Exactly. The line that floored me after Buxton came up is that he'd have to change his swing to be successful in the majors. WHAT? That's the whole purpose of the minor leagues! It's not to produce players who can be successful at AAA or AA.

And I look at something like Berrios’ or Romero’s struggles in the Bigs and part of it stems with working with Red Wings pitching coach Stu Clipburn. Back in 2016 while Berrios struggled mightily in the Bigs Berrios still pitched exceptionally well in AAA and when asked why Berrios couldn’t succeed in the Majors Clipburn was dumbfounded. Um if you are the AAA affiliate pitching coach you should be in the business of getting pitching prospects ready for the majors, not wondering why nothing is working.

Edited October 2, 20188 yr by FormerMinnasotan

 

God bless you Paul Molitor! You will always be a Minnesota hero to me. Best wishes on your new role within the organization. Yep, I'm a homer.

I don't think you need to be termed a "homer" to appreciate Paul Molitor for his accomplishments, or even for his demeanor through the years as a primary face of the franchise.  I both admire Molly....and feel that, at this time, there should be better manager options available for this team.

Good luck to Paul, the decision is justifiable though.

 

I don't know who the next manager will be, but I'm sure of one thing: fans here and elsewhere will have no trouble finding all sorts of issues with their management choices.  They'll be wrong all the time and we'll make all sorts of assumptions about their motivation styles, in-game decisions, and use of veterans.  As it ever shall be.

 

 

Edited October 2, 20188 yr by TheLeviathan

 

Good luck to Paul, the decision is justifiable though.

 

I don't know who the next manager will be, but I'm sure of one thing: fans here and elsewhere will have no trouble finding all sorts of issues with their management choices.  They'll be wrong all the time and we'll make all sorts of assumptions about their motivation styles, in-game decisions, and use of veterans.  As it ever shall be.

Fan is short for fanatic you know! 

Yes, a player/manager counts against the 25. Not sure if there's a loophole around that, like if your manager only played occasionally and you could 'option' the player to the minors while the manager stays with the MLB team...even though it's the same person.

He'd have enough years of service that he could refuse the assignment.

 

What if they put him on waivers, though, and someone claimed him?

 

He'd have enough years of service that he could refuse the assignment.

 

What if they put him on waivers, though, and someone claimed him?

Or if you optioned him to the minors, would you then have to call up another manager?

Wow, what a day to be busy. 

 

I think this was a very good move by the FO that had to be done.

 

Unless you are contending for a title or a playoff spot.

Usually.  But this year would have been the exception to even that axiom.  The Twins last 9 series included 20 games against the likes of Texas, KC, Detroit, and the White Sox.  Don't think it would have mattered much if those teams had 'been trying' or 'playing it straight'....which they clearly were not.

 

If ever there was a year when September records and statistics can be ignored completely...this would be it regarding the Twins.  The Twins need to overhaul in a fairly major way.  The manager should be just the first step.

Good move for the team. I have nothing but good things to say about Molitor as a person, as do all of us, but he was only about 75% of a baseball manager. I hope he sticks around.

 

I imagine Jeff Banister, fired a couple of weeks ago by the Rangers, will be the next Twins manager.

 

He'd have enough years of service that he could refuse the assignment.

 

What if they put him on waivers, though, and someone claimed him?

 

 

Or if you optioned him to the minors, would you then have to call up another manager?

 

Fine, whatever, I've had enough of your fancy, big city baseball lawyering. 

 

Usually.  But this year would have been the exception to even that axiom.  The Twins last 9 series included 20 games against the likes of Texas, KC, Detroit, and the White Sox.  Don't think it would have mattered much if those teams had 'been trying' or 'playing it straight'....which they clearly were not.

 

 

Would the Twins not also fit into that same category though? In that context, it seems to be apples to apples in my mind. 

 

Not that it matters in the end though. My initial comment that sparked this was a one off quip in a half joking/half serious post. I'm not taking much stock in anything since the trade deadline.

I wonder what, if anything, making this move now signals about the FO feelings on where the organization is and how they'll approach FA this offseason.

 

My initial thought was that they wouldn't make a change if they weren't going to push to be competitive immediately next year.  But after the press conference I'm not as sure.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Bannister is on the short list.

 

Fine, whatever, I've had enough of your fancy, big city baseball lawyering. 

But now I'd actually kinda want to know how that would work.  I imagine that if he were optioned, he'd simply be ineligible to play and the same rules for minor league transactions would dictate. 

 

This has been kinda fun in a silly sense. Who knew that baseball rules could be so fun?!

Edited October 2, 20188 yr by wsnydes

 

But now I'd actually kinda want to know how that would work.  I imagine that if he were optioned, he'd simply be ineligible to play and the same rules for minor league transactions would dictate. 

 

This has been kinda fun in a silly sense. Who knew that baseball rules could be so fun?!

 

Well, I did...you did, too, apparently

 

And that's what I would assume, too, re: options. Same would go for a DL stint, I'd imagine.

 

I wouldn’t be surprised if Bannister is on the short list.

 

I'm thinking that's 100% what is going on here.

Good move for the team. I have nothing but good things to say about Molitor as a person, as do all of us, but he was only about 75% of a baseball manager. I hope he sticks around.

 

I imagine Jeff Banister, fired a couple of weeks ago by the Rangers, will be the next Twins manager.

Taking out the obvious connection between him and Levine, why else would we want him? Texas is trending in the wrong direction.

 

It also appears Bannister did very little to develop their young players like Mazara, Odor, and Calhoun.

IMO, this was the correct move.  I felt like the Twins got to the WC last year in spite of Molitor, not because of him.  Don't get me wrong, I loved the guy as a player and he's been a terrific baseball ambassador not just for MLB but for Minnesota as well.  I never felt like he had a good feel for a situation, especially when it came to handling a pitching staff.  How many times would we rant and first-guess in gameday threads about decisions that went awry.  The percentage of decisions that went wrong, I believe, outweighed those that went right.  

 

However, this organization is still trying to dig out of the mess that Bill Smith and Terry Ryan 2.0 created with their trades and their rushing certain players through the minor league ranks.  The current GMs made a nice attempt at bringing in some FA talent for this season and it just completely backfired.  Lynn was terrible, Morrison was even worse, Odorizzi was average at best, Duke and Reed were pretty brutal.  Unfortunately, it left us with a fire sale at the trading deadline and the only significant piece that came back was Tyler Austin.  Let's hope that the farm system that has been growing over the last couple of years can yield a bumper crop for 2019 because I'm not sure that many will be confident in the FA market this year...unless Bryce Harper likes cold springs.

Bryce Harper like Cold Springs beer? Who would have thought that?

 

Taking out the obvious connection between him and Levine, why else would we want him? Texas is trending in the wrong direction.

It also appears Bannister did very little to develop their young players like Mazara, Odor, and Calhoun.

 

Banister (we will have to learn how to spell his name!) was hired by the Rangers because he is an "analytical yet personal" manager. He purportedly was to use "analytics" to make his decisions while using his people skills to mentor.

 

Banister is exactly what this front office says they are looking for.

 

Banister (we will have to learn how to spell his name!) was hired by the Rangers because he is an "analytical yet personal" manager. He purportedly was to use "analytics" to make his decisions while using his people skills to mentor.

 

Banister is exactly what this front office says they are looking for.

Except for a track-record of putting that skill-set towards winning...

 

Except for a track-record of putting that skill-set towards winning...

 

Don't shoot the messenger.

 

Also, you owe me a beer when they Twins announce Banister as the next manager.

I agree with the move.  I'm not suggesting that it was all Paul's fault, but I find it somewhat damning that so many players regressed this year, some quite badly.  Not only did most of the young core fail to improve, but seasoned veterans had miserable drop-offs as well.

 

For no particular reason, I like Carlos Beltran as a candidate.  I know the Yankees seriously considered him last year despite his lack of experience, plus he is held in extremely high regard by most of the Latino baseball community.

Maybe we can talk a HOF pitcher into leading us. Maddux or Pedro anyone? Randy Johnson? 

Ozzie Guillen, Doug Mientkiewicz, or Tommy Watkins would be in my mix of possibilities.

I'm glad this happened, I want this FO to do its thing and see what happens. I did get frustrated with Molitor as a manager. He is articulate though albeit with a unique style. Thoughtful. I find that refreshing in sports especially when compared to a guy like Zimmer who seems to wear his butchery of the English language like a badge of honor.

 

I think the criticism of his bullpen management is overblown. With that bullpen you are going to always be on the edge of overuse because there were only a couple of guys that were any good. More accurate blame would be to the front office for not bringing in better pitchers

Nope, it's on Molitor. Yeah, he could have used better talent but so could every manager.

 

If you burn out your two best pitchers by the end of May, your depth just got worse.

 

Make the best of what you have. Molitor burned through pitchers at a rate that virtually guaranteed a shoddy bullpen by midseason because he'd run all his good pitchers into the ground already.

 

Either Denny Hocking or Michael Cuddyer. Do it. 

 

Sometimes the most logical answers are the ones that get missed.

Quote: This year's disappointing start led to a trade deadline selloff when the Twins were out of the race by mid-summer, but there had been very little speculation that a coaching change was imminent.

 

John Bonnes is obviously not a regular reader of Twins Daily.

My reaction to the news ?  YAAAHOOO !!!