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  • Report: Darvish Decision Expected This Week, Twins In Consideration

    Cody Christie

    By Cody Christie

    Free agency has been slow moving this off-season. Few of the top free agents have signed and there has even been talk about collusion among MLB’s teams. Realistically, teams are smarter about the way they spend money and this year’s crop of free agents has plenty of flaws.

    The Twins have been tied to Yu Darvish from the beginning. Minnesota’s front office hasn’t been shy about mentioned their intentions of trying the hook the biggest fish on the free agent market. A thrilling conclusion could be coming and Twins’ fans could have an answer as early as this week.

    Image courtesy of Dennis Wierzbicki-USA TODAY Sports

    Twins Video

    Darvish Decision Looming

    Jon Morosi of Fox Sports and MLB Network is reporting that Darvish is expected to make his decision this week. He also adds that the Twins are one of the teams still in discussion with the star pitcher.

    https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/956199322433064960

    It is interesting that his only note about a current team is the Twins. However, there have been plenty of other teams connected to Darvish in recent weeks. The list of teams includes the Twins, Cubs, Rangers, Dodgers and Brewers.

    Gimenez Signing

    Former Twins catcher Chris Gimenez signed a minor league deal with the Chicago Cubs this week. Sporting News compared this move to when the Cubs brought in David Ross to be paired with Jon Lester in 2015. Gimenez worked with Darvish in Texas and helped the pitcher on his way back from Tommy John surgery. Darvish has also called Gimenez his “all-time favorite catcher.”

    https://twitter.com/MikeBerardino/status/955616565264879617

    Five-Year Offer

    Darvish will turn 32 next August and he has only pitched one season of more than 200 innings. This might make it tough for team’s swallow a long-term deal. With many big free agent signings, there is some “dead” money at the end of the deal where the player isn’t playing at the same level as prior to his contract signing.

    According to reports, Darvish has at least one five-year offer on the table. There are still multiple teams in the mix for Darvish’s services but it sounds like his decision will be made by the end of the week.

    https://twitter.com/jcrasnick/status/955526201686323201

    What are your thoughts on the latest Darvish news? Will he be in a Twins uniform by the end of the week? Leave a COMMENT and start the discussion.

    Cody Christie is a Twins writer and content contributor. His writing can be found exclusively at Twins Daily and his voice can be heard on radio stations throughout the Upper Midwest. Outside of the Twins, he is a father, high school teacher, and avid runner.
    Follow Cody Christie on Twitter: nodaktwinsfan

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    Featured Comments

    Otto von Ballpark

    Otto von Ballpark 20,320

  • Community Leader

    • Posted

    I'm in this corner. I like a deal and this is full on retail. That earlier comment about poaching on the end of Grenke's deal sounds like a deal

    Greinke was worth 6.3 bWAR in 2017. Arizona will not be selling him for less (in terms of talent + assumed salary) than a Darvish FA contract.

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    Thrylos

    Thrylos 8,325

  • Old-Timey Member

    • Posted

     

    Is there anyway that Darvish would take two years 28 mil per year or $56 million guaranteed and add a third year mutual option which either side could decline from the Twins.

     

    Allegedly he already has a 5 year offer on the table, which I suspect guarantees at least double of that $56 million...

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    Doomtints

    Doomtints 2,816

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    Cotillo and others have been suggesting it's Cubs vs. Brewers (possibly because of yesterday's rumors that Twins might be backing off due to price tag), so maybe Morosi was just reiterating that the Twins were still in it too?

     

    Are the Twins really surprised Darvish would be expensive? Wouldn't backing off now due to this reason be kind of, well, daft?

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    Riverbrian

    Riverbrian 32,096

  • Old-Timey Member

    • Posted

    I will silently eat my plate of crow if the Twins get him. :) The signs just don't look promising to me. FWIW I hope I am wrong.

    If I was forced to guess. BTW... I’m not forced to guess yet here I am guessing anyway.

     

    I’m guessing the Rangers swoop and piss me off.

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    Riverbrian

    Riverbrian 32,096

  • Old-Timey Member

    • Posted

    Easy enough for you to say. When Andy Benes met Giminez, he didn’t understand the big deal about him, so he directly asked him, “Who do you think you are?”Giminez answered with a smirk, “I’m Chris Giminez!”

    Andy Benes asked me the same question. I replied back “Mr. Big Stuff”.

     

    True Story... except it probably wasn’t Andy Benes.

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    tvagle

    tvagle 2,431

  • Verified Member

    • Posted (edited)

    Signing this week is a plus for the Twins...next week will be all-SuperBowl all-the-time, with it in Minnesota any news of a Darvish signing would get lost...it's either this week or the week before spring training

     

    It's also quite possible that the Cubbies will make it a clean sweep of high priority Twins Targets

     

    Duensing....Giminez and Darvish

     

    Me Thinkee it will be Greinke if Darvish fails

     

    It's time the Twins deal with the D-Backs for something other than a backup catcher

     

    Gordon

    Pearson

    Baneulos (what's a D-Back trade without a catcher)

    We eat $100M on Greinke contract

     

    Edited by tvagle
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    Otto von Ballpark

    Otto von Ballpark 20,320

  • Community Leader

    • Posted

    With deferred money, the present-day value of Greinke's contract was considered 6 years, $194 mil.  Of that, 4 years and roughly $130 mil remain.

     

    If Darvish is getting a similar deal on the FA market, I don't see why Arizona would be eating cash and taking back less than elite prospects to move Greinke.  Greinke is a few years older, but with only 4 years left on the deal and coming off a 6.3 bWAR season, that helps mitigate the risk quite a bit.

     

    FWIW, Greinke has a limited no-trade which includes 15 clubs.  Even if that list doesn't include the Twins, it significantly depresses his value on the trade market and thus increases the value of Arizona simply keeping him.

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    tvagle

    tvagle 2,431

  • Verified Member

    • Posted (edited)

    One Word...They want to re-sign JD Martinez

     

    They will eat money back in the deal if it clears enough to re-sign JD

    (or at least that's my take on this hypothetical starting point)

    Edited by tvagle
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    Riverbrian

    Riverbrian 32,096

  • Old-Timey Member

    • Posted

     

    With deferred money, the present-day value of Greinke's contract was considered 6 years, $194 mil.  Of that, 4 years and roughly $130 mil remain.

     

    If Darvish is getting a similar deal on the FA market, I don't see why Arizona would be eating cash and taking back less than elite prospects to move Greinke.  Greinke is a few years older, but with only 4 years left on the deal and coming off a 6.3 bWAR season, that helps mitigate the risk quite a bit.

     

    FWIW, Greinke has a limited no-trade which includes 15 clubs.  Even if that list doesn't include the Twins, it significantly depresses his value on the trade market and thus increases the value of Arizona simply keeping him.

     

    Rumors are rumors but there are rumors the D-Backs are shopping him. True? Not true? IDK

     

    My theory... they would have to eat cash because they already went over value to outbid others to sign him. 

     

     

     

     

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    Otto von Ballpark

    Otto von Ballpark 20,320

  • Community Leader

    • Posted

    One Word...They want to re-sign JD Martinez

     

    They will eat money back in the deal if it clears enough to re-sign JD

    (or at least that's my take on this hypothetical starting point)

    It is a cute theory, but that's about it. Why would Arizona eat $30 mil to get rid of Greinke's remaining 4/130, just to sign a bad defensive corner OF for 5/125 or more? That's not saving money at all, and arguably a talent downgrade.

     

    I understand that they have explored some options with Greinke, but I would shocked if they found this proposed deal acceptable.

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    Otto von Ballpark

    Otto von Ballpark 20,320

  • Community Leader

    • Posted

    Rumors are rumors but there are rumors the D-Backs are shopping him. True? Not true? IDK

     

    My theory... they would have to eat cash because they already went over value to outbid others to sign him.

    MLBTR has reported zero Greinke information for the last month:

     

    https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/zack-greinke/

     

    I really doubt they are that desperate to move him. In fact, if/when Darvish signs for a comparable amount, Greinke's remaining contract will hardly seem "over value" anymore.

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    ashbury

    ashbury 48,546

  • Old-Timey Member

    • Posted

    Me Thinkee it will be Greinke if Darvish fails

     

    It's time the Twins deal with the D-Backs for something other than a backup catcher

     

    Gordon

    Pearson

    Baneulos (what's a D-Back trade without a catcher)

    We eat $100M on Greinke contract

    I applaud creative ways to use $100M across four years in the here-and-now, if we think money above that for Darvish is "dead money", and if it turns out Darvish himself can't be signed even for more.

     

    In addition to the points already raised, I want to add a touchy subject: Greinke has moved around a lot. Most recently, the Dodgers, who can afford to sign anyone they want (they gave Kershaw-money to Kershaw), said "nah, we're good" when they had the chance to re-sign Greinke after a three Cy-candidate season tenure. I recall him being considered "aloof" early in his career; at age 34 he's probably a different guy by now, but I still have to wonder if he's thought to be not worth the trouble, if Arizona is now known to have him "available" in the right trade after a couple of years in close proximity to him. I don't overweight clubhouse chemistry, but it's a factor to consider.

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    bird

    bird 6,083

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    Meh....we were told for years they were in on Cubans. Being "in on" a FA means little, imo.

     

     

    Well, let's be clear about what we were "told". There's a huge difference between telling reporters you're sending evaluators to a workout for someone and that the team has an interest in them, versus saying someone "is a priority". You won't be able to come up with a single example of someone with the Twins saying the Twins are "in on" a bid for any of those Cuban players. I don't think there's any real similarity with what's transpiring with Darvish, do you?

     

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    Lee-The-Twins-Fan

    Lee-The-Twins-Fan 261

  • Provisional Member

    • Posted

     

    Signing this week is a plus for the Twins...next week will be all-SuperBowl all-the-time, with it in Minnesota any news of a Darvish signing would get lost...it's either this week or the week before spring training

     

    It's also quite possible that the Cubbies will make it a clean sweep of high priority Twins Targets

     

    Duensing....Giminez and Darvish

     

    Me Thinkee it will be Greinke if Darvish fails

     

    It's time the Twins deal with the D-Backs for something other than a backup catcher

     

    Gordon

    Pearson

    Baneulos (what's a D-Back trade without a catcher)

    We eat $100M on Greinke contract

    If I were the D-Backs, I wouldn't make that trade. Greinke is worth a lot more.

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    mikelink45

    mikelink45 10,958

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    The Twins have many guys that might become #3's in a year or two. At some point you have to address the problem - Front of the Rotation arms. 

    That is true and I hope Berrios and Romero will move to that level.  Old arms falling from the top of the rotation interest me less than those on the way up.  We have hired a plethora of pitching coaches from mlb to minor leagues and then put more coaches overseeing those coaches.  Let them earn their money.  All aces start as prospects. 

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    mikelink45

    mikelink45 10,958

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    The Twins will still have those guys if they sign Darvish, no?

    Sure and we will have a huge contract that will go on as Darvish diminishes in talent and the younger players will need to be paid and extended.  I will never advocate for long term, huge contracts for players in their 30's.  If the contract starts in their 20s and goes into their 30s yes.  But I have watched too many of these great signings go bust.  Paying a lot of money for what they did in their prime is only good when you have them in their prime.  Look at Pujols.   This article was written in 2012, but captures my total reluctance - https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/baseballs-worst-contracts-starting-pitchers/  Beckett, Lackey, Lincecum, Wilson, Buerhle...all looked good in the years before the contracts.  As far as I am concerned Darvish is already starting to show signs of slipping. 

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    kab21

    kab21 2,459

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    That is true and I hope Berrios and Romero will move to that level.  Old arms falling from the top of the rotation interest me less than those on the way up.  We have hired a plethora of pitching coaches from mlb to minor leagues and then put more coaches overseeing those coaches.  Let them earn their money.  All aces start as prospects. 

    I will take both personally. I have hopes for Berrios. Romero has the upside but he is very raw and has some significant injury concerns. I am uncertain if he will last more than a full season or two as a starter.

    Of course, all aces start as prospects but not all prospects have the upside of an ace. Some come out of nowhere and surprise but the Twins mostly have MOR types in the system. You are going to be waiting a long time to put a strong playoff caliber rotation with the Twins system. And that is a problem imo.

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    kab21

    kab21 2,459

  • Verified Member

    • Posted

     

    Sure and we will have a huge contract that will go on as Darvish diminishes in talent and the younger players will need to be paid and extended.  I will never advocate for long term, huge contracts for players in their 30's.  If the contract starts in their 20s and goes into their 30s yes.  But I have watched too many of these great signings go bust.  Paying a lot of money for what they did in their prime is only good when you have them in their prime.  Look at Pujols.   This article was written in 2012, but captures my total reluctance - https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/baseballs-worst-contracts-starting-pitchers/  Beckett, Lackey, Lincecum, Wilson, Buerhle...all looked good in the years before the contracts.  As far as I am concerned Darvish is already starting to show signs of slipping. 

    At some point you have to spend money. 

    What signs of slipping do you see? The swstr%, velocity and K rates are all great. Or do you mean ERA...

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    Squirrel

    Squirrel 37,605

  • Community Leader

    • Posted

     

    That is true and I hope Berrios and Romero will move to that level.  Old arms falling from the top of the rotation interest me less than those on the way up.  We have hired a plethora of pitching coaches from mlb to minor leagues and then put more coaches overseeing those coaches.  Let them earn their money.  All aces start as prospects. 

    So, we hire Darvish and he's our front-end this year, maybe next ... while Berrios and Romero are moving up. And maybe even the third year we'll have 3 that are 1-2 as Darvish starts his decline and the others are reaching their peak. The thing is, Berrios and Romero becoming front-enders isn't a guarantee. We hope they will be the front-end guys, but that won't be this season or quite possibly not next, either. Meanwhile, the clock is ticking on Sano, Buxton, Rosario ... and the rest of our core. Putting off for tomorrow is, imo, not productive for today.

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