Article: Competition for Plouffe?

[Danchat]

I bet it's gonna be Hannahan. Can he play 2B?

But a .238 career hitter (.316 OBP)....28 HR in his career...no thanks.

[nicksaviking]

You guys don't honestly think Ryan is going to give a MLB deal to a guy who otherwise will have to wait to get a minor league contract with a ST invite by the other 29 clubs? Hannahan has a whopping .17 better OPS vs. righties than Plouffe does; being a left-handed hitter from MN doesn't mean he's useful. Stay away.

 

Reports are that Jeff Keppinger is looking at $8M over two years. Why is this guy getting so much less attention than Marco Scutaro, Stephen Drew and Jed Lowrie? The Twins just gave Jamey Carroll 2 years for $6.75M, what the hell.

[johnnydakota]

Other than Hanahan/Chavez....who will now go back to NYY....who else is there? They wont spend on Youk/Reynolds as Gardy isnt an OBP guy but rather an old school BAve guy.

Ryan also said Tue that our 4 current middle infielders are the ones that Mn will go to spring training with. arghhhhh!!!!

 

What does Gardy have to do with anything? You think he would turn down having Youk on this team?

 

An over the hill player , who will require to much money ? Thank you no

[LaBombo]

 

Reading between the lines it seems like Ryan is trying to use this to motivate Plouffe. Trevor has always been that guy in the minors who's production never really lived up to the talent (other then his breakout in AAA), now that he has made it to the majors Ryan and co probably don't want him to get to comfortable and want to make sure he continues to work on his game and improve.

 

I think Plouffe has the potential to be a very solid 3B for us and has all the talent in the world to do so. Now it's on him to make the adjustments needed (since the league learned how to pitch to him a bit after his absurd HR run)

 

+10. It doesn't cost Ryan anything to send a message to Plouffe that he's still closer to a Danny Valencia than a Gary Gaetti in the eyes of the organization at the moment. He's finally shown signs of living up to the potential they saw when they used a first round pick on him waaaayyyy back in 2004, and Ryan doesn't want it going to his head.

 

On the other hand, it wouldn't be terribly strange to bring in a guy like Hannahan. Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield. But 250 AB's from JH to spell Plouffe, especially against tough righties, wouldn't be a bad thing. He can also fill in at first and either outfield corner, and can even play second in a pinch. And the Twins have historically loved to bring back local boys in the twilight of their careers, especially in down years.

[ThePuck]

 

Reading between the lines it seems like Ryan is trying to use this to motivate Plouffe. Trevor has always been that guy in the minors who's production never really lived up to the talent (other then his breakout in AAA), now that he has made it to the majors Ryan and co probably don't want him to get to comfortable and want to make sure he continues to work on his game and improve.

 

I think Plouffe has the potential to be a very solid 3B for us and has all the talent in the world to do so. Now it's on him to make the adjustments needed (since the league learned how to pitch to him a bit after his absurd HR run)

 

+10. It doesn't cost Ryan anything to send a message to Plouffe that he's still closer to a Danny Valencia than a Gary Gaetti in the eyes of the organization at the moment. He's finally shown signs of living up to the potential they saw when they used a first round pick on him waaaayyyy back in 2004, and Ryan doesn't want it going to his head.

 

On the other hand, it wouldn't be terribly strange to bring in a guy like Hannahan. Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield. But 250 AB's from JH to spell Plouffe, especially against tough righties, wouldn't be a bad thing. He can also fill in at first and either outfield corner, and can even play second in a pinch. And the Twins have historically loved to bring back local boys in the twilight of their careers, especially in down years.

 

'Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield?'

 

He constantly moves his players all over the diamond...which, I guess, isn't actually a platoon...more like pick the position you'll be playing today out of a hat...

[LaBombo]

'Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield?'

 

He constantly moves his players all over the diamond...which, I guess, isn't actually a platoon...more like pick the position you'll be playing today out of a hat...

 

Yes, I was speaking strictly in the sense of a traditional left/right platoon. Gardenhire's desire for everyday lineup coherence in the infield is exceeded only by his desire to play the guys whose defense he feels least likely to give him a coronary on any given day.

[nicksaviking]

On the other hand, it wouldn't be terribly strange to bring in a guy like Hannahan.

 

But why waste a roster spot in December on the guy who automatically becomes the team's first DFA candidate? If the Twins want him, they can offer him a minor league invite in February, he's most likely not going to get an MLB offer from another team, he's that bad of a hitter.

[E. Andrew]

I would like Inge or Hannahan, though I'm not sure what Inge would cost. I don't see any reason to bring in Youkilis unless we got an INCREDIBLE deal.

 

I think it's good to keep Plouffe on his toes, we don't want another Valencia situation where the guy thinks he owns it. But this is a weird situation. You aren't going to have any of those possibilities being sent to the minors to wait, and why take playing time away from a guy who has promise, in a year that should be average at best? We've seen some poor management of playing time for prospects in recent years... I don't see a reason to platoon much in the infield either. Why pigeon-hole a guy this early in his career, and risk eroding his confidence? If we are going to play 5+ AAA players every night, let them play. If they are going to be platooned, let them play every night in Rochester instead.

 

If Ryan is just letting this get out in the media, smart I suppose. But Plouffe would have to be pretty dumb to think the spot is his already.

[LaBombo]

But why waste a roster spot in December on the guy who automatically becomes the team's first DFA candidate? If the Twins want him, they can offer him a minor league invite in February, he's most likely not going to get an MLB offer from another team, he's that bad of a hitter.

 

Fine by me, but he's the kind of guy the Twins have historically valued more than most other teams do. Reputation for good defense, local, and a 'good guy', but not a good hitter. Kind of surprised he's not a Twin already...

[nicksaviking]

But why waste a roster spot in December on the guy who automatically becomes the team's first DFA candidate? If the Twins want him, they can offer him a minor league invite in February, he's most likely not going to get an MLB offer from another team, he's that bad of a hitter.

 

Fine by me, but he's the kind of guy the Twins have historically valued more than most other teams do. Reputation for good defense, local, and a 'good guy', but not a good hitter. Kind of surprised he's not a Twin already...

 

Too true, but I hope those kind of moves went out the window when everyone's job security became tenuous.

[lee_the_twins_fan]

Jack Hannahan can't be considered even as a backup middle infielder – he's played one game in five years at 2B and 9 at SS. He's played 39 at 1B and 451 at 3B.

 

The bottom line is, he's a 3B. Other than maybe 1B, you really cannot consider him at any other position.

 

That said, for the right price, he might be OK, but I'd like someone who can actually play more positions. I don't see him as a DH, and we already have lots of people who can play 1B (Morneau, Mauer, Doumit, Parmelee among others). If Hannahan is just backing up Plouffe, and is not able to handle any other position, he'll mainly be riding the bench. Like Gardenhire, I'd just as soon have someone who is more versatile, unless he's our starter.

 

Daniel Santana hit .286 last year at Fort Meyers (Advanced A). He's on the 40-man roster as a SS. I suspect he'll be at AA in 2013. Let's hope he progresses quickly.

[70charger]

Since we're talking about 3B, what's the status on Deibinson Romero? I know he's also a righty, and so not a candidate for a platoon, per se, but if I recall correctly he OPSed like 800 in New Britain last year.

 

Is he considered competition? He's not on the 40 man. Is he filler or a major league prospect?

[ashbury]

Since we're talking about 3B, what's the status on Deibinson Romero? I know he's also a righty, and so not a candidate for a platoon, per se, but if I recall correctly he OPSed like 800 in New Britain last year.

 

Is he considered competition? He's not on the 40 man. Is he filler or a major league prospect?

 

A 25-year-old in AA who doesn't tear up the league at the plate and is still shaky making plays at 3rd probably is never going to be more than filler by this point.

[Seth Stohs]

Yeah, Romero was on the Twins 40 man roster before Plouffe, I believe. He's improved the last couple of years, and he's earned a right to come back to spring training if only to see where he is and if he can step up. But, most likely a Rochester guy in 2013.

[jorgenswest]

The problem with competition and a back up 3b is it really doesn't work with the Twins roster.

 

At some point early enough in the season the Twins will have a need for a 13th pitcher. That leaves the starting lineup and three bench spots.

 

Those three spots need to be someone who can catch, someone who can defend in the middle infield and someone who can defend in center field. Last year, both Hughes and Burroughs were forced off the bench when they couldn't fill any of those roles. They were not a loss of any significance, but it points out the challenge of roster building with the current era of large bullpens.

 

Hanahan can't fit any of those bench roles. I guess you could argue Plouffe can be the back up middle infielder. Is that realistic? You could argue that Doumit could be DH and back up catcher. You saw how long that lasted in 2012. The Twins don't have the luxury of a corner guy that can move to CF so they need a true 4th outfielder.

 

Unless they also plan to change past practice of going to a 13 man staff when guys are day to day or the bullpen is overused, they won't be able to commit a year long roster spot to a back up 3B. At some point it will come down to DFA Plouffe or his competition.

 

There is another solution. Never have a 13 man staff. When a pitcher is day to day, DL him immediately. That doesn't sound like the Twins management to me.

 

On the other hand, if they sign Hanahan and later DFA him it really isn't any more significant a loss than Burroughs or Hughes. Pay him enough money and they can stash him in AAA when no one claims him.

[CDog]

'Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield?'

 

He constantly moves his players all over the diamond...which, I guess, isn't actually a platoon...more like pick the position you'll be playing today out of a hat...

 

Yes, I was speaking strictly in the sense of a traditional left/right platoon. Gardenhire's desire for everyday lineup coherence in the infield is exceeded only by his desire to play the guys whose defense he feels least likely to give him a coronary on any given day.

 

I like when one post is quoted and seemingly agreed with by someone saying something nearly the opposite...and both takes seem invented!

 

For the record, I've heard a lot of times how Gardenhire moves everyone around too much. Compared to what? This year...

 

Justin Morneau played only one position. Alexi Casilla played one game plus a couple spare innings at 3B and otherwise played only one position. Danny Valencia played only one position, and once he was moved on down the road and Plouffe was given the job...he played only that position. Dozier played only one position, and once he was demoted and Florimon took over HE played only one position. Josh Willingham played only one position. Denard Span...guess how many! And Revere played exclusively RF except when Span was out and then he played that position instead. Carroll moved around because he was, you know, the utility infielder. Mastro played a lot around the outfield because he was the utility outfielder. So who was playing Russian roulette around the diamond? Mauer played two spots for reasons well known and discussed. Parmalee played a couple spots. The rest of the guys who came up and down didn't play significantly anywhere.

[Paul Pleiss]

Let Plouffe play and see if his hot streak was a fluke. It doesn't look like the Twins will be competetive in 2013 so there's no harm in letting TP get his AB's. A low dollar 3B could be a wise pick-up, but I'm for sticking with Babe Plouffe.

[ThePuck]

'Like most managers today, Gardy doesn't care much for platooning, especially in the infield?'

 

He constantly moves his players all over the diamond...which, I guess, isn't actually a platoon...more like pick the position you'll be playing today out of a hat...

 

Yes, I was speaking strictly in the sense of a traditional left/right platoon. Gardenhire's desire for everyday lineup coherence in the infield is exceeded only by his desire to play the guys whose defense he feels least likely to give him a coronary on any given day.

 

I like when one post is quoted and seemingly agreed with by someone saying something nearly the opposite...and both takes seem invented!

 

For the record, I've heard a lot of times how Gardenhire moves everyone around too much. Compared to what? This year...

 

Justin Morneau played only one position. Alexi Casilla played one game plus a couple spare innings at 3B and otherwise played only one position. Danny Valencia played only one position, and once he was moved on down the road and Plouffe was given the job...he played only that position. Dozier played only one position, and once he was demoted and Florimon took over HE played only one position. Josh Willingham played only one position. Denard Span...guess how many! And Revere played exclusively RF except when Span was out and then he played that position instead. Carroll moved around because he was, you know, the utility infielder. Mastro played a lot around the outfield because he was the utility outfielder. So who was playing Russian roulette around the diamond? Mauer played two spots for reasons well known and discussed. Parmalee played a couple spots. The rest of the guys who came up and down didn't play significantly anywhere.

 

18, 19 different lineups to start the season this past season when everyone was healthy.

 

In 2011 Plouffe started three different positions in three different games between the IF and OF. Gardy put Cuddy, a OF at 2B while putting Plouffe, an middle IF in RF (Plouffe having played OF, at the time, once in his whole professional career...so let's put him out there in a major league game). Doumit, catcher, DH, OF...even though he's a disaster out there and Gardy had plenty of OF options. Alexi, a 2B who was also given the starting shortstop job coming into 2011...having had less than 30 starts at the major league level at shortstop. Heck lets put him at 3B some too this year. Punto given the starting shortstop job, but heck, we'll put our starting shortstop over at 3B or 2B so we can give a backup some time. Mauer, our catcher, let's play him at 1B...and heck, throw him in RF too.

[Guest USAFChief]

 

I like when one post is quoted and seemingly agreed with by someone saying something nearly the opposite...and both takes seem invented!

 

For the record, I've heard a lot of times how Gardenhire moves everyone around too much. Compared to what? This year...

 

Justin Morneau played only one position. Alexi Casilla played one game plus a couple spare innings at 3B and otherwise played only one position. Danny Valencia played only one position, and once he was moved on down the road and Plouffe was given the job...he played only that position. Dozier played only one position, and once he was demoted and Florimon took over HE played only one position. Josh Willingham played only one position. Denard Span...guess how many! And Revere played exclusively RF except when Span was out and then he played that position instead. Carroll moved around because he was, you know, the utility infielder. Mastro played a lot around the outfield because he was the utility outfielder. So who was playing Russian roulette around the diamond? Mauer played two spots for reasons well known and discussed. Parmalee played a couple spots. The rest of the guys who came up and down didn't play significantly anywhere.

 

Great post.

 

Sometimes the criticisms of Gardy are well founded.

 

And sometimes they're just...not.

[Mike Sixel]

Chavez is gone, for just 3 million. Was he not an option?

[LaBombo]

I like when one post is quoted and seemingly agreed with by someone saying something nearly the opposite...and both takes seem invented!

 

And I like when a poster rips another post and then goes on to agree with it. So it's win/win!

 

Back to sort of on topic, the Twins can sign renowned wildlife boob and frequent Letterman guest Jack Hannahttp://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim//2010/06/09/hannaearlyshow_1_370x278.jpg this offseason for all I care, as long it's only a one year deal. There are better options than Hannahan, but he's from here and Hartmann loves him, so he's practically a Twin already.

[Physics Guy]

Just read a Tweet from Danny Knobler (CBSSports) that said Reds, WhiteSox and Yankees all interested in Hannahan. Still think we can get him for a minor league contract and ST invite?