Doomtints

Heck, why not throw in Santiago and May to fill out the other potential starters. Best ERA there is 5.27. Sure, they probably won't be calling up Pat Dean or Andrew Albers to utterly blow everything up at the end of the year again, so there's maybe 3 wins or so right there....

Duffey is still on the team along with Gibson, Berrios and Hughes. The best ERA of THAT bunch is 5.07. How many wins is 0.06 ERA worth?

Or they will say, "Eh, both sides are corrupt... what can you do?" and then prattle on a bit more about the evil liberals.

News today is that Trump and his inner circle are using their own email server. This is probably worth pointing out to the rabid anti-Hillary people who could think of nothing else.

If he is their #2 or #3 prospect instead of their number 1, does this make him worthless? How does he compare to Gonsalves, the current Twins #1?

Here is an interesting view. We keep hearing here, "Wow, this is all the Twins could have gotten for the great Dozier?" Well how about this opinion on a 3rd party (NY Mets) website: "Although trading a top pitching prospect is always gonna be painful, this does seem like a win/win trade on paper. Dodgers may have overpaid, but they're getting a quality player back in return. I'm just a little surprised that this is all you can get for a top pitching prospect in the current market." This is the opposite opinion. "Wow, this is all you can get for a top pitching prospect?"

Well, it means the clock is already ticking on De Leon so they can't delay his service time.

De Leon is on the Rays 25-man roster.

Unfortunately 3B has to cover part of the OF when 2B is empty and there is thus an increased risk of collision. One also must consider collisions from having to tag sliding baserunners. Mauer should not be over there.

Game theory, I like it. 2 of the 4 possibilities have the Twins wrong. One possibility has the Dodgers wrong. One is unknown. The safest bet is to make the deal.

By the time Polanco has had enough time at SS to fail, Dozier will be gone and Gordon will be up. This is a non-issue.

True, assuming this is what the Twins were thinking. It could be that they overvalue Dozier and the decision has little to do with De Leon's projection. One must also consider that scouts have started making the distinction between "projected #4 starters" and "projected #4 starters for the Twins." One projection assumes the guy's floor, and the other the guy's ceiling. De Leon is not equivalent to Gonsalves.

My point is we're stuck a bit on "projections" to the point where were forgetting "needs." Let's face it, definitions of #2, #3, and #4 pitchers are fuzzy at best. Give 20 people a list of proven, MLB-level pitchers and have them write down whether they are a 2,3,4 level pitcher and you will get 20 different sets of answers. Digging in heels over whether a guy is a #2 or a #3 is odd and frankly a waste of time. De Leon will be a middle of the order starter with periods of dominance over his career. Much like Santana has been. Do the Twins more guys like Santana or not?

I understand you are venting but Molitor both benched and sent Rosario to the minors for trying to make "impossible" plays, even when the plays succeeded. I don't know if Molitor is unpopular or not (I doubt he is as unpopular as you suggest). My problem with him is that he doesn't know how to manage the pitching aspect of the game. Over the two years he has been manager he has probably cost the team a dozen wins with his terrible game management.

This is why he should not be at 3rd, where the injury occurred. Sano's value will always be with his bat. If he spends time on the DL due to injuries sustained in the field, the Twins are burning off one of their most exciting assets in the history of the franchise. They should just get it over with and trade him to Boston so he can have the baseball career that he deserves to have.

Of course. But no analyst is going to recommend that you sell stock if they are bullish on its future value. You may sell the stock anyway because you need to, but even as you do so you will feel like crap about it as that's a tough pill to swallow. Sure, you are doing what you have to do today, but you know you are losing in the long run. Most people of appropriate means would take out a signature loan to deal with a short term problem long before they would sell stock to deal with that problem.

The Twins are wrong. Dozier's future value will do nothing to improve this club. They will never be able to trade Dozier for an ace. Teams in contention don't trade away their aces. Teams not in playoff contention have no need for Brian Dozier on a 2 year deal.

Every deal in baseball is based on a player's future worth. That's the market. If Barry Bonds came back today, he would sign for the league minimum. And no one ever says to sell stocks now if they think the value will rise.

No, they need pitching. You sign the ace when the rest of the staff is worthy of their jockstraps. Signing an ace now is exactly as daft as keeping Dozier right now. Signing an ace today would be throwing money down the drain for the Twins. By the time the rest of the staff becomes competent, the ace's contract would be up. This would be sort of like the Detroit Lions when they were drafting top tier receivers with their first round picks every year in an era when they had no QB, no offensive line, and no defense.

This thread got hijacked a bit. But let's be honest here. The people on the side saying it's great that this deal did not go through simply did not want Dozier to be traded. The conversation about De Leon and secondary assets is not the issue. The market has spoken. The Twins didn't make the trade either because they disagree with the market or they were being "too cute" and annoyed the Dodgers. This is a value judgement. Some of us value Dozier > adding pitching talent. Fine. I don't know why the conversations went elsewhere when this is what it boils down to. Perhaps those defending Dozier refuse to see it that way because this position is a bit silly and instead argue other points, I don't know.

That's setting the bar high. Those Rangers had better pitching than the Twins currently do. I can't think of a comp to the Twins current pitching situation, though if I looked it up I would imagine it would be the Senators teams from the 50s.

He was added to the 40-man when the Dodgers already had 49 players on the 40-man. Do the math. The Dodgers had no choice but to prune and make difficult decisions during the offseason. No intelligent GM stashes a 24-year old guy who is ready in the minors when he has several younger players of a similar caliber who will also be ready when they need to dig in and call someone up to the majors. This is called trading from a position of strength, something we don't see very often in Twins Territory.

They don't have space in their bullpen. Their roster is full. To add a rookie now means cutting a veteran. The Dodgers had no choice but to trade De Leon before the season starts.

The Dodgers have a full pitching staff and another half dozen pitchers who are ready enough to fill in if required. De Leon is ready to go into a rotation now and he is 24 years old. Keeping him in the minors would not make sense. As for if they called up Stewart before De Leon meaning anything -- De Leon was not the first guy they called up in 2016 when pitchers were injured. The Dodgers had 49 players on their 40-man roster last year due to all of the injuries they had. Squeezing De Leon onto the roster would have been insane. So no, De Leon not being called up for some spot starts would not have meant anything in 2017.

This makes the top pitching prospects even more valuable if there are fewer of them when comparied to position players. Teams should be grabbing them whenever possible.