clone52

Just like we can't "Prove" Hunter's influence, you can't "Prove" he didn't have that kind of influence. Its perfectly reasonable to have opinions on both sides of it.

No attack at all. I love a good debate.

I guess my opinion is that the veteran leadership "could" rub off, not that it was a guarentee. Maybe it didn't help in 2016 because players didn't buy into it. Now that they saw they 2016 results, maybe they'll be more open to it. Maybe its all hoey. If the front office is thinks Park and Vargas may have a future with the Twins, signing Napoli makes no sense. However, if they think one or both of them has no future with the Twins, what does it hurt? Purely speculation, lets say that the front office has no future plans for Vargas. Heck, maybe he is waived to make room on the 40 man for a Rule 5 pick. Then lets say the Twins sign Napoli to a 1 year deal. Mauer plays 1B against righties. Napoli plays 1B against lefties. Napoli plays DH against righties. Park plays DH against lefties. Park probably also gets some DH against righties. Sano probably gets some DH days as well. Plenty of space for everyone. Now if they believe in Vargas, he either takes Napoli's spot or Park's spot (if they don't believe in Park).

I don't think many people are claiming he is going to lead the team to a championship, but if his veteran leadership can rub off on the young guys like Buxton, Sano, Kepler, Polanco, that can have a lasting impact for years to come. If the front office doesn't believe Vargas and Park are long term answers and the long term answer isn't major league ready, then it doesn't hurt anything to bring in someone for a year mainly for their veteran presence.

Hunter decided to retire. If he had wanted to play, he would have easily been signed, probably by the Twins.

Agree, its not really fact. However, the circumstantial evidence is pretty high. Claiming it was all due to the month of May is garbage. Their worst month in 2015 was better than 5 out of 6 months in 2016. Their second worst month in 2015 was better than 5 out of 6 months in 2014 and 4 out of 6 months in 2013. It seems like there may be something to having good, veteran leadership in the clubhouse.

Do you really think Cuddyer is wrong? There is plenty of circumstantial evidence that shows it. How many times have we heard of players who instead of listening to coaches and working on their flaws are instead just trying to put on a home run show during batting practice? How many people have complained that Joe Mauer isn't a leader? How many people complained that the team's veterans didn't really speak up and tell the young guys how to act? Plus, the fact that Torii Hunter turned things around so significantly in his one season back here also points to this as a big issue.

If the front office thinks Park or Vargas is the real deal and the future at 1B, then no need to sign Napoli. If the front office doesn't see Vargas or Park in the long term plans, then bringing in a veteran like Napoli has no downside. For all we know, they could be looking at Napoli as purely a pinch hitter/bench player. I don't know.

I'm just going by Cuddyer's comments on changes in the culture in the Twins minor league system. Over his career, it went from "win, win, win" to "I, I, I". Hey, I like Vargas, but its not like he a sure thing as the future of 1B. We're also probably only talking about 1 year of Napoli. And for all we know, the front office maybe doesn't like Vargas and see him in their future plans at all. The same things could be said about Park.

Do we really know if the new front office feels the 1B/DH situation is clogged? They already let ABW go for nothing. Do we know how they feel about Park and Vargas? They might not be high on Vargas or Park. Lets say that the Twins pull off a Dozier for Bellinger/De Leon trade. That hopefully sets up 1B for the future. What value does Vargas have to the Twins then? I say, if you can bring a guy in that can maybe show the younger guys who to be professionals and that losing is unacceptable, its worth doing. Napoli has been on 90 win teams all but 2 seasons of his career. If anyone knows what it takes to be a winning team, its him.

The benefit Napoli could have long term is instilling a winning culture. Maybe he could show these young kids that losing is unacceptable.

With Cuddyers comments about building a winning culture and how they had that when he came through the system but lost it later, I think signing a veteran like Napoli might make sense. Maybe too many of our young guys are just going through the motions, cant' wait to get home or don't know their place on the team. I think there is no denying that having Torii Hunter in the clubhouse had a massive impact on the team. Maybe Napoli is like that. Both of our new front office guys have had him on their teams before.

Oh, sure they need to figure it out, but I'll be sorely disappointed if they spend a lot of money to go out and get a free agent first basemen. I think you can fill the 1B slot from within (Mauer/Vargas/Sano/Park). I mean honestly, if our 1B got the offensive production that Dozier got and our 2B got the production that our 1B got, no one would be overly concerned about things.

The new front office shouldn't waste their time worry about first base. There are options, and while not great, they are decent. Spend their time worrying about the pitching staff.

I didn't read through the entire thread, but I got thinking about how Molitor has been managing later in this season. He's made some mind boggling decisions, but the more I thought about it, the more I thought that he might be managing for the future. I've thought it was odd a few times that he used Suzuki as a pinch hitter. Didn't seem to make sense. But, what if the Twins think about signing Suzuki to a 1 year/low money contract to be the backup catcher next year. Might make sense to see how he handles pinch hitter things. It seems like he's let pitchers go too long in some games, especially Gibson. He seems to fall apart. However, if Gibson is part of the rotation, you need to know what you have from him. If you are fighting for a playoff spot, you probably pull Gibson in the 5th inning when he walks the first 2 hitters. When you are out of the playoff, you might let him battle through it to see if he can. Could his bullpen usage also be looking to the future? Can Brandon Kintzler be a multi-inning closer? You'll never know until you try. What a better time to try than when you have nothing to lose. Why not also see how effective relievers are on back to back nights. Certainly doesn't excuse April/May, but might excuse the rest of the season. Personally, I would demand the new GM keep Molitor on, but I would suggest it and I would have no problem if the new GM did want to keep Molitor for one more year.

So for the Angles, Meyer has pitched 7.1 innings, gave up 5 runs, 6 H, 8K and 6BB and we think the Angels have turned him around? Seriously?

Right now, where do you put ABW? In theory, you've got Rosario/Buxton/Kepler entrenced in the outfield. Sure, you could give ABW a cup of coffee right now, but the Twins will really want to see the other guys through. It will be interesting to see what the new POBO and GM will do. If it were me, I'd shop all 4 of those outfielders, trade one if you get a good offer and go with the other 3. You can always get a 4th outfielder.

The bolded items can be contradictory. What if a player's maximum value is as a hitter and keeping him the lineup most often requires you to jerk him around the field at different positions?

Do those teams have 40 man roster spots available to block moves like that and will they want to use those 40 man spots to try and block a Kintzler or Suzuki trade or do they want to risk them blocking other trades.

I do think Suzuki will be dealt today. However, if the Twins know they won't re-sign him next year and want to get an extended look at Murphy or even Garver, they may just let whatever team claims him have him, or work out a trade for a PTBNL or cash. I would rather trade Abad or Kintzler, but if they don't move them now, they will be put on waivers and they "might" be able to trade them in August. No guarentee they can of course.

All are interesting ones. If the Twins are done with Suzuki and just want to move on, they may let someone claim him and just let him go. Teams might not have urgency for Abad or Kintzler, but since they both are relatively cheap next year, teams may claim them and actually want to trade them. Considering people are thinking a Low Minors lottery ticket for either of them, that same sort of return could be had in August.

Suzuki, Abad and Kintzler would be claimed, but probably by someone that might actually want them, and thus a trade could be worked out.

On the other hand, now that Cashner is no longer available, do the Rangers, Orioles, Astros, Blue Jays and Giants have new interest in Santana now they they lost out on acquiring Cashner? It seems to me like if any of those teams thought they had a shot at Cashner, they wouldn't have even listened to offers for Santana. They might listen now.

Unless we have knowledge of what was actually offered for Willingham, do we really know if it was wrong not to trade him?

I thought I was reading that the Twins only have 37 guys right now on the 40 man (plus Perkins and Hughes). If they trade Kintzler, Abad, Nolasco (dream), Milone and/or Suzuki for minor league guys, they could have a lot of 40 man spots open. If you know you are going to protect someone from the Rule V and you have plenty of open 40 man spots, no reason not to add them early if you want to see them in September.