then that?? I mean it should at least match that one or why would he choose the Twins over them??

Getting a couple of lesser pitchers means the Twins can sign them to 1 year deals, that works perfectly in case a couple of these young guys pans out, if they don't then they will need to re-visit this next year also.

It said in the tweet that it started last season and gave it an injection.

So Santana should be ready sometime at the beginning of May which always seems to actually mean June?

Its not 2 extra wins though, a replacement player is worth 0, and some of the crappy guys the twins have rolled out there are in the negatives, so its more like 4 extra wins. Yeah, look at the standings last year and see how many teams would have made the playoffs if they had 4 extra wins. But yeah its expensive, but its better than rolling Hughes out there. Get Darvish and everone else rolls down the rotation and Hughes or whoever is at the bottom is bumped out.

These types of stats may be one of the driving factors as to why the Free Agent market is depressed a little. Looking at that it puts Jaime Garcia as pretty much the same pitcher as Lance Lynn. These same stats also say that Phil Hughes is the same starter as Chris Tillman. So here is where I question the validity of these stats. Does anyone think that if the Twins rolled Phil Hughes out there every 5th day that he'd end up with the same numbers as compared to Chris Tillman if another comparable team rolled him out every 5th day?? I don't think Hughes could even make it through a season but that is just my opinion.

Morneau was an MVP. So he could be on there for sure.

"Oh baby Yuuuuuuuuu, Yu got what I need, but you say he's just a friend, you say he's just a friend. Oh baby Yuuuuuuuuu, Yu got what I need, but you say he's just a friend, you say he's just a friend."

You are correct that there is a lot of risk that comes with Darvish. However, right now, in my opinion, the Twins should be in a win now mode. Darvish helps the Twins win now, again in my opinion. If people think that they can just go into the season with what they have and that they are going to the playoff and do damage they are wrong. There is no way Gonsalves and Romero are ready at this point in time. Romero can barely pitch past 120 innings in a year so far; both of them still need developing, maybe not their stuff, but they need to get stronger and facing the Astros, Red Sox, Yankees, Cubs is not the way to build strength in a couple of young pitchers. Again Darvish has risk, but in a year or two those kids will probably be ready to take that step forward and be dominant in the big leagues, however, if we trade them away for a guy like Archer then in two years when Archer's contract is up the Twins will have nothing in the hopper to win at that point in time and they will be talking about re-building or they will have to go out and get some new free agent at that point in time who will probably be more expensive than Darvish is now. So Darvish is the best answer at this time, way better than relying on Phil Hughes and the likes of those guys.

So more like innings per start, to go that extra quality inning to limit how much bull pen usage they have to rely on?? Regardless, I think the Twins will be a whole lot better with Darvish on the mound. They will be better with Lynn or Cobb, but they might not have that guy who can match up with the likes of Sale and other teams big dogs, etc..... With a healthy Darvish they would have that. Kinda like a Jack Morris of 1991 and a Frank Viola of 1987

Well I mean is this really news? I don't want this taken in a bad way or anything. But I'm pretty sure Nolan Ryan's K rate went up when Dave Kingman was hitting and most likely went down when Rod Carew was up. So I would tend to believe that K's go down against good contact hitters and up against home run mashers. I'd bet money that every pitcher in MLB shows that trend?? I would also venture to say that strike out pitchers don't normally turn into contact pitchers later in ball games. Just from what I have seen over the years is that often times the reverse is true. Many of the better strike out pitchers tend to give up a few hits early on and less later on when they are going good. Seems like their secondary stuff sets up better later in games after they have established a good fastball.

Darvish will give up some fly ball too, it will just be a lot less of them.

Hey you've never seen me, my 2nd grader has a mean fastball though. I agree, not trying in any way to say that I would like to see Jaime Garcia, I'm just saying there are guys like that available, and as long as this market has dragged out those guys will probably be pretty cheap.

Well I believe Cobb, Lynn, Darvish, Arrieta are all a part of plan A. But there are some middling guys available like Jaime Garcia I think is a F.A. etc... To at least plug the 5th spot in the rotation until the trade deadline.

Romero and Gonsalves will most likely be on an innings limit this year, not ideal for a team trying to make a playoff push. IMO. Plus if we make a trade for a pitcher like Archer Gonsalves and Romero would probably be a part of the deal??