While a catching tandem of Garver/Swihart wouldn’t be all that bad, I don’t see it as a long term solution. I believe the catcher we’re looking for will need to be found outside the organization.

While Realmuto would be awesome, I’d actually prefer Atlanta’s Single A catcher William Contreras, brother of Wilson Contreras.

 

I wouldn't give up on Ben Rortvedt at Fort Myers quite yet.

 

OMG- so that's why they snuck Belisle onto the roster- as Rodney trade insurance?!?

 

OMG....

 

I think you're either on to something or on something!  

 

I wouldn't give up on Ben Rortvedt at Fort Myers quite yet.

oh heck no, but with attrition being what it is, you need Ben Rortvedts in every level of your development org. Last I saw, he was about it in the pipeline.

...a catching tandem of Garver/Swihart wouldn’t be all that bad...

No, thank you. I’ve seen enough of Bobby Wilson.

 

I wouldn't give up on Ben Rortvedt at Fort Myers quite yet.

His best case ETA is sometime during the 2020 season, and that's if he continues to progress as he moves up. He's a great prospect, but we will need someone to bridge the gap and be there if he takes longer to develop.

 

Very bad fall!

A prospect that went from generally unranked, low 70 to 17. Maybe the unthinkable happened at the ranking services got it wrong and the player has always been who he is.

A prospect that went from generally unranked, low 70 to 17. Maybe the unthinkable happened at the ranking services got it wrong and the player has always been who he is.

You mean the prospect who was the #26 overall pick in the 2011 draft?

How would a team with the record of the Red Sox have space for Swihart if he has no talent? Why not DFA him? He is certain to go through if you are correct.

 

If the rumors are correct. They almost did. The choice was Ramirez or Swihart.

 

The Twins need Bullpen Help?????  Then why did they send Moya back to AAA????

Aye-aye, there.  

 

BP help is champing at the bit down in Roch, and for some bloody reason, they either get tapped and sent down too quickly, or don't get tapped at all.  And.... we have Belisle. 

 

You mean the prospect who was the #26 overall pick in the 2011 draft?

For the 26th pick overall he would be more of a success than a failure. Including the picks in the 9 years before him he has the second most bwar. No 26th pick after him has reached the majors. As a 26th pick he has not fallen

 

Holding on to Dozier & Escobar is the wrong move if they get a good deal. Zero reason to hold on to a player that can become a FA after the season.

 

If Dozier wants to come back he can. I would not want him back with the price tag that would be attached to him as well as Gordon needs a spot in 2019.

Edited July 8, 20188 yr by darin617

If the Twins hang unto Escobar they have everything they need for next year.  That is assuming Gordon comes up and Sano comes back.  Most of the rest can be filled by mid level FA's. 

For the 26th pick overall he would be more of a success than a failure. Including the picks in the 9 years before him he has the second most bwar. No 26th pick after him has reached the majors. As a 26th pick he has not fallen

Might as well compare him to his youth baseball teammates too. Just because he has ultimately achieved more than a subset of the population doesn't mean he hasn't also lagged behind his peers in some contexts.

 

How many 26th overall picks out of high school are starting in MLB less than 4 years later?

 

Actually, Swihart was drafted at age 19, had only 6 pro PA before his 20th birthday, and was a MLB starting catcher just after his 23rd, so it was closer to 3 years. I think it's fair to say he's had a fall if he's a DFA candidate by age 26.

 

Another way to look at it: he was basically a league-average or better hitter every year of his pro career, age 20 through 24, the last 2 coming in MLB. Then at age 25 he collapsed to a 47 wRC+ at AAA, and has followed that with a 25 wRC+ in MLB at age 26. Similar story with health / DL time. He had a fall.

Edited July 8, 20188 yr by spycake

For the 26th pick overall he would be more of a success than a failure. Including the picks in the 9 years before him he has the second most bwar. No 26th pick after him has reached the majors. As a 26th pick he has not fallen

It always amazes me when we look at an exact number pick, rather than a range.

 

He's not been good. He's fallen a lot from what people thought. Most if what I read says he's not a good receiver.

 

It always amazes me when we look at an exact number pick, rather than a range.

He's not been good. He's fallen a lot from what people thought. Most if what I read says he's not a good receiver.

For picks 26-30 he the 17h most bwar in that 10 year period.  Do you need a more exhaustive search than that to show he is about what a late first round pick ends up being?

Swihart's drop seems to coincide with his move to a utility player and the ankle injury he suffered.  So I guess I'd be suspicious of his catching ability if the BoSox moved him off that position despite hitting pretty well up to that point.  

For picks 26-30 he the 17h most bwar in that 10 year period. Do you need a more exhaustive search than that to show he is about what a late first round pick ends up being?

No. That's good.

 

But I'm mainly talking about what people are saying they think he will be going forward, which is very different than what they were saying just two years ago. That must not have been as clear as I wanted.

 

I think you're either on to something or on something!  

If Rodney goes, next closer is Busenitz, with Belisle backing him up. 

 

Holding on to Dozier & Escobar is the wrong move if they get a good deal. Zero reason to hold on to a player that can become a FA after the season.

 

If Dozier wants to come back he can. I would not want him back with the price tag that would be attached to him as well as Gordon needs a spot in 2019.

 

If its a good deal, sure.  You might also consider giving one of them a qualifying offer and getting a draft pick if they don't accept.

 

 

Might as well compare him to his youth baseball teammates too. Just because he has ultimately achieved more than a subset of the population doesn't mean he hasn't also lagged behind his peers in some contexts.

How many 26th overall picks out of high school are starting in MLB less than 4 years later?

Actually, Swihart was drafted at age 19, had only 6 pro PA before his 20th birthday, and was a MLB starting catcher just after his 23rd, so it was closer to 3 years. I think it's fair to say he's had a fall if he's a DFA candidate by age 26.

Another way to look at it: he was basically a league-average or better hitter every year of his pro career, age 20 through 24, the last 2 coming in MLB. Then at age 25 he collapsed to a 47 wRC+ at AAA, and has followed that with a 25 wRC+ in MLB at age 26. Similar story with health / DL time. He had a fall.

Yup, age 25 he mashed his left hand a few time. Hard to be a batter with that, The numbers prove it.   There were more than a few people thinking that Aaron Hicks was a head case. He has done OK with a change of scenery.   Your own words are he was a league average hitter. The fall then is not in his play but the evaluation that he is or was more than the 70th some best prospect. They liked his hit tool for a catcher. That made him a valuable prospect but it also means the evaluators were wrong about his potential. Swihart has been a pinch hitter this year. for about half of his games  I would be more than happy to find out the success rate for just pinch hitting for a league average hitter.  Grossman is 4/24 as a pinch hitter

 

 

No. That's good.

But I'm mainly talking about what people are saying they think he will be going forward, which is very different than what they were saying just two years ago. That must not have been as clear as I wanted.

He did not fall evaluators were wrong.

The Rangers got an interesting prospect for taking on some salary dumps.

 

Wishful thinking that the Twins could be in on that right?

I'd still like to see Twins try to add Chirinos from Texas at catcher and still try for this year - remember last year. That said, I'm also not opposed to dumping guys like Rodney, but doubt we'd get anything of immediately usable value for him.

 

I know its a long shot but if I was the Mets would I take Gonsalves, Gordon, and a C-prospect for either Thor or DeGrom?

 

or if you were the Twins would you be willing to include Lewis in a deal for one of them? 

 

I know its a long shot but if I was the Mets would I take Gonsalves, Gordon, and a C-prospect for either Thor or DeGrom?

 

 

That package for Thor would be highway robbery. He's only a couple years older than Gonsalves, and had already been an All-Star by Gonsalve's age. Two good prospects, but for a stud who doesn't hit free agency until 2022?

 

You'd start with Lewis, than add as much as you could stomach

 

Edit: kinda rough that the guy the Twins drafted about 17 slots ahead of Syndergaard now pitches for the Sugar Land Skeeters of the Atlantic League of Professional Baseball.

Edited July 8, 20188 yr by Monkeypaws

 

"Surely you'd like to play for the Twins, Swihart."

"Don't call me Shirley, and don't call me sweetheart." ^*

 

 

 

 

^{* _{Yes, I basically just re-used your same joke. Plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery.}}

Now that's funny. I don't care who you are.

 

The Rangers got an interesting prospect for taking on some salary dumps.

 

Wishful thinking that the Twins could be in on that right?

4 million does not buy a whole lot. The Rangers farm system has a lot of high ceiling players, this gives them a high floor player. Not a bad move.

Duke and Pressly mentioned (not rumored) in mlb.com piece

 

Duke Possible fits: Mariners, Phillies

 

Pressly Possible fits: Yankees, Red Sox, Brewers

 

 

That package for Thor would be highway robbery. He's only a couple years older than Gonsalves, and had already been an All-Star by Gonsalve's age. Two good prospects, but for a stud who doesn't hit free agency until 2022?

 

You'd start with Lewis, than add as much as you could stomach

 

Edit: kinda rough that the guy the Twins drafted about 17 slots ahead of Syndergaard now pitches for the Sugar Land Skeeters of the Atlantic League of Professional Baseball.

Not many people knew about Syndergaard. Look at the 177 names before 118 https://www.perfectgame.org/Rankings/Players/NationalRankings.aspx?gyear=2010

There was an article on the scout that found him. Other than Mastroiani and another cup of coffee player it has been the only player he found. He attributed no scouts watching because Syndergaard pitched on Fridays and scouts were usually watching college games that day. Syndergaard also grew 4 inches his senior year.  Useless but hopefully entertaining information

 

4 million does not buy a whole lot. The Rangers farm system has a lot of high ceiling players, this gives them a high floor player. Not a bad move.

 

Yeah, it's nothing special, but Gearrin is a semi-useful player and Jackson wouldn't be the worst fit for this team either.  Bahr has plenty of reasons to roll the dice on him.

 

I just wish the Twins were open to this sort of trade.

Swihart's drop seems to coincide with his move to a utility player and the ankle injury he suffered.  So I guess I'd be suspicious of his catching ability if the BoSox moved him off that position despite hitting pretty well up to that point.

 

He was competing with two very good defensive catchers. Compared the the defensive bar of Vazquez and Leon he was moved off the position. The Twins have a lower defensive bar at the catcher position.

 

Similarly Brian Harper came up with good defensive veterans like Tony Pena, Joe Ferguson, Edd Ott and Bob Boone in Pittsburgh and California. As a young catcher his defense didn’t match up. He was moved off catcher with Pittsburgh, failed to hit and ran out of options. The Twins gave him another shot at catcher. Though his defense never compared to Pena the Twins didn’t have a Pena in front of him. He was probably pretty close to average but moving off as a young player set his reputation.