With Correa at Shorstop, What's Next for Twins Infield Prospects ?

22 minutes ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

I do still really like the potential of Martin, seeing how he came back from his wrist issues last year and performed, especially including the fall league.

I can TOTALLY see a 2024 that includes Lewis at 3B, Correa at SS, Lee at 2B (or flip Lee and Lewis) with Martin in one of the corner outfield spots. That wouldn't shock me at all.

I agree on Martin. People giving up on him after one poor season is irrational. Especially since he redeemed himself very well in the Fall.

As for Lewis, why can't he sustain his 2022 ML numbers? I'd be disappointed if he doesn't do close to those myself. I would agree with the OP that his injury history is "troubling."

4 hours ago, mnfireman said:

Arraez's legs couldn't handle 1B/DH last year, I don't like the odds of them holding up at 2B.

Arraez is a DH who can fill in at just about every position. He’s not an ideal DH, but I’ll take him there especially at the current price!

I love the idea of a future infield that has Brooks Lee at 3rd, Correa at SS, and Royce Lewis at 2nd! Why is Lewis not talked about more as a 2B option? I would also love to see Martin reach his potential as a gold glove left fielder, who bats lead off with a .400 obp and steals 30+ bases. I’m dreaming a bit here but it is possible!

21 hours ago, Jamie Cameron said:

Carlos Correa is a Twin! What does the move mean for Austin Martin, Brooks Lee, and Royce Lewis, a trio of high upside infield prospects?

author-tracker.gif

Image courtesy of Jeffrey Becker - USA Today Sports

Barring a dramatic third u-turn of the postseason, the Carlos Correa sweepstakes are over. Correa’s free agency played out much like a 2022 Vikings game, the Twins coming from behind to win a contest they had no right to. Fans can’t complain though, their team having linked the irresistibly charismatic duo of Correa and Byron Buxton together until at least 2028. Indications suggest Correa’s physical shouldn’t be a problem (Dr. Nick Riviera supervising).

Jokes aside, the addition creates a log jam for the Twins in the infield, with established big leaguers (Jorge Polanco, Nick Gordon, Luis Arraez ) and up and coming prospects (Royce Lewis, Brooks Lee, and Austin Martin) vying for at bats. How will the Correa signing impact the Twins high ceiling infield prospects?

Austin Martin
There are folks still high on Martin as a prospect. I am not one of them. The centerpiece of the Jose Berrios trade to the Blue Jays, Martin got off to a good start for the Twins, putting together a 122 wRC+ in his first 168 plate appearances at AA. 2022 was a struggle. In 404 plate appearances, Martin managed just an 89 wRC+, .315 SLG and committed 18 errors in 70 games at shortstop for AA Wichita, as a 23-year-old. Martin still has some value due to good on base skills and speed but he’s at the bottom of the depth chart for Twins infield prospects. I think it’s likely he’s part of a trade package for a team that thinks they can help him get back on track.

Royce Lewis
How different might the Twins offseason have looked if Lewis had remained healthy in 2022? In a tantalizing 40 plate appearances, he mashed to the tune of a 146 wRC+ and .550 SLG. Unsustainable numbers, but they provided a taste of Lewis’ incredible athleticism. Lewis also played better-than-expected defense and shortstop, managing 1 OAA in his 12 games. Projection systems like him for 2023, with Fangraphs predicting 2.3 fWAR in 330 plate appearances. The injury history is troubling, but Lewis still possesses the best athletic profile and some of the best speed in the organization. With Jose Miranda entrenched at third base, it’s possible Lewis becomes a right-handed outfield option (but that’s where he got hurt!), or he’s traded to help balance the roster.

When asked about the signing of Correa, Lewis was his typically positive, effusive self.

Brooks Lee
The Twins couldn’t believe their luck in the 2022 draft when Brooks Lee, a candidate to go number one overall, fell into their laps at number eight. Lee has dominated in his short minor league career, posting a 140 wRC+ at A+ before moving to AA at the end of the season for a handful of games. While Lee’s defensive profile is not to stick at shortstop (he’s likely a good defensive third baseman), the hit tool is legit. He should be pushing a .300 batting average in MLB as a switch hitter and likely makes his debut with the Twins in 2023. Lee could fetch a hefty return in a trade package, as he was seen as the safest high ceiling pick in the 2022 draft.

Clearly, Lee isn’t overly concerned with where he plays for the Twins, as he recently passed on to Ted Schwerzler.

If you were in the hot seat, what would do with these three infield prospects? Move them to a different position? Trade them? Feel free to leave trade proposals or positional adjustment ideas in the comments.

 

 

View full article

 

I wouldnt give up on Lewis ability to SLG .500 when/if healthy.

4 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

I doubt Miranda is "entrenched" at third......

3b: Lee
2B: Julien or Martin (who I think is a super utility OF/IF)
1B: Kiriloff or Miranda

Lewis to LF and center (no way Buck plays more than 100 games a year)

I could see a trade from that depth now, but I hope not. Also, no way those numbers for Lewis are "unsustainable." There are guys who do hit like that (I am not predicting he will, btw).

I think this is a more realistic lineup. Kiriloff's best position is supposedly 1st base and if he can hit like we all hope he will be an impact there. Unfortunately Miranda's glove does not impress me at 1st or 3rd. He could be a fill-in or DH or trade bait. If Lewis knee doesn't slow him down he could be a prototypical outfielder with the bat and glove and arm.

The Twins, like many teams, have some real talented young baseball players. These players will need to force their way on to the roster through their performances.

A few people have mentioned Alex Kirilloff but it seems like most have forgotten him or believe his road back is strewn with daunting physical challenges. I have neither heard nor read any reports on Kirilloff this offseason. If Alex returns as the guy who plays a smooth first base and rockets baseballs across the playing field like he did for a stretch last summer in St. Paul, he will be hitting in the heart of the Twins lineup. I see Kirilloff as a key to a strong Twins team.

Edouard Julien will need to prove himself in St. Paul before he receives an opportunity in Minneapolis. A strong month in Florida followed by line drives sprayed around AAA fields may push the Twins to give the young batting machine a look. He profiles as a DH until further work in the infield but if he carries his numbers forward Julien could deserve a shot.

Spring Training should be really interesting because I believe that all of Lee, Kirilloff, and Julien possess the skills a championship team needs at the plate.

2 hours ago, August J Gloop said:

I'm not trying to say he sucks. I'm trying to say that like most of 'the best college hitters in the draft' he will not likely be a great MLB hitter, just an ok/good one. But right now if he can be the center piece of a trade for a controllable top flight starter, it must be done. If he was gonna stick at short, Id say keep him, but he ain't. 

A number one draft choice ...

We traded the only prospect pitcher labeled an ace in the minors named Petty to reds for Sonny Gray and another player , yes he may not turn out as an ace but he's doing fairly well so far ...

Since all teams need pitching I personally wouldn't have given up such possible value for Sonny who has had a solid career but nothing fancy ....

Lee is a switch hitter and very valuable to a team if he does perform at the mlb level  , he'll do just fine ..

7 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

I've actually got higher hopes for Julian than I do Martin. That's more of an endorsement of Julian than a knock on Martin, but Martin does earn some knocks at this point.

In any case, I think you move Arraez ASAP while his value is still at his peak.

I hate to say it, but I agree about moving Arraez now while he is the reigning AL batting champ. I sure will miss cheering for him while he is....No, I can't do it. I like watching Arraez hit too much to trade him.

6 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

 

2023- there is no rush Martin & Lee aren't on the 40 man and Lewis will need time to get his legs under him in AAA. After that he can take over the INF utility role and we can trade Farmer.

2024- Polanco is traded, Lewis is at 2B, Lee is platoon 3B/ INF utility, Miranda platoon 3B/ 1B and Martin is OF utility.

I love the fact besides that Lee's so athletic is also that he is a switch hitter that'll be very valuable to Twins especially if we trade Polanco. 

Martin's stock went way down when they try to tinker with his swing. After he ditched that idea he started to take off again. Absolutely don't trade him now!

I can't stress enough Don't Put Lewis in The OF! I was completely against it after his 1st surgery, but after his 2nd I'm venomously against it. After continually watching Lewis's CF accident on TD, I realized that he didn't hurt his knee crashing into the wall. He hurt it by running full blast then leaping to catch the ball and as he came down on that leg that's when he hurt his knee. How can Lewis not run full blast & jump to catch a ball & be in the OF w/o getting hurt? Losing Lewis over 2 1/2 years due to these accidents is an absolute shame. Losing Lewis for good is a down right tragic & absurd.  

Right now we are thin at 3B, 2B & SS but have a tremendous glut at the corner OF/ 1B/ OF positions. Julien also will fall in this category, making Arraez  the most sense to trade because he's at his peak value and he's redundant.

'Venomously' was probably an autocorrect for 'vehemently' but upon further review, I really like ' 'venomously against' ... it sounds like a more aggressive vehemently  (oh and by the way... i totally agree with shooting for the infield for Lewis)

Gonna be going to alot of Saints games this year,  alot of name talent, Lee?- lewis- Larnach- Julien- Martin-and a few other young guys were all excited to see. Dont wanna see them signing to many 30 year olds as fillers, we are very lucky to have A.A.A. Team here, im keyed up for the season,  PLAY BALL!!!!

I think Lewis becomes a super-utility guy concentrating mainly on shortstop.  The Twins will need somone to take over for Correa when he goes down for a period or maybe can't play there anymore, and I don't see another regular-quality SS in the Twins organization after Farmer leaves or get older.

I'm not sure whether it's 2B or 3B for Lee, but I sort of think they'll stick him at one of those places and keep him there.  Maybe after seeing him in both spots in 2024.

Martin is a huge question mark.  How much does the Twins trying to change his swing account for his suckiness?  How much is the wrist/hand to blame?  I do think the Twins need to stop worrying about his lack of power and let him do what he does best, which may be a fourth OF who can get on base

I rather think it sucks that Garlick was DFA'd.  I'd almost rather do that to Larnach, but of course that would be admitting a mistake.

8 hours ago, D.C Twins said:

'Venomously' was probably an autocorrect for 'vehemently' but upon further review, I really like ' 'venomously against' ... it sounds like a more aggressive vehemently  (oh and by the way... i totally agree with shooting for the infield for Lewis)

Thank you, I appreciate the correction & support

The C4 signing sure changes thing in a lot of ways. I wouldn't trade any of the guys mentioned. Gordon and Martin as our super utility players for the next 5+ years sounds pretty good to me.

Correa, Miranda, Lee, Lewis, Juilien and Polanco holding down 2nd, 3rd and short for the next 5+ years again sounds pretty good to me.

WHY are so many in such a hurry to move on from Polanco? He's been our best, most reliable performer probably the last 3-5 seasons. His contract options are dirt cheap...

Arreaz and Kirilloff at 1st? Wrist...Knees,,zero slug.. Not much on the way, that I can think of, in the minors. Miranda may need to end up at 1st as the others make their way to the bigs.

15 hours ago, mnfireman said:

He could just as well have hurt the knee chasing a flyball to short left or center from SS. It was a fluke injury. But, yes, I would rather see him in the INF, but last year's rash of injuries required putting healthy bodies where they could.

INF is much different than INF. The trajectory  & velocity of a ball where you run & jump like that in the INF, I don't think is possible. Any flyballs to the OF that INFers handle are bloopers. Also Lewis wasn't put in the OF was because we lacked bodies. At that time we had ample amount of capable OFers. Immediately after Lewis went down, Miranda was brought in to help out at 3B/ 1B. That should have been the role of Lewis plus he could have subbed also at SS & 2B w/o needing to go to the OF to get his ABs.

I'm not an expert in this kind of sports medicine. But I have this gut feeling like you get when you are exposed to a dangerous condition that something bad is going to happen. And the fact he got hurt so quickly proves to me that it wasn't a fluke. That it was a rational outcome of a proposed situation

21 minutes ago, weitz41 said:

The C4 signing sure changes thing in a lot of ways. I wouldn't trade any of the guys mentioned. Gordon and Martin as our super utility players for the next 5+ years sounds pretty good to me.

Correa, Miranda, Lee, Lewis, Juilien and Polanco holding down 2nd, 3rd and short for the next 5+ years again sounds pretty good to me.

WHY are so many in such a hurry to move on from Polanco? He's been our best, most reliable performer probably the last 3-5 seasons. His contract options are dirt cheap...

Arreaz and Kirilloff at 1st? Wrist...Knees,,zero slug.. Not much on the way, that I can think of, in the minors. Miranda may need to end up at 1st as the others make their way to the bigs.

Agree with you Weitz, although Julien is questionable at 2B (not that he can't grow into that position) he's better profiled at 1B.

17 hours ago, August J Gloop said:

Lee strikes me as a perfect trade candidate. Get him out while he still seems like a prospect who could center in a top level pitching trade. I'm pretty sure AA will quickly disabuse folks of that notion. He's likely to be a serviceable major leaguer, but not one you'd trade for Sandy Alcantara. 

Fangraphs has his hit tool rated at 60 and MLB.com at 65.  

The only one I would keep around is brooks lee. This is my idea.

1B: Miranda 2B: Polanco SS: Correa 3B: Lee DH: Arraez

Trade Lewis, Martin, Kepler, Pagan, and PTNL to the Marlins for Pablo Lopez and Edward Cabrera (you could possibly trade Wallner to as the PTNL I know the Marlins want bats).

Also why does everyone want to trade Arraez. He was arguably our best hitter aside from Correa. He did not go down for injury like Buxton did, he could be a solid piece to keep around and if we say extend him now and keeps this performance up we could have a great on base hitter for dirt cheap.

 "With Jose Miranda entrenched at third base, it’s possible Lewis becomes a right-handed outfield option (but that’s where he got hurt!), or he’s traded to help balance the roster."

Is Miranda entrenched at third base?  I mean he was decent hitting, but he was a rookie, and some times they fizzle.  He also was not a good defender overall.  Maybe he does better at 3rd this year, but if Lewis can defend 3rd much better and hit better, why would we move him to OF?  Put Miranda as DH, or trade him if need be.  

In terms of Lee, he can play 2nd as well, or move to OF most likely.  His bat appears so elite I would not look to trade him.  If you can hit elite we can find a spot. 

2 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

INF is much different than INF. The trajectory  & velocity of a ball where you run & jump like that in the INF, I don't think is possible. Any flyballs to the OF that INFers handle are bloopers. Also Lewis wasn't put in the OF was because we lacked bodies. At that time we had ample amount of capable OFers. Immediately after Lewis went down, Miranda was brought in to help out at 3B/ 1B. That should have been the role of Lewis plus he could have subbed also at SS & 2B w/o needing to go to the OF to get his ABs.

I'm not an expert in this kind of sports medicine. But I have this gut feeling like you get when you are exposed to a dangerous condition that something bad is going to happen. And the fact he got hurt so quickly proves to me that it wasn't a fluke. That it was a rational outcome of a proposed situation

Here's one by Correa that's close.

https://www.facebook.com/BallySportsNorth/videos/carlos-correa-elevates-for-the-great-catch/1712103212493289/

2 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

INF is much different than INF. The trajectory  & velocity of a ball where you run & jump like that in the INF, I don't think is possible. Any flyballs to the OF that INFers handle are bloopers. Also Lewis wasn't put in the OF was because we lacked bodies. At that time we had ample amount of capable OFers. Immediately after Lewis went down, Miranda was brought in to help out at 3B/ 1B. That should have been the role of Lewis plus he could have subbed also at SS & 2B w/o needing to go to the OF to get his ABs.

I'm not an expert in this kind of sports medicine. But I have this gut feeling like you get when you are exposed to a dangerous condition that something bad is going to happen. And the fact he got hurt so quickly proves to me that it wasn't a fluke. That it was a rational outcome of a proposed situation

I call b.s. on this.  Have you never seen a SS run full speed for a pop-up in foul territory and end up wrapped around a guardrail?  And I don't care if it's a pop-up or a screaming line drive.  Running full speed and jumping for a ball remain the same.  And just who were the "ample amount of capable OFers"?  Garlic?  Gordon?  Larnach?

2 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Every time the rooster crows..., the sun comes up. The Rooster must be very powerful.

 

Just because you want something to be so, doesn't mean it actually is. Just because you think that it'd be convenient to have Lewis play OF doesn't mean that you can ignore the good possibility that he could very likely get seriously hurt.  Running full blast, leaping and coming down at that angle on that leg regularly, you can count on something will happen to someone who has had 2 knee surgeries. Why risk it?

You may know absolutely nothing about electricity. But if you put your finger in a electric outlet & get a jolt. Even though you know nothing about electricity, you have the common sense to not to do it again. 

1 hour ago, mnfireman said:

Here's one by Correa that's close.

https://www.facebook.com/BallySportsNorth/videos/carlos-correa-elevates-for-the-great-catch/1712103212493289/

It was a nice play but IMO it doesn't come close to the impact on the leg that Lewis experienced when he made that catch and that many good OFers make regularly.

Outfielders get hurt at a much lower rate than infielders. What's more likely is that a young man too eager to get on with his career exaggerated the progress of his rehab and was still vulnerable to reinjury while he was playing. (Or perhaps his first surgery was not sufficient). Lewis is fast and seems to have the bat speed to be a high OPS kind of player. He projects to be a rangy outfielder with a strong, accurate arm. It would help the Twins to get another long-term high end bat in the lineup. Moving him to a Left/Center/DH rotation with Bux and LHH LF could keep everybody fresh.

What my point on Lee is that his projected hit tool is 100% valuable right now, but it's just as likely to not be that in actual practice. If good pitchers are available for him, do it. Not shop him to anyone for anything. If I say Alacantarra and Kim N says Lee, I'm still talking is my point. If he gets to AA and ops 1.002, I say good for you, kid and live with it. Hopefully Alcantarra is winning another cy young.

22 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

I doubt Miranda is "entrenched" at third......

3b: Lee
2B: Julien or Martin (who I think is a super utility OF/IF)
1B: Kiriloff or Miranda

Lewis to LF and center (no way Buck plays more than 100 games a year)

I could see a trade from that depth now, but I hope not. Also, no way those numbers for Lewis are "unsustainable." There are guys who do hit like that (I am not predicting he will, btw).

No reason to herald Miranda as entrenched at 3rd base.  I bet both Lee and Lewis will have a lot more defensive value at that position than him. Miranda long term is a guy who occasionally plays some third  but mostly DH and 1B.

1 hour ago, Doctor Gast said:

It was a nice play but IMO it doesn't come close to the impact on the leg that Lewis experienced when he made that catch and that many good OFers make regularly.

This one is closer to the Lewis play. I'm just trying to show that not all plays at SS are routine ?. An additional threat on these types of catches are collisions with OF's, of which we see ever year. Much like Buxton he plays aggressively and the team can't put him in a protective bubble. 

https://www.mlb.com/video/akil-baddoo-lines-out-to-shortstop-jorge-mateo

16 hours ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

I hate to say it, but I agree about moving Arraez now while he is the reigning AL batting champ. I sure will miss cheering for him while he is....No, I can't do it. I like watching Arraez hit too much to trade him.

If they trade arraez , I'm really thinking I won't be a twins fan for my entire life ...

Or at least until we get different operations managers in our FO ...

Buxtons defense and arraez approach in hitting make these 2 the most exciting players on the team ...

28 minutes ago, Blyleven2011 said:

If they trade arraez , I'm really thinking I won't be a twins fan for my entire life ...

Or at least until we get different operations managers in our FO ...

Buxtons defense and arraez approach in hitting make these 2 the most exciting players on the team ...

I agree, plus those rare times Buck hits a triple. 

Okay with Correa set up for SS one would think that Farmer would be on the move with his very resonable 3.15 mil contract... Or keep him and move "several" 2B.   Polanco should be moved right now as he still has a reasonable contract and should get good value in a trade. Gordon should take over at 2B... still young and has shown he is capable. Playing there everyday should improve his defense ...

On the Market "should be" 

Farmer, Polanco, Gordon, Martin, Larnach, Kiriloff, Cellistino, Walner, Gallo..... not all should be moved but ....

Go get and upgrade in the pitching staff.... or at very least clear the deck and get quality prospects .. 7 guys for 2 spots makes little sense for the infield or the OF. 

Boston is needing IF... that might be a place to start... 

19 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

The Twins, like many teams, have some real talented young baseball players. These players will need to force their way on to the roster through their performances.

A few people have mentioned Alex Kirilloff but it seems like most have forgotten him or believe his road back is strewn with daunting physical challenges. I have neither heard nor read any reports on Kirilloff this offseason. If Alex returns as the guy who plays a smooth first base and rockets baseballs across the playing field like he did for a stretch last summer in St. Paul, he will be hitting in the heart of the Twins lineup. I see Kirilloff as a key to a strong Twins team.

Edouard Julien will need to prove himself in St. Paul before he receives an opportunity in Minneapolis. A strong month in Florida followed by line drives sprayed around AAA fields may push the Twins to give the young batting machine a look. He profiles as a DH until further work in the infield but if he carries his numbers forward Julien could deserve a shot.

Spring Training should be really interesting because I believe that all of Lee, Kirilloff, and Julien possess the skills a championship team needs at the plate.

Kirilloff reaching his ceiling would be enormous for the Twins future! Like Buxton (who has the ability to be the best player in baseball) it’s really hard to imagine him stringing multiple 140 game seasons together! His upside is enormous and he’s a championship player if he reaches it!