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Astros assistant GM outburst


Otto von Ballpark

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Yes, I'm definitely glad the Twins don't have any players on their roster who have been accused of wrongdoing, only for the accuser to provide no evidence of the alleged incident.

 

How dare the Astros employ someone who has had no legal judgments against them--they should definitely work off the guilty until proven innocent method.

 

As for the AGM's comments, sounds like a guy lacking tact to a nearly unbelievable level, to the point of looking to browbeat people for no good reason.  That guy should be required to attend sensitivity training and then volunteer a large amount of hours at a shelter for victims of domestic violence, or find a different place of employment.

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Glass houses. I guess the Twins (and most teams) just prefer to look the other way on PED violations of several players (including darling Nelson Cruz), allegations from a credible female reporter, and Puckett behavior, to name a few right off the top of my head. 

 

It certainly is not a shining moment, but it also is not representative of an entire organization, it's goals and its standards, nor should it be. Perspective. One amped up person that has torpedoed his own life should not be lauded as organizational.

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Yes, I'm definitely glad the Twins don't have any players on their roster who have been accused of wrongdoing, only for the accuser to provide no evidence of the alleged incident.

 

How dare the Astros employ someone who has had no legal judgments against them--they should definitely work off the guilty until proven innocent method.

 

 

Glass houses. I guess the Twins (and most teams) just prefer to look the other way on PED violations of several players (including darling Nelson Cruz), allegations from a credible female reporter, and Puckett behavior, to name a few right off the top of my head. 

 

FYI, in case it wasn't clear from the thread title, I didn't post this to discuss Osuna himself. I posted this to discuss the Astros assistant GM.

 

We all have different opinions, but I think we can all agree that employing players around these circumstances is a pretty complicated situation.

 

What isn't complicated, though, is no tolerance for front office personnel taunting reporters in this fashion.

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It certainly is not a shining moment, but it also is not representative of an entire organization, it's goals and its standards, nor should it be. Perspective. One amped up person that has torpedoed his own life should not be lauded as organizational.

The Astros haven't covered themselves in glory here either. Their first statement alleged the SI article was a "fabrication" when it appears the Astros own excuse for Taubman was the actual fabrication:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/10/22/astros-respond-sports-illustrated-report-alleging-executives-clubhouse-blowup/

 

 

 

Soon after her story published, the Astros issued a statement suggesting Taubman was supporting Osuna while he was being asked questions during “a difficult time.” The statement went on to say, “His comments had everything to do with the game situation that just occurred and nothing else — they were also not directed toward any specific reporters. We are extremely disappointed in Sports Illustrated’s attempt to fabricate a story where one does not exist.”

After the Astros released their statement, the Houston Chronicle reported that two of its reporters were able to confirm the claims made by Sports Illustrated. A reporter for Yahoo Sports also said she could provide confirmation. Sports Illustrated issued a statement standing by the story.

The Chronicle cited two eyewitnesses in reporting that Taubman was “holding a cigar and standing with two or three other men when he yelled his comments,” and that the group of female reporters was “approximately eight feet away and one was visibly shaken by the comment.” The Chronicle also reported no players were in the area and no interviews were being conducted at the time, disputing the team’s claim.

 

I suspect Taubman is not alone in his views and judgments in the Houston front office, and that's something I don't want to emulate in Minnesota (even if it's a pro sports reality that we'll occasionally have to deal with players in situations like Osuna's).

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Now the clincher that multiple sources have reported that the reporter he was specifically targeting was wearing a purple Domestic Violence bracelet and had covered the Astros previously and ripped their initial acquisition (to be fair, so did tonight's game 1 starter for the club). With multiple source confirmation, that's pretty damning.

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Now the clincher that multiple sources have reported that the reporter he was specifically targeting was wearing a purple Domestic Violence bracelet and had covered the Astros previously and ripped their initial acquisition (to be fair, so did tonight's game 1 starter for the club). With multiple source confirmation, that's pretty damning.

It did say that in the original article, about the domestic violence bracelet. My guess is he will get fired, but as to when, we’ll see.

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That guy's behavior goes beyond simple insensitivity. It reeks of misogyny. He's looking for work if he's been in my organization. And then the organization itself goes through self-examination to root out any and all things that ignore or encourage gender inequity, all the way down to what music gets played in the clubhouse.

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Glass houses. I guess the Twins (and most teams) just prefer to look the other way on PED violations of several players (including darling Nelson Cruz), allegations from a credible female reporter, and Puckett behavior, to name a few right off the top of my head. 

 

It certainly is not a shining moment, but it also is not representative of an entire organization, it's goals and its standards, nor should it be. Perspective. One amped up person that has torpedoed his own life should not be lauded as organizational.

I would agree with your premise, that you can't paint a whole organization with the brush of one idiot, if not for the Astros coming out with that lame, lying, non-apology covering for that amped-up person, which was easily debunked by those who were there, and then the perp's own non-apology after that. (The same old, lame old, "sorry if I was misinterpreted, blah blah blah...) 

 

How could an organization who walks what they talk do something like that in the first place? That guy's actions, according to those who were there, went way beyond 'exuberance;' it was intentional, targeted bullying of a group of reporters who happened to be standing together, who also happened to be women. 

 

Most if not all of us have been in places where our exuberance at some victory leads us to carry it over the line at times. But there's a difference between shouting and acting the fool, and targeting people with taunts about violent behavior. The fact that he did so not once, but repeated his taunts a half-dozen times is beyond 'exuberance.' Then, for him and his team to come out with such despicable statements in the aftermath- well, it's like Watergate; the cover-up becomes worse than the crime.

 

The Astros rolled the dice, and got damaged goods (albeit a lights-out talented player) at a bargain price, thinking they could manage the backlash if or when it came. There probably would have been mention of it during the broadcasts, but thanks to Brandon Taubman, Osuna himself is now under a big spotlight, and so is his team. Thanks a lot, Brandon.

 

Sidebar- if ever there was a guy who needed a knuckle sandwich, right there on the spot, it's this guy, in spades.

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the Astros have a habit of not doing well with the media....and their initial statement that the report was fake news was a deplorable lie.

 

That is what makes it really bad. They should have fired him on the spot, not made any excuses for his behavior, as there is none.

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That is what makes it really bad. They should have fired him on the spot, not made any excuses for his behavior, as there is none.

Nobody is going to fire their main analytical guy right as they head into the World Series. My guess is the only negative consequence he will have is not landing that sweet Red Sox gig that many insiders considered him the favorite for.

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That is what makes it really bad. They should have fired him on the spot, not made any excuses for his behavior, as there is none.

I don't know about firing him right away, but just don't lie about stuff people actually witnessed.... As a starter. Lying just makes it more clear you don't care about reporters as human beings.... Probably about anyone but your teammates, apparently

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FYI, in case it wasn't clear from the thread title, I didn't post this to discuss Osuna himself. I posted this to discuss the Astros assistant GM.

 

We all have different opinions, but I think we can all agree that employing players around these circumstances is a pretty complicated situation.

 

What isn't complicated, though, is no tolerance for front office personnel taunting reporters in this fashion.

 

Fair enough.  I do think however, it would be better to educate the individual in this case, and have him repay the community he has hurt, rather than fire him which does no material good.  If you argue that a firing demonstrates you will not tolerate his type of behavior, I would counter that all it does is signal that these type of attitudes must be kept quiet.

 

Eliminating hate and prejudice cannot be done by driving it underground, where it grows more extreme and virulent; rather, it must be brought to the forefront and educated away.  Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

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Fair enough.  I do think however, it would be better to educate the individual in this case, and have him repay the community he has hurt, rather than fire him which does no material good.  If you argue that a firing demonstrates you will not tolerate his type of behavior, I would counter that all it does is signal that these type of attitudes must be kept quiet.

 

Eliminating hate and prejudice cannot be done by driving it underground, where it grows more extreme and virulent; rather, it must be brought to the forefront and educated away.  Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

 

Nothing changes overnight anyway, and in the long view, it's not going to make one lick of difference if Taubman is forced to leave the Astros and go back to Wall Street.

 

Frankly I don't really care what happens to him, at this point. The backstory and the Astros pathetic response has been a big bright clue that it's not just about one bad actor who needs sensitivity training. I'm glad they didn't have a better PR strategy here because they've exposed a deeper problem.

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It seems it is common, as a first gut reaction, in general, to protect, or have our "family's back", even if our family is truly in the wrong. The more important thing, to me, is that when more than immediate info is in, and it shows our family's transgressions, that one quickly reverses and has sincere contrition. It seems that is what is happening here. The evidence has quickly come in, and stances were immediately corrected, and not doubled down on. It seems we could all use a little of that.   

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I don't think I would like this Taubman guy very much.  He probably fancies himself above the law or untouchable due to talent.  I hope Karma goes looking for him.

 

However, I think using his actions as a reason to root for the Nationals over the Astros is silly.  If one was already rooting for the Nationals, I guess this can serve as a little more fuel, but I can't see flipping due to this.  I'd like to think a guy like George Springer and all the good that comes with him would more than offset this jackass.

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The more important thing, to me, is that when more than immediate info is in, and it shows our family's transgressions, that one quickly reverses and has sincere contrition. It seems that is what is happening here. The evidence has quickly come in, and stances were immediately corrected, and not doubled down on.  

Has that happened? So far, we've got a non-apology apology from Taubman ("I'm sorry if anyone was offended"), and a whole lot of weirdness from Luhnow: "What we really don't know is the intent behind the inappropriate comments he made. We may never know that because the person who said them and the people who heard them at least up to this point have different perspectives"

 

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/10/23/jeff-luhnow-brandon-taubman-domestic-violence-outburst-reporters

 

Then there's the whole initial Astros statement, which made the not-insignificant claim that the SI article was a "fabrication." That hasn't been addressed at all.

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The reporter shows up with the domestic violence shirt...and this idiot plays right into her hand. "How to take a bad situation (of your own doing)...and make it 10 times worse" - - by Brandon Taubman.

 

I wouldn't fire him for lack of composure/respect/professionalism. I'd fire him for incompetence as an executive representing the organization.

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However, I think using his actions as a reason to root for the Nationals over the Astros is silly.  If one was already rooting for the Nationals, I guess this can serve as a little more fuel, but I can't see flipping due to this.  I'd like to think a guy like George Springer and all the good that comes with him would more than offset this jackass.

I mean, if you really break it down, rooting for any sports team is kinda silly. :)

 

If you're neutral, I'm not sure George Springer is any more worthy of support than Doolittle or any number of Nats players. (If anything, Osuna himself could tip the scales towards the Nats.) And of course, the Nats were a big underdog, which always attracts some neutral rooters.

 

Mostly I just wanted a long series for entertainment purposes, regardless of who won, but now I'm all-in on the Nationals. I've got some Astros family too, and their baseball interest has pretty much shut down the last two days -- it's not behavior a lot of folks want to be associated with.

 

Imagine if the Twins front office acted like this on Oct. 1st. Maybe we wouldn't root for the Yankees, but losing to them sure as heck wouldn't sting so much. (On that note, maybe the Twins FO should be bigger jerks! :) )

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Has that happened? So far, we've got a non-apology apology from Taubman ("I'm sorry if anyone was offended"), and a whole lot of weirdness from Luhnow: "What we really don't know is the intent behind the inappropriate comments he made. We may never know that because the person who said them and the people who heard them at least up to this point have different perspectives"

 

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/10/23/jeff-luhnow-brandon-taubman-domestic-violence-outburst-reporters

 

Then there's the whole initial Astros statement, which made the not-insignificant claim that the SI article was a "fabrication." That hasn't been addressed at all.

 

I'll let others be the judge and jury. I don't really want to be. I was not there, and anything I hear is second hand, and that can be very biased. I certainly think it is regrettable. I have stated my opinon, which may have been twisted a bit already. Carry on. I am going to enjoy the World Series, between two very talented teams. 

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Surprised this was done during the WS. And I'm really curious who wrote and approved that initial statement from the Astros.  There job should probably be in jeopardy as well.

The fired guy probably played dumb, initially, and whoever drafted up the first statement was probably taking the fired guy on his word.
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