Trade idea: Polanco to the Mariners

[Tim]

With signs pointing toward a likely Byron Buxton trade, it's safe to say that realistically competing in 2022 is not happening.

That said, shopping around Jorge Polanco isn't that far fetched if the front office has their focus on 2023 and beyond.

I posed this trade a few weeks ago on MLB Trade Rumors chat with Anthony Franco.

For those not aware, Noelvi Marte, currently a shortstop, is a consensus top 15 prospect in all of baseball. Plenty of reports out there if you wanna read up on him.

Matt Brash is a starter that broke out this year and sky rocketed up "Top 100" lists at the end of the season. While he is a bit lesser known compared to a George Kirby or Emerson Hancock, the spin rates are ridiculous and fits the pitching profile that Falvey has targeted. Nice article here to get some more info on him.

Personally, I love this deal .. Regardless of a Buxton trade or not, this is definitely something to consider if you are in the Twins front office.

Would love to hear your guys thoughts!

 

(I've wrote about about Polanco in the past as well and you can check it out here)

[Brandon]

If we trade Buxton we may as well just blow the whole thing up.  I wont be interested in following the team for a few years so we may as well start all over with a clean slate and a team of their guys so the front office can show they are inept and we can get new front office people who would be smart enough to extend a Buxton on a 7 year 100 million extension.  

[tony&rodney]

This might be reasonable if the Twins were going to cut payroll to $50 million and start over. Prospects are interesting to follow. Yes, both of these guys are really talented and interesting, but also a long way from becoming Jorge Polanco. Does anyone remember the highest paid foreign signed player from just a few years back named Wander Javier? Where are you, Dusty?

[Vanimal46]

Polanco will certainly bring back more in a trade return than Arraez. Also, this is probably Polanco’s peak in player value. I would like to keep Polanco and trade Arraez instead if we are still attempting to compete in 2022. However, that belief to compete is highly dependent on Buxton staying with the Twins. If he’s traded, then yes, make a pivot and sell high on Polanco, Garver, and Rogers. 

[nicksaviking]

56 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

This might be reasonable if the Twins were going to cut payroll to $50 million and start over. Prospects are interesting to follow. Yes, both of these guys are really talented and interesting, but also a long way from becoming Jorge Polanco. Does anyone remember the highest paid foreign signed player from just a few years back named Wander Javier? Where are you, Dusty?

Well just because the Twins didn't nail their international player doesn't mean they should stop trying. 

Vlad Guerrero Jr, Ronald Accuna, Fernando Tatis Jr, Jose Rameriz, Juan Soto, Wander Franco, Xander Bogaerts. The elite players in the league were largely acquired this way.

Oh, also, Jorge Polanco......

[Einheri]

With no pitching in sight short term, I'm all for blowing it all up.

But, get rid of current ownership and management at the same time.

[chpettit19]

Agree that if the Twins aren't going to compete in 2022 then trading Polanco is an interesting idea. This specific trade would be intriguing to me and I can't say I'd be too upset about it, if, in fact, the Twins decided to reload for 2023 and beyond. My preference is still to take a swing in 2022, but agree that extending Buxton is huge for not just 2022, but 2023 and beyond and should dictate the rest of their moves. If I move Polanco I'd want a SS in return as I think Lewis is Buxton's replacement in CF in this scenario. Marte sounds like a Lewis type defender at SS, and I'd prefer better than that, but wouldn't be broken up about it if his bat turns into what it is projected to.

[Tim]

8 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Agree that if the Twins aren't going to compete in 2022 then trading Polanco is an interesting idea. This specific trade would be intriguing to me and I can't say I'd be too upset about it, if, in fact, the Twins decided to reload for 2023 and beyond. My preference is still to take a swing in 2022, but agree that extending Buxton is huge for not just 2022, but 2023 and beyond and should dictate the rest of their moves. If I move Polanco I'd want a SS in return as I think Lewis is Buxton's replacement in CF in this scenario. Marte sounds like a Lewis type defender at SS, and I'd prefer better than that, but wouldn't be broken up about it if his bat turns into what it is projected to.

Yeah long term he proobbbably moves to 3rd ... Hard to tell with a 20 year old kid who's got plus athleticism. 

Well in this scenario, hypothetically, if the Twins do end up moving Buxton, to say the Miami Marlins, Kahlil Watson is a shortstop .... Hypothetically.

[Doctor Gast]

Polanco has just recovered from his bad ankles, he's  hasn't put in a full healthy season yet. So his stock will go much higher, he's MVP caliber. Although these 2 are very good prospects that fit a need, I wouldn't make the trade. It makes much more sense to sign Buxton and keep Polanco. If they won't sign Buxton then heck blow up the team trade everybody.  Give everybody a good deal by dealing our players on their low side. Flood our roster with new players that we can't fit on our 40 man, teams will have a field day reaping the terrific potential undeveloped prospects that we can't protect. The whole MLB will be happy except me but at that point I wouldn't care.

[tony&rodney]

46 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Well just because the Twins didn't nail their international player doesn't mean they should stop trying. 

Correct, and the Twins should be even more active in signing international players. I only meant that prospects like Wander Javier or Joe Benson, etc. are still volatile, although valuable and not to equated with established all star players. I do think Seattle's prospects are good. Regrets if this came off wrong.

[howeda7]

2 hours ago, Brandon said:

If we trade Buxton we may as well just blow the whole thing up.  I wont be interested in following the team for a few years so we may as well start all over with a clean slate and a team of their guys so the front office can show they are inept and we can get new front office people who would be smart enough to extend a Buxton on a 7 year 100 million extension.  

Pretty much this. The next best option is to root for them to crash and burn hard so either Falvey is fired, the team is sold, or both. Gutting things down to a $50 million payroll might be the only way the can break even with the 8K average attendance they'll have.

[nicksaviking]

24 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Correct, and the Twins should be even more active in signing international players. I only meant that prospects like Wander Javier or Joe Benson, etc. are still volatile, although valuable and not to equated with established all star players. I do think Seattle's prospects are good. Regrets if this came off wrong.

Yeah, no disagreement.  

But I'm starting to think that the international prospects, at least the top ones, have as of late been the most reliable.

[nicholas Anderson]

Saw Brash and Kirby pitch against Wichita. Both are excellent. With J. Rod., Seattle seems to have quite the farm system. If the Twins make any trades this offseason, I would love them to make a trade with Seattle.

[Cap'n Piranha]

1 hour ago, Doctor Gast said:

Polanco has just recovered from his bad ankles, he's  hasn't put in a full healthy season yet. So his stock will go much higher, he's MVP caliber. Although these 2 are very good prospects that fit a need, I wouldn't make the trade. It makes much more sense to sign Buxton and keep Polanco. If they won't sign Buxton then heck blow up the team trade everybody.  Give everybody a good deal by dealing our players on their low side. Flood our roster with new players that we can't fit on our 40 man, teams will have a field day reaping the terrific potential undeveloped prospects that we can't protect. The whole MLB will be happy except me but at that point I wouldn't care.

And as we all know, ankles once healed after injury become invulnerable to further injury.

[Doctor Gast]

8 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

And as we all know, ankles once healed after injury become invulnerable to further injury.

Not if you remove what is causing the problem which is playing SS.  He was having problems every year while playing SS now that he's playing 2B he hasn't had any problems. His ankles have been getting stronger as well as his performance.. Keep him away from SS and there'll be no problems with his ankles.

[Tim]

8 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

Not if you remove what is causing the problem which is playing SS.  He was having problems every year while playing SS now that he's playing 2B he hasn't had any problems. His ankles have been getting stronger as well as his performance.. Keep him away from SS and there'll be no problems with his ankles.

So your telling me the only reason he had chronic ankle issues, that required 2 different surgeries, was because he was playing shortstop and now that he's at 2nd base, those surgically repaired ankles will never be susceptible to injuries ever again.

We need Dr Gast on the Twins training staff ASAP

[Cap'n Piranha]

17 minutes ago, Doctor Gast said:

Not if you remove what is causing the problem which is playing SS.  He was having problems every year while playing SS now that he's playing 2B he hasn't had any problems. His ankles have been getting stronger as well as his performance.. Keep him away from SS and there'll be no problems with his ankles.

Yeah, the idea that Polanco can't possibly hurt his ankles again so long as he stays away from shortstop just doesn't seem rooted in any kind of reality to me.  It's entirely possible that Polanco is not at any greater risk than any other player vis-a-vis ankle injuries when not playing shortstop, but that doesn't mean he CAN'T hurt his ankles again.  We've seen what happens to Polanco when he's got bum wheels, so if you truly can get a global top-15 prospect AND a top-100ish pitcher for him, that's not a terrible idea, especially if you're not going to be competitive in 2022.

[Rosterman]

Sometimes I think the front offfice continues to toy with us and their real concern is to get rid of everyone, including prospects, associated with the old regime (which means goodbye Royce Lewis). 

 

They were lucky to get Sano, Polanco and Kepler signed to very tradable contracts in many ways.

 

Just gotta wait and see.

[Tim]

22 hours ago, nicholas Anderson said:

Saw Brash and Kirby pitch against Wichita. Both are excellent. With J. Rod., Seattle seems to have quite the farm system. If the Twins make any trades this offseason, I would love them to make a trade with Seattle.

Thats awesome .. Notice anything specific with either of them? Seen a few scouts say Brash might have some of the best "stuff" of any in the minors

[Mike Sixel]

21 hours ago, Rosterman said:

Sometimes I think the front offfice continues to toy with us and their real concern is to get rid of everyone, including prospects, associated with the old regime (which means goodbye Royce Lewis). 

 

They were lucky to get Sano, Polanco and Kepler signed to very tradable contracts in many ways.

 

Just gotta wait and see.

In fairness....there probably aren't a ton of guys to sign or keep 5 years later. I suppose you think they are going to get rid of Kiriloff? 

Also, it is pretty odd to point out that they signed three guys to long term deals, while pointing out they want to trade all the guys from before them.

[tony&rodney]

Back to the post .. I really like the idea of wondering what options are out there for the Twins at this time. It would be interesting to know what interest other teams have in specific Twins players. I mean we hear Yankees fans wanting to trade us Anduhar for Garver, Kepler, and Lewis and that type of thing. The Seattle idea is worthy of conversation. The main hangup is that Polanco has already reached stardom and is signed for an unbelievably team friendly contract. The only concern with Polanco is related to his ankle injuries and it is  noteworthy to know his last 3 seasons record of games played: 153/162, 55/60, and 152/162. Polanco is on the field more than any other Twin, 17 more games played last season than either Sano or Donaldson who were often used at DH or PH. He managed more than 100 more plate appearances than others as well.  However, even though Jorge Polanco is easily the most consistent and our most valuable player on a good contract, he can be traded if the move makes the Twins a better team in 2022 and thereafter.

[RonCoomersOPS]

On 11/18/2021 at 2:08 PM, Einheri said:

With no pitching in sight short term, I'm all for blowing it all up.

But, get rid of current ownership and management at the same time.

It's not 2012 anymore, and the Twins aren't remotely in a spot where they have "no pitching in sight."

[RonCoomersOPS]

On 11/18/2021 at 7:15 PM, Rosterman said:

Sometimes I think the front offfice continues to toy with us and their real concern is to get rid of everyone, including prospects, associated with the old regime (which means goodbye Royce Lewis). 

 

They were lucky to get Sano, Polanco and Kepler signed to very tradable contracts in many ways.

 

Just gotta wait and see.

Royce Lewis was drafted by this FO, and getting rid of pretty much everyone (save a few players drafted in 2016) that is associated with the old FO is a very good idea. To do anything less, in my view, would be like stopping an antibiotic prescription early because you start feeling better.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Jorge Polanco is my favorite Twin. Seeing him healthy and playing up to his potential was salve for my soul in that miserable 2021 season. Trading him would crush me (much like so many fans with Buxton).

That being said, if you’re committed to the rebuild, Polanco, Buxton and Garver are your biggest trade chips left (that aren’t going to be long for the next wave).

I appreciate the idea on merit and plausibility, but I wouldn’t like it

[tarheeltwinsfan]

There is a self fulfilling prophecy in having an organizational mindset that the Twins can't win next year, therefore trade the best current players  for prospects who may or may not succeed, in 3-4 years. With this mind set, the organization will continuously be building for the future, at the expense of the present, and will  annually  part ways with the best proven players while they have the most "trade value"  because they succeeded the past season and are still young.  It seems to me to be a recurrent theme with the Twins, which makes it extremely difficult to build a winning culture in the organization.  It allows the rich to get richer in current talent. The players and managers and coaches see all this and this self fulfilling prophecy comes true every year. The organizational emphasis is not placed on " winning in the present" . but instead is placed on "building for the future". This is a formula for present day mediocrity and stagnation.  It states to the staff, the players and the fans that the Twins' end goal is to be like the children of Lake Wobegon,  " above average".  This attitude does not attract players whose main purpose is a team first mindset, oriented to winning above everything. What did Vince Lombardi say about winning?  If I am correct in my assertions, how has this worked out for the Twins since 1991? 

[Emjay]

Next to trading Buck, this is the worst idea I have ever heard....at some point,  you need to just stop trading away homegrown talent and build around somebody for cripes sake. 

[tony&rodney]

13 hours ago, RonCoomersOPS said:

It's not 2012 anymore, and the Twins aren't remotely in a spot where they have "no pitching in sight."

Hello to Liam Hendriks, Kyle Gibson (picked before Mike Trout), etc. Twins current prospects look good to me but this is pretty relative over the years. One caveat concerning too many trades is where the bodies fit.

[RonCoomersOPS]

9 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Hello to Liam Hendriks, Kyle Gibson (picked before Mike Trout), etc. Twins current prospects look good to me but this is pretty relative over the years. One caveat concerning too many trades is where the bodies fit.

For sure. The previous FO was a terrible judge of talent, and the previous couple of field management staffs were terrible at using what they had.

This FO seems pretty good at player identification and player development, relatively speaking at least. Hence the "it's not 2012 anymore" comment.

[Vanimal46]

7 minutes ago, RonCoomersOPS said:

For sure. The previous FO was a terrible judge of talent, and the previous couple of field management staffs were terrible at using what they had.

This FO seems pretty good at player identification and player development, relatively speaking at least. Hence the "it's not 2012 anymore" comment.

You sure you're ready to declare that this FO is better than the previous FO? They've let some valuable pieces walk for the waiver wire fee (Anderson, Wells, Baddoo) and traded away better value than what they've received. On top of making plenty of mistakes in free agency... 

[RonCoomersOPS]

20 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

You sure you're ready to declare that this FO is better than the previous FO? They've let some valuable pieces walk for the waiver wire fee (Anderson, Wells, Baddoo) and traded away better value than what they've received. On top of making plenty of mistakes in free agency... 

Yes, without question they're better than the previous FO. My dead cat is better than the previous FO.

Yeah they have made a few mistakes, but so does every FO. I guess I question which trades they've traded away more value than they've recieved. Wade for Anderson, sure, but beyond that?