Winnah

His runs were unearned, Lewis error was the reason they happened.

Walks and errors were the Twins gremlins again tonight.

Pagan sure loves those 30 pitch innings doesn't he.

Just now, AceWrigley said:

Pagan sure loves those 30 pitch innings doesn't he.

Yeah, I'm sure he does...

usually he doesn't get out of there with so few.

Just now, AceWrigley said:

Pagan sure loves those 30 pitch innings doesn't he.

He likes "earn" that paycheck.  Doesn't want to cheat the boss by being too efficient!

1 minute ago, RpR said:

His runs were unearned, Lewis error was the reason they happened.

Walks and errors were the Twins gremlins again tonight.

? Did Lewis somehow misplay that from SS over the fence ala Jose Conseco? One run had to be earned

3 minutes ago, Eris said:

There was a nice write up in the WSJ comparing him to Rod Carew and Tony Olivia. He has a K% < 10. Think of him as a Luiz Arraez but with speed and a good arm. He was at Oregon State with Larnach when they won the college World Series. 

Worst  thing you can do to a young player in the MLB.  Compare him to a Rod Carew  or Tony O.  Tough enough to be regular, much less have the pressure of performing like those two.

Pagan, only 22 pitches to get through the 9th, he's improving.

2 minutes ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

? Did Lewis somehow misplay that from SS over the fence ala Jose Conseco? One run had to be earned

Box score shows they were both unearned. Not sure how that was scored.

Edit: yeah ... if they'd have gotten Rosario out instead of the error, they'd have been out of the inning before the HR, so both unearned

Just now, Richie the Rally Goat said:

? Did Lewis somehow misplay that from SS over the fence ala Jose Conseco? One run had to be earned

It wasn't, but it's not like Lewis gave up the HR either.

3 minutes ago, AceWrigley said:

Pagan sure loves those 30 pitch innings doesn't he.

He faced two batters he should not have except for an error.

2 minutes ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

? Did Lewis somehow misplay that from SS over the fence ala Jose Conseco? One run had to be earned

No error no batter, simple as that.

2 minutes ago, wsnydes said:

It wasn't, but it's not like Lewis gave up the HR either.

They would have been out of the inning before the HR had that play been made. I think that's how that was scored, maybe.

1 minute ago, RpR said:

He faced two batters he should not have except for an error.

The HR didn't exactly help his own cause.

 

 

6 minutes ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

? Did Lewis somehow misplay that from SS over the fence ala Jose Conseco? One run had to be earned

The HR came with 2 outs. Makes both runs unearned.

To determine "earned" or "unearned," reconstruct the inning without the error(s).

In this case, the inning would have been over prior to any runs scoring. All runs unearned. Had the error check with 1 or 0 outs, then one run would have been earned.

 

 

That's the official scoring protocol

...not my opinion.

Pagan blows.

 

1 minute ago, Squirrel said:

They would have been out of the inning before the HR had that play been made.

I know, which is why both runs were unearned, but Lewis didn't give up the HR either.

Pagan simply could have picked his SS up and got the next guy out, but he didn't.

It seemed after the big inning, the Twins lost their focus. A less than stellar outing for Jax (after inducing a HUGE GDP), errors by Duran and Lewis and a PB by Jeffers. They played good defense against Houston, but didn’t do anything else right. I hope the letdown is just a blip.  

1 minute ago, wsnydes said:

I know, which is why both runs were unearned, but Lewis didn't give up the HR either.

Pagan simply could have picked his SS up and got the next guy out, but he didn't.

Sure ... but ... still ... Lewis makes that play, there'd have been no HR. It's a quibble to me, though ... it's a mark in the win column and that's all I care about in the end. Not gonna go all whiny over the things that went wrong  

Twins lost a game to Oakland last year without Oakland even getting a hit due to errors so blaming the pitcher is a straw-man argument.

Just now, Squirrel said:

Sure ... but ... still ... Lewis makes that play, there'd have been no HR. It's a quibble to me, though ... it's a mark in the win column and that's all I care about in the end. Not gonna go all whiny over the things that went wrong  

It's a quibble to me as well.  Pagan compounded the error by giving up a HR.  I guess that's what I'm trying to say.

1 minute ago, wsnydes said:

It's a quibble to me as well.  Pagan compounded the error by giving up a HR.  I guess that's what I'm trying to say.

Right.

It doesn't count as an "earned run" but IMO that doesn't excuse the HR

 

51 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CLE/CLE198409280.shtml

 

This is the game that came to my mind but I didn't dare post it until this one ended.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CLE/CLE200108050.shtml

I'll never forget seeing Lou Piniella's face in about the 8th inning or so. It was the most sour look I've ever seen on a person. He knew what was going to happen and he knew that it would happen no matter what he did. BTW, no major league team has ever won a game after trailing by 13 runs.

1 minute ago, USAFChief said:

Right.

It doesn't count as an "earned run" but IMO that doesn't excuse the HR

 

Correct.  Pagan certainly isn't blameless.  He still could have gotten out of the inning unscathed.  He didn't.

One interesting Official scoring note. Runs scored can be unearned against a team, but earned against a pitcher. Referencing Cleveland’s big comeback against Chicago earlier this week—Hendriks came in after the club had committed an error in the ninth. He yielded a hit and the tying grand slam. The runs were all unearned against the White Sox staff, but the two runs charged to Hendriks were charged as earned because the error occurred before he entered the game. 

2 minutes ago, Nine of twelve said:

This is the game that came to my mind but I didn't dare post it until this one ended.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CLE/CLE200108050.shtml

I'll never forget seeing Lou Piniella's face in about the 8th inning or so. It was the most sour look I've ever seen on a person. He knew what was going to happen and he knew that it would happen no matter what he did. BTW, no major league team has ever won a game after trailing by 13 runs.

The difference being, I didn't get physically sick or pound my forehead into the kitchen table when Seattle blew a huge lead..

 

2 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

The difference being, I didn't get physically sick or pound my forehead into the kitchen table when Seattle blew a huge lead..

 

Was that the frying pans doing?

Here’s one involving the Twins:

https://www.twincities.com/2009/07/20/twins-blow-10-run-lead-lose-14-13-to-as/amp/