Article: Possible MLB Rule Changes: Universal DH? Roster size? Anti-tanking?

[biggentleben]

 

*as the pitch is delivered*

 

That's not the 30-45 seconds that players are taking between pitches. The catcher isn't leaning the moment he throws the ball back to the pitcher. Fielders aren't moving during that time either.

 

 

All I want, and all the pitch clock is purporting to do, is to trim those 30-45 second gaps down to 20 seconds or less. Virtually nothing will change from a strategic perspective, and in fact it will be easier for fans to pay attention to the little things that happen right before/during/after a pitch -- because you know they're going to happen within the next 20 seconds. Not some longer time that varies based on each batter's glove routine, etc.

 

And that trimming will add up, to significantly swifter games.

 

Oh, you have no argument from me on the pitch clock. You seriously don't notice it at all. It's just like netting. Once it's there, you don't notice it's there.

[Jacksson]

 

It’s hard to believe that NL fans would prefer to see pitchers hopelessly flailing at pitches or forever engaged in the sacrifice bunt as opposed to seeing a conventional offensive player at bat. I would also think they would prefer NOT to see a pitcher pulled during a tight game ONLY because a pinch hitter is employed. It is also a consideration that having the DH , doesn’t necessarily mean that an older or one dimensional player is utilized exclusively for that role. Many AL teams utilize the DH to rest star players from the rigors of performing a defensive position, enabling the team the opportunity to still treat the fans to that player’s offensive production. Remember also that just because the DH would be in effect, would not preclude pitchers such as MadBum from batting for themselves.

 

Not only does the roster need to be increased, but considering the cumulative aches and pains as well as occasional illnesses that affect players during the course of the season, increasing the roster to 28 would be more practical.. Quality of play could increase as players that are nicked up could sit out a few games. Use of the disabled list could decrease. the Minor League shuttle of players to MLB could be minimized. An increase from 25 is long overdue.

 

Also out of date is the 40 man roster and all the game playing with player’s lives as they are claimed on waivers and then DFA by the new team to enable them to be stashed. An increase to 45, at least for teams that lack the revenue streams to chase free agents and instead rely on the draft and their organization to provide a flow of talent to their team.

 

1

[Jacksson]

Eliminate the Sacrifice Fly. Why is it that a runner can advance and/or score on an out on a fly ball that is hit a long way?

[TheLeviathan]

In football the gap between plays is the only "inaction".  But you are virtually guaranteed action will happen after every play clock interval.  You are not assured the same thing in baseball.  From the time the first pitch happens to the end of the at-bat could be several minutes where very little is happening.  

 

And if a guy gets on base, you might see even more time that is milked between when he got on base and a baseball play of consequence from the next batter.  Football simply does not have that kind of down time.  Squeezing those step offs, throw overs, batting glove adjustments, time outs, standing and watching the signs, shaking off, etc. would do enormous good for the game.  Whether it makes a sizable change in actual game time or not I don't care, the perception of speeding up the game will go a long way.

Edited February 7, 2019 by TheLeviathan

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I do understand that. But it's not the average "2.2 mid inning changes per game" game that drives me nuts. It's the games on the high end of the spectrum. The innings that take a half hour because there were several changes. 

 

And yes, maybe it's only, on average, 5 minutes of idle time. But, again, when you have twice the average number of mid-inning changes, that's twice the added minutes of idle time. Anyway, that's kind of the point, almost every factor only accounts for 5-10 minutes of the increase. 

 

By all means, limit the batters stepping out (though I don't think it's the glove adjustments really causing the problem... it just looks annoying) and enforce a limit on time to throw a pitch. But eliminating any ONE factor is only going to do so much. 

 

That's fair. I am certainly no fan of a parade of mid-inning pitching changes.

 

But I don't think each factor is equal. The pitch clock factor has the potential to be huge. I know it's just comparing two games, but the example I linked illustrates that -- just 10 seconds between each "inaction pitch" added up to 25 minutes for the whole game! I feel like even talking about pitching changes, or mound visits, or intentional walks just obscures this elephant in the room

 

The average time of game in 2018 was 3:05. I know averages are of limited use here, because it's highly variable -- if every game was predictably 3:05 like football it wouldn't be so bad, but you're right, we get too many close to 3:30 and there's no way to predict them. So let's say the range for most games right now is 2:40-3:30.

 

If that average came down to 2:40 with a pitch clock, and the range for most games was 2:15-3:05, I don't think I'd care all that much about the occasional burst of mid-inning pitching changes within that range. Or a few more mound visits, or whatever. Just keep the game moving when no one has any real reason to slow it down, and I can tolerate a few slow downs.

[ahart10]

Three-batter minimum? No thank you. I enjoy seeing the manager work his bullpen magic vs the other managers lineup magic.

 

 

Universal designated hitter? How about home team chooses to play with or without a DH everyday?

 

20-second pitch clock? Let’s make it 10, but not have a clock with runners on base.

 

 

Mound visits? I’m not sure if these really NEED to be regulated, but will agree if taken advantage of they do grind the game to a halt.

 

Roster size? I’m not a more is always better kinda fella. 26 would be fine I guess. Likely would just cause more pitching changes.

 

Anti-tanking? Just outright a fruitless idea imho.

[Comrade Bork]

Adding a 26th roster spot seems directly at odds with forcing pitchers to face 3 batters.

[BabyJesusBuxton]

 

Anti-Tanking - No - If teams want to tank, let them. At the end of the day, fans will stop showing up and that ends up hurting the owners pockets. I don't even know how you'd quantify "tanking".  I mean the Royals were absolutely terrible during the mid 2000's and I don't think they were losing on purpose; they just had terrible players outside of Mike Sweeney. Their player development was poor and thus they didn't bring high level talent to the MLB club.

 

I'd like to see MLB institute a minimum payroll. There should be no reason that owners are allowed to pocket the revenue sharing money and not invest that into their team.  If you can't afford to spend $65 million on your baseball team, you don't deserve to have one, lol

 

This is how you get the bottom teams in the standings to spend more money on FA players - take away revenue sharing for not meeting certain minimums for roster payroll.  The current problem with free agency is that teams would rather not pay free agents and tank to get better down the road but they are still eligible for revenue sharing when their fans don't show up to see their triple A ball club playing in the MLB. 

 

If the owners are only worried about making money, they will think twice about not signing available free agents that would help their club and put fans in the stands if the alternative is losing out on revenue sharing.  If they are willing to sacrifice money in their pocket to guarantee a higher draft pick and more international pool money, that is their choice.

 

Along with this I think a hard salary cap that is updated every 5 years based on a percentage of the total MLB revenue should be enacted.  There would need to be some sort of transition over several seasons to give the teams time to adjust to whatever the cap is initially set at.  The MLBPA can bargain for what that percentage of total revenue should be to help their cause in free agency.

 

Combined this fixes some issues with current free agency where the big spenders want to avoid a luxury tax and the rebuilding teams don't want to spend on good FA players unless they are ready to build around a core of younger players.

 

There could be some sort of tier system based on salary as a percentage of total team revenue that affects what percentage of the revenue sharing a team can get.  This way if a team is in rebuilding mode they can decide how much revenue sharing they are willing to give up for a better chance at tanking. 

[amjgt]

Regarding the 3 batter minimum.... I like it.

 

"People would find a way to cheat" isn't a good argument against because a) rules could be put in place to prevent much of that (Auto DL stint, fines for teams/managers) and b.) it would happen very rarely.

 

I do think it needs a little tweak though. 3 batter minimum OR end of the inning. You shouldn't force pitchers to bridge innings.

Edited February 7, 2019 by amjgt

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I do think it needs a little tweak though. 3 batter minimum OR end of the inning. You shouldn't force pitchers to bridge innings.

From what I've read, that is exactly the idea being discussed by MLB -- it's just the "end of inning" part doesn't get mentioned in most reports.

[Otto von Ballpark]

For those who support the proposed 3 batter minimum -- why 3? Why not 2? That would seemingly address the parade of LOOGYs and ROOGYs just as well, correct?

[djvang]

Three-batter minimum

   I would go with a two-batter minimum.
 

Universal designated hitter

  Either way is fine
 

20-second pitch clock

   Definitely. But it has to be balanced between the pitcher and the batter.
 

Mound visits

    Four should be enough.
 

Roster size

   OK. Maximum of 13 pitchers on the roster.
 

Anti-tanking

   Don't know how they would enforce that. Some teams are just bad.

 

I would also ban The Wave.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I would also ban The Wave.

Relevant video (probably behind a short ad, sorry):

 

Saturday Night Live: "Wave Starter at a Baseball Game"

 

https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/wave-starter-at-a-baseball-game/2724290

Edited February 7, 2019 by spycake

[dougd]

According to Jayson Stark:

The union is said to have offered two new ideas:

1) All 30 teams would be required to expand rosters to 28 in September. Roster expansion is now optional.

2)  All teams also would be required to add four minor leaguers to the rosters after the conclusion of the minor-league playoffs — and since that would increase the total number to more than 28, each team would have to announce a 28-man “active” roster for every game from Sept. 1 on, similar to the way NFL teams must announce “actives” and “inactives” before games. Starting pitchers could not be part of those inactives, according to the latest proposal.

[Rosterman]

The three batter rule would be a disaster if the pitcher didn't have their stuff. Of course, he just might walk three guys. But still. Between using an opener and using a closer for one inning, you can already burn thru three pitchers a game. And you usually do with the pitch count limits on starters who can't reach the 6th anyways.

 

Regarding expanding rosters, maybe should expand them to 28 players, and you must rest three ech game (which wouldn't be hard, because you have starting pitchers). But then you would have more one batter pitchers on the roster. But I would like to see an expanded roster to offer either that additional pitcher or batter.

 

 

Of course, the National League has worked just fine with the pinch hitter using up a bench bat and no designated hitter. Raises problems when pitchers do have to bat from the American League. Having the universal designated hitter would mean pitchers never ever have to swing a bat again.

 

And how can you prevent a team from tanking. At some point, most every team worried about budget goes thru a rebuilding phase. And it may happen in mid-season, with the uncontrolled disabled players, and the opportunity to trade off assets for the future.. If a team chooses to tank, then they face the wrath of the ticket holder.

 

I think the bigthing for major league baseball is to look at cost of going to a game. How do you fill all those empty seats each game in stadiums. Sure, they ride the corporate buyout of season tickets, which is still revenue if the business can't give away the tickets and are content with the business writeoff. But like the Twins, how do you adjust prices to make it a worthwhile experience to fill those 10,000 empty seats each game, as well as get people to purchase the beverages and food. Overall, looking at ALL teams, I don't see major league abseball being a hard ticket to get.

[RatherBeGolfing]

The anti-tanking rule seems to be very much a gray area, they'd have a lot to work out with that.

 

Otherwise, I'm on board with the rest. Absolute yes to the NL DH, the pitch clock and relievers having to face 3 batters

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

The anti-tanking rule seems to be very much a gray area, they'd have a lot to work out with that.

 

Otherwise, I'm on board with the rest. Absolute yes to the NL DH, the pitch clock and relievers having to face 3 batters

This - I'm not against specific rules that would encourage competition and parity throughout the MLB, but I am against vague concepts being passed off as rules for the commissioner to arbitrarily hand down edicts. Rules need to be clear, concise, and adjudicated without argument.

[jimbo92107]

Let's see...

 

- A walk counts as a run. That'll speed up the inevitable.

 

- 7-inning games.

 

- Robo-Ump calls balls and strikes. A strike makes a big cowbell sound. A ball makes a sad trombone wah-wah-wah. Strikeout sound is whiny kid laughing. Walk sound is hockey announcer, "He scorrrres!"

 

- No national anthem. No invocations of sky daddies.

 

- The ceremonial first pitch counts as a ball or a strike, with a batter. No more mister nice guy.

 

- Beers are back to five bucks. That'll fill yer friggin stands, y'all!

 

- Expand active rosters to 35, but reduce bench length five feet. 

 

- All new baseballs delivered by farm animals. Or dragged by squirrel chariot.

 

- Foul balls caught by fans = two beers. Dropped fouls = Ejection. Bring a glove!

 

- If hitter's bat flies into audience, they must throw it back, and the hitter must catch it on the fly, or he's ejected.

 

- No fat players allowed. Time to draw the belt line. 

 

- All stadiums must offer Cobb Salad. I like Cobb Salad.

[Dman]

IN=n the Fangraphs polling it looks like the three batter minimum is the only "New Rule"  That fans don't seem to want.  It was close to a 50/50 split.  DH, 26 man roster and 20 second clock were close to 70% IIRC.

[ashbury]

Relevant video (probably behind a short ad, sorry):

 

Saturday Night Live: "Wave Starter at a Baseball Game"

 

https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/wave-starter-at-a-baseball-game/2724290

I never saw that before. Great payoff at the end.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Let's see...

 

- A walk counts as a run. That'll speed up the inevitable.

 

- 7-inning games.

 

- Robo-Ump calls balls and strikes. A strike makes a big cowbell sound. A ball makes a sad trombone wah-wah-wah. Strikeout sound is whiny kid laughing. Walk sound is hockey announcer, "He scorrrres!"

 

- No national anthem. No invocations of sky daddies.

 

- The ceremonial first pitch counts as a ball or a strike, with a batter. No more mister nice guy.

 

- Beers are back to five bucks. That'll fill yer friggin stands, y'all!

 

- Expand active rosters to 35, but reduce bench length five feet. 

 

- All new baseballs delivered by farm animals. Or dragged by squirrel chariot.

 

- Foul balls caught by fans = two beers. Dropped fouls = Ejection. Bring a glove!

 

- If hitter's bat flies into audience, they must throw it back, and the hitter must catch it on the fly, or he's ejected.

 

- No fat players allowed. Time to draw the belt line. 

 

- All stadiums must offer Cobb Salad. I like Cobb Salad.

And now all of the ceremonial pitchers are all retired MLB pitchers since walks count as a run

Edited February 7, 2019 by Sconnie

[ashbury]

Let's see...

 

- A walk counts as a run. That'll speed up the inevitable.

Runs Will Haunt.

 

http://www.hipsterpig.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/walks-will-haunt-shirt-669x272.jpg

[jay]

26 man rosters and universal DH. No need to have a 3 batter minimum, but do cap rosters at 12 eligible pitchers.

 

Imagine a true 5 man bench again... backup C, 4th OF, IF, and 2 flex spots. Bullpens are filled with flex spots. Why not have that on offense and see what teams come up with?

[sweetmusicviola16]

For those who want change, say good bye to the Disabled List. It will now be referred to as the Injured List. According to Jeff Passan.

[jimbo92107]

 

For those who want change, say good bye to the Disabled List. It will now be referred to as the Injured List. According to Jeff Passan.

Oh heck, not the "Physically Challenged List?"

[gil4]

 

The adjusting the gloves thing has to stop.

No kidding. You'd think these guys could afford to buy a pair that fits right without it.

[gil4]

 

 

- No fat players allowed. Time to draw the belt line. 

 

Me and Bartolo will be waiting for you in the alley...

[jtkoupal]

100% on board with the DH and the roster size. Not as much on the rest.

 

I don't like the tanking rules idea. I think innocent teams could get caught in the crossfire. How do you distinguish tanking from a team just generally sucking? It's a judgement call and I don't know that policing a certain win requirement is a great solution.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Oh heck, not the "Physically Challenged List?"

All kidding aside, this is very minor and great for the game. Jim Abbott could play, he was only on that list when he was injured, but was for his entire career "disabled". "Injured list" is absolutely the right way to go.

[Loops]

They actually should get rid of the DH in both leagues.  It would speed up the game.  One quick extra out.

I understand the reasoning for the clock.  I just think it is tricky and it depends how they implement it.  Half the problem is the batter out of the box adjusting his glove or whatever.  When does the clock start?  Does it reset if the pitcher steps off the mound?  Lots of questions.

Roster size increase means more rookies not playing just sitting on the bench.  Not sure if that's a good thing.

 

The big problem they are trying to solve is pace of play.  The game has evolved to home runs or strike outs.  That means longer at bats.  Less sacrifices/bunting means longer at bats.  Less complete games because of pitch counts.  The game has changed and not necessarily for the better