Article: Where Are The Prospects?

[Seth Stohs]

With the Twins slow, 8-23 start to the season, I have been asked the following question several times. Where are all of these great prospects that have been touted for so long? If the Twins have one of the best farm systems in baseball, why or when are we going to start seeing them.

 

There are multiple answers to those questions, so we’ll try to consider it today.

 

When Terry Ryan came back to the GM job, he made the comment that he was not going to take shortcuts. I think we can all agree that he hasn’t. It’s been a slow progression forward. But the system has dozens of players who are 26 and under who will be part of the organization.We have seen some, but there are many more to come.Before the 2014 season, the Twins generally had what was considered the top system in baseball. They were led by two consensus Top 10 prospects in all of baseball. Byron Buxton (19 at the time) had completed his first full season in professional baseball and had been named Baseball America’s 2013 minor league player of the year. He was the #1 prospect in all of baseball. He had hit a combined .334/.424/.520 (.944) with 19 doubles, 18 triples and 12 home runs.

 

Baseball America ranked then-20-year-old Miguel Sano number six overall. He was coming off of a season in which he hit a combined .280/.382/.610 (.992) with 30 doubles, five triples and 35 home runs between Ft. Myers and New Britain.

 

Then came the 2014 season. Miguel Sano missed the full season after having Tommy John surgery in the spring. Buxton was limited to just 31 games due to multiple injuries. It was essentially a lost season for both of them.

 

However, they both returned in 2015, starting the season in Chattanooga. Despite the lost development time Buxton was up with the Twins in June, and Sano was called up on July 1st. Buxton lost more time with injury and as the Twins acknowledged, he wasn’t ready and he struggled at the plate. Sano came to the team and was remarkable, finishing third in the AL Rookie of the Year vote despite playing just three months in the big leagues.

 

The Twins went into this season and handed Buxton the starting center field job despite him still not really being ready. Predictably, he struggled again, striking out in about half of his plate appearances. After 15 games, he was sent back down to Rochester, where he is now hitting .276/.344/.534 (.878) with four doubles, a triple and three home runs. He has three walks and seven strikeouts in 38 plate appearances.

 

Sano is a regular in the middle of the Minnesota Twins lineup. After posting a .916 OPS in 2016, his OPS is just 706 through the first 31 games this year. A sophomore slump? Maybe, though the season is just under 20% complete, so there is plenty of room for a resurgence.

 

The Twins status as the top minor league system was largely based on the top two prospects, and despite their 2016 struggles, both remain two of the most exciting players in baseball’s future. Buxton needs to cut down on the strikeouts, but with his speed and defense, he can be a valuable player with just minimal offensive improvement. But there is no reason to think that the 22-year-old can’t make the needed adjustments. What he needs is more time in AAA. With 14 games played with the Red Wings this year, he now has just 26 total games played at AAA. Patience is important. And Sano is still just 23, learning the game, learning a new position, learning pitchers, and (hopefully) learning how to take care of himself physically. Many may choose to give up on these prospects. I still think they both have multiple All-Star games in their future.

 

However, the Twins system was not solely based on two players. Here is a quick look at the rest of my personal 2014 Twins prospect rankings (with their 2013 team).

 

#3 - RHP Alex Meyer - New Britain

#4 - RHP Kohl Stewart - GCL/Elizabethton

#5 - 2B Eddie Rosario - Ft. Myers/New Britain

#6 - IF Jorge Polanco - Cedar Rapids

#7 - RHP Jose Berrios - Cedar Rapids

#8 - C Josmil Pinto - New Britain/Rochester/Minnesota

#9 - OF/1B Max Kepler - Cedar Rapids

#10 - Lewis Thorpe - GCL Twins

 

A quick glance of this list shows the volatility of prospect rankings, and yet this also shows why many still are excited about the Twins system. Look at how many of the top prospects then are top prospects now despite moving up 2 or 3 levels. Notice also how many of them were in Low-A Cedar Rapids just over two yeas ago.

 

Let’s start with Josmil Pinto. The Twins DFAd him a year ago, and after a couple of other DFAs, he is now with the Brewers AAA team. He had a strong showing that 2013 season in September but wasn’t able to stay healthy after that.

 

Alex Meyer was ranked #62 overall by Baseball America, but he was Top 30 in both MLB.com and Baseball Prospectus rankings. He went to Rochester in 2014 and was one of the league’s top starting pitchers. Then came 2015, a miserable year for Meyer. However, he is off to a strong start in 2016 and we can still be hopeful that the 26-year-old can rebound, maybe even as a starter.

 

Kohl Stewart had just been drafted and there was a lot of excitement. While his 2015 season left some question marks among prospect rankers, his 2016 season has improved his prospect status. Similarly, Lewis Thorpe was just coming off of a remarkable US debut season in the Gulf Coast League. Despite 2015 Tommy John surgery, his prospect status remains high.

 

Eddie Rosario was coming off of a terrific season which shadowed Sano’s. He was still playing second base, but it would be his last year there since Brian Dozier became a mainstay with the Twins.. While Sano and Buxton missed time in 2014 due to injury, Rosario missed 50 games to start 2014 due to a suspension. When he returned, he struggled at AA. However, in 2015, he came up to the Twins and had an impressive showing. He hit .267 with 18 doubles, 15 triples, 13 home runs, and 16 outfield assists. He’s off to a horrible start in 2016 which isn’t completely surprising with his complete inability to control the strike zone or willingness to not swing from time to time. He’s still only 24.

 

Jose Berrios, Jorge Polanco and Max Kepler all played the 2013 season in Cedar Rapids. Polanco had his first cup of coffee with the Twins in 2014 and has had about seven such calls since then. Kepler was the MVP of the AA Southern League in 2015 and debuted with the Twins last September. He’s already spent time with the Twins this year. And, Jose Berrios has taken off as a prospect. He has been the Twins minor league pitcher of the year the last two years and now has two big league starts under his belt. All three of these guys remain Top 10 Twins prospects, Top 100 overall prospects, and guys who should be a big part of the Twins future.

 

Prospects 11-20 (from my Top Prospect rankings)

 

#11 - OF Adam Brett Walker - Cedar Rapids

#12 - RHP Trevor May - New Britain/Rochester

#13 - LHP Stephen Gonsalves - GCL/Elizabethton

#14 - 3B Travis Harrison - Cedar Rapids

#15 - SS Danny Santana - New Britain

#16 - OF Amaurys Minier - GCL

#17 - DH/1B Kennys Vargas - Ft. Myers

#18 - RHP Ryan Eades - Elizabethton

#19 - RHP Felix Jorge - Elizabethton

#20 - SS Niko Goodrum - Cedar Rapids

 

Again, this list includes some intriguing names. Adam Brett Walker is on the 40-man roster and playing in Rochester.

 

Trevor May is in his second season with the Twins and their top reliever. Could he still start? Maybe, but if not, he can also be a dominant bullpen option for years to come.

 

Like Kohl Stewart, Gonsalves was just drafted and had an impressive pro debut in the rookie leagues. While Stewart was pushed quickly, Gonsalves was about a half-season behind. Now, they’re both at Ft. Myers, pitching well, and both could move up to Chattanooga at any time. Felix Jorge is also with the Miracle and pitching very well.

 

Danny Santana came up to the Twins and received votes in Rookie of the Year balloting. 2015 was very frustrating. Santana is likely somewhere in between. Right now, he is the team’s starting center fielder. One of the best athletes, he can play six positions and can provide value in that utility type of role.

 

Like Santana, Vargas came up in August of 2014 and hit nine home runs the rest of the season. The Twins gave him plenty of chances in 2015 but he was unable to get that type of production back. He went down to the minor leagues a couple of times and returned in September. He is currently hitting .217/.315/.308 (.625) with four doubles and two home runs in Rochester. That said, at 25, he still has potential to be a viable bench option and provide some punch off the bat.

 

Ryan Eades was also just drafted and threw a few innings in Elizabethton. He has certainly had his struggles, but a solid 2015 in Ft. Myers earned him a promotion to AA where he has had mixed results. But as Mike Berardino reported during spring training, he touched 97 a few times and does have a solid four-pitch mix, so he’s got a chance to be a back-of-the-rotation starter.

 

Goodrum is out right now with a stress reaction in his foot and will likely be out another month or so.

 

BUT WAIT, THERE’S MORE

 

That was a look at my Top 20 Twins prospects just over two years ago, and we’ve already seen some of these terrific prospects surface in the big leagues. However, in the last couple of drafts, the Twins have added even more talent. They have drafted Nick Gordon and Tyler Jay in the last two first rounds. Both have high ceilings.

 

They also added some flame-throwing relievers such as JT Chargois, Nick Burdi and Jake Reed who have already been in big league spring training. Mason Melotakis, Luke Bard, Michael Cederoth, Trevor Hildenberger, Brandon Peterson, Corey Williams and others could surface in the next couple of years too.

 

In addition to Murphy, Stuart Turner and Mitch Garver are in AA. Like Lewis Thorpe, Fernando Romero had Tommy John surgery and will be back soon.

 

VETERANS

 

While we are talking about the youth and the struggles of the youth, it is important to notice that the Twins roster includes many veterans (many of whom are struggling). Brian Dozier. Trevor Plouffe. Joe Mauer. Eduardo Nunez. Kurt Suzuki. Phil Hughes. Ervin Santana. Kyle Gibson. Ricky Nolasco. Kevin Jepsen. Glen Perkins. And Casey Fien and Tommy Milone have already been DFAd.

For the Twins to win in 2016, they needed two things. First, they needed some of the young players to take a step forward. However, they also needed strong performances from veterans. To this point in the season, Joe Mauer and Eduardo Nunez have been the two players who have performed well throughout the season.

 

The Twins need more from the rookies, but they also need more from the guys with Major League track records.

 

SUMMARY

 

Several years ago, I recall talking to Kyle Gibson. He was in A ball and I asked him what it meant to him to be considered the team’s top prospect. He basically said that it was a nice honor, but “being a prospect means you haven’t done anything yet.”

 

Major League Baseball is hard, and each level of the minor leagues gets gradually more difficult. Two years ago, the Twins had a lot of young prospects, but prospects that had a long way to go in terms of steps up and development.

 

That's why I've also often written that the reason it is so important to have as many prospects as possible. If you have 20 very good prospects, it likely means that one of them will become a perennial all-star, maybe two will become solid regulars, a handful will play a role on the big league team and several might get a cup of coffee.

 

So far, we have seen Danny Santana, Kennys Vargas, Miguel Sano, Byron Buxton, Michael Tonkin, Alex Meyer, Jorge Polanco and Jose Berrios in the big leagues. Some more than others. Also consider that Oswaldo Arcia just turned 25 yesterday. John Ryan Murphy is still just 24 years old.

 

They have come to the big leagues with mixed results.There have been guys who have struggled initially. There have been several who came up quickly and then struggled in year 2 when the league adjusted. At this point the players will need to make the adjustment back. Baseball, like life, is all about adjustments, and hopefully these young players will be able to do just that.

If there is a hope for the 2016 season, it is two-fold.

 

First, the veterans will need to step up and perform to their proven capabilities. Second, there is hope that as the season moves on, the prospects and young players can make some adjustments. That’s not to say that the Twins will jump back into playoff contention - so much would need to go perfectly for that to happen - but as a fan, we should want to see that happen to give us hope for 2017 and beyond.

 

So when someone asks, where are all the prospects, the overwhelming answer should be, "They're almost all still there."

 

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[gil4]

I recall talking to Kyle Gibson ... and I asked him what it meant to him to be considered the team’s top prospect.

 

To us, it meant the Twins needed better prospects.  (Gibson was a decent prospect, not a great one).  Fortunately, they got some.  Unfortunately, they had to lose a lot of games to get into position to draft them. 

[Dantes929]

I haven't lost patience.    I don't think you even mentioned the best pitcher of the last 10 months.   Duffey.

 

[Monkeypaws]

David McCarty and Willie Banks are good examples of how high national ranking doesn't always equate to big-league stardom.

 

Baseball America allows you to look at the top 100 prospects for every year back to 1990. Very interesting to see some very highly ranked prospects flame out over the years, a la Brien Taylor or Todd Van Poppel.

 

https://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/all-time#2015

 

OTOH, quite a lot make it big as well.

 

It's not an exact science.

[HitInAPinch]

I'm with Monkeypaws, but I go further.  Or I'm just being cynical.

 

I think the MiLB prospect rankings should somehow be reclassified.  Or taken with a modicum of skepticism.

 

Physically gifted Rookie League or A-ball players can easily overwhelm the less gifted.  Flip side:  Players in their late 20's can overwhelm younger player,  MiLB and MLB.  I have no way how you could create rankings this way.  Maybe a new sabermetric?  Or one that's already out there, somewhere, over the rainbow?

 

 

 

[deanlambrecht]

 

I think the MiLB prospect rankings should somehow be reclassified.  Or taken with a modicum of skepticism.

 

"Reclassified," perhaps.   Any suggestions about how they could do a better job of rankings?

 

"Taken with a modicum of skepticism," no doubt.   Never was in doubt.   Anyone who wasn't already doing that was simply fooling him/herself.   Prospect rankings have never pretended to be something that shouldn't be greeted with informed skepticism.

[EddieMatthews]

Is there something wrong with the way the Twins handle their prospects and rookies?  This year is a good example.  Several prospects have been brought up, yet they sat on the bench.  Should they be thrown into the game instead?  And does every good rookie have to slump in year two?  Are the minor league teams not developing these guys?  

[Han Joelo]

Nice to step back and take stock this way.  All of sports are riddled with examples of GM's/Coaches who got fired just before all the prospect/draft work they'd laid down came to fruition.  Joe Maddon and Phil Jackson are excellent coaches, no doubt, and one of the best examples of how smart they are is in how they chose what teams to manage/coach.

 

It is frustrating when we see guys like Trout have seemingly instant success, and it is hard to be patient.  For all the criticism leveled at the Twins, I'm glad they didn't trade Jose Berrios for Ken Giles, or Max Kepler for Craig Kimbrel.  I enjoy the long game of watching this play out, which is one of the reasons I'm a Twins fan, since they are a rare team that doesn't make knee jerk reactions and change coaches/GM every other year.

[Seth Stohs]

 

To us, it meant the Twins needed better prospects.  (Gibson was a decent prospect, not a great one).  Fortunately, they got some.  Unfortunately, they had to lose a lot of games to get into position to draft them. 

 

He was the #34 prospect in all of baseball (pretty much where Berrios was) before Tommy John and still a Top 100 guy after the surgery. So, sure, maybe he should have been a #2 prospect in a good system, but he was a clear Top 5 in any organization. 

[TheLeviathan]

"Where are the prospects" doesn't require a literal answer.  The question is really "Why aren't they helping if you've kept telling us they're so good"

 

That's the question that needs answering.  Or, perhaps, if you like these guys so much...why do you keep bypassing them for organizational filler?

[Seth Stohs]

 

I haven't lost patience.    I don't think you even mentioned the best pitcher of the last 10 months.   Duffey.

 

Fair point... He wasn't a Top 30 guy two years ago. He jumped to #16 before the 2015 season. But you're right. He's another sub-26-year-old who has done well. 

 

Though I think the MLB team is much more 'veteran' than we want to think, there are so many guys 26 and under that are there or close, and those top 4 guys (Sano, Buxton, Kepler, Berrios - are all 23 and under).

[Seth Stohs]

 

David McCarty and Willie Banks are good examples of how high national ranking doesn't always equate to big-league stardom.

 

Baseball America allows you to look at the top 100 prospects for every year back to 1990. Very interesting to see some very highly ranked prospects flame out over the years, a la Brien Taylor or Todd Van Poppel.

 

https://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/all-time#2015

 

OTOH, quite a lot make it big as well.

 

It's not an exact science.

 

No question, and tha'ts been a point made many time. Prospect rankings are what they are, but they are definitely not an exact science which is why my point about accumulating as much talent and prospects as possible helps the odds that one or two become stars.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Nice to step back and take stock this way.  All of sports are riddled with examples of GM's/Coaches who got fired just before all the prospect/draft work they'd laid down came to fruition.  Joe Maddon and Phil Jackson are excellent coaches, no doubt, and one of the best examples of how smart they are is in how they chose what teams to manage/coach.

 

It is frustrating when we see guys like Trout have seemingly instant success, and it is hard to be patient.  For all the criticism leveled at the Twins, I'm glad they didn't trade Jose Berrios for Ken Giles, or Max Kepler for Craig Kimbrel.  I enjoy the long game of watching this play out, which is one of the reasons I'm a Twins fan, since they are a rare team that doesn't make knee jerk reactions and change coaches/GM every other year.

 

Really? The rare team? I don't think that's quite right, frankly. 

 

Name the last hitter this team drafted and developed, and how long ago it was.......I would go with Dozier or Plouffe. that's an awful long drought of drafted players that are legit MLB players, isn't it?

 

It's not about the time (only), but the frequency......and the continual pipeline. 

 

On the pitching side, they started the year with 4 FAs/traded for guys in the starting rotation.......

 

For me, it seems reasonable to question their drafting and their development, given the results. YMMV, of course.

[Seth Stohs]

 

I'm with Monkeypaws, but I go further.  Or I'm just being cynical.

 

I think the MiLB prospect rankings should somehow be reclassified.  Or taken with a modicum of skepticism.

 

Physically gifted Rookie League or A-ball players can easily overwhelm the less gifted.  Flip side:  Players in their late 20's can overwhelm younger player,  MiLB and MLB.  I have no way how you could create rankings this way.  Maybe a new sabermetric?  Or one that's already out there, somewhere, over the rainbow?

 

I just don't think you can put humans (particularly prospects) into a formula and feel any better about it. Maybe. I'm sure there are people out there trying. But I think it's impossible. 

 

I also think that Prospect Rankings are and should certainly be viewed for what they are... a guess into the future based on many attributes, including Age-to-Level-of-Competition. 

[Seth Stohs]

 

Is there something wrong with the way the Twins handle their prospects and rookies?  This year is a good example.  Several prospects have been brought up, yet they sat on the bench.  Should they be thrown into the game instead?  And does every good rookie have to slump in year two?  Are the minor league teams not developing these guys?  

 

I would say that most teams would NOT call up prospects to sit on the bench. I also think that based on the Twins 40-man roster, and at the time, health and needing to try to get other guys going, I don't know that they could have handled it a lot different. Guys like Kepler need to play, but in the season's first two weeks, they need to go with their starters, and that was Rosario and Sano in the corners, and then Arcia got hot, so had to go with him. 

 

The best thing to happen for Kepler and Buxton was getting sent down to AAA and getting to get top-of-the-order at bats every day at a level where they can have some success.

 

Polanco is more difficult, but again, look at the 40-man roster and is there another player that could be called up to play middle infield positions? I don't think there is. And it doesn't make sense to make a 40-man roster move for 10 days. I would like to see him play more, but I get it. 

[savvyspy]

Why do we not know if a 26 year old "prospect" is a starter or reliever by this point?? This again points to the Twins front office having no plan for these guys. The GM and manager don't even seem like they are on the same page with these guys.

[Don't Feed the Greed Guy]

I will remember 2010 as a great time to drive down to Kansas City and watch the Twins feast on a Royal banquet of top prospects coming out of the KC pipeline. Outdoor baseball, and records like 12-6 (2008) 12-6 (2009) and 13-5 (2010) against our AL Central rivals made for a strong Minnesota section at Kauffman Stadium , drowning out the locals with chants of "MVP" when Joe Mauer came to bat.

 

Billy "Country Breakfast" Butler was on the menu, as well as high-draft prospects like Luke Hochevar and Mike Moustakas. Alex Gordon was maturing, but still young and raw. In 2011, Eric Hosmer was 21 years old, and Salvador Perez played in 39 games as a twenty-one-year-old catcher.

 

All that began to change as the Twin's dominance declined to a respectable 10-8 (2011), then 11-7 (2012). The big switch came in 2013, when Kauffman Stadium became a home field for powder blue again. Minnesota went 4-15 against Kansas City. The shift in dominance turned northward as droves of fans from Missouri and Kansas came north on I-35 to Target Field. Kauffman entertained back-to-back World Series games. Target field entertained empty seats.

 

All I'm saying is that this trend from Prospect to Respect will take time. Who can tell where Eddie Rosario, Miguel Sano, and Byron Buxton will be playing when they enter their early thirties, like Gordon and Hochevar? "Country Breakfast" just turned thirty too. The Royals let him go to Oakland as a free agent after the 2014 season. Good move.

 

This much is for sure: Prospects will be moving rapidly through the Minnesota pipeline as the losing continues. Kansas City endured nine losing seasons in a row before turning things around in 2013. Minnesota may be halfway through its losing stretch, with last year's modest winning record being a small reprieve. 

 

I began to think that 2018 might be the season when the tide would turn. It might take longer. What do you think, Seth, others?

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

David McCarty and Willie Banks are good examples of how high national ranking doesn't always equate to big-league stardom.

 

Baseball America allows you to look at the top 100 prospects for every year back to 1990. Very interesting to see some very highly ranked prospects flame out over the years, a la Brien Taylor or Todd Van Poppel.

 

https://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/all-time#2015

 

OTOH, quite a lot make it big as well.

 

It's not an exact science.

A simple ranking like this will never be exact science, but I think prospect lists have gotten a lot better since the days of McCarty.

 

For example, there is no way Todd Van Poppel would be rated #2 and #7 anymore after his performances of 1991 and 1992.  Heck, he probably wouldn't have been #1 after his draft year either -- Buxton was only #10 at that point, and Correa #13.  Same with Brien Taylor -- #1 before he even threw a pro pitch!

 

McCarty is another one -- a college first baseman who posted a .785 OPS at AA.  You don't see that kind of player ranked in the top 20 anymore.

[mikelink45]

Sorry Seth, but I really have a lot less rosy picture of this teams handling of prospects and minor leaguers.  I started with the Twins by ushering their first year and continue to watch, read, and care, but have been really disappointed in the developmental progress of our minor leaguers and their transition to the majors.  

 

With all the money spent in baseball I think that there needs to be more money and better coaching - sometimes one to one - to get these players ready for the majors and then ready for year two.  

 

Not all will make the leap to the majors and that is no one's fault, but there are some special players who deserve more of a chance.  And fans who are waiting. 

[Eris]

 

Why do we not know if a 26 year old "prospect" is a starter or reliever by this point?? This again points to the Twins front office having no plan for these guys. The GM and manager don't even seem like they are on the same page with these guys.

Most of this (maybe all of this) is on Meyer.  He has two great pitches, if he could consistently throw strikes with both pitches he would be a starter.  If he can only throw his fastball for a strike, he might not even make it as a reliever.  Compare Meyer to Berrios.  Meyer, when he is on, has better stuff than Berrios.  What Berrios has though is the ability to consistently throw 3 pitches for strike.  Because of his control, Berrios will be a much better pitcher.  (A comparison between Duffy and Meyer might be better because both essentially have only 2 pitches)

[Han Joelo]

 

Really? The rare team? I don't think that's quite right, frankly. 

 

Name the last hitter this team drafted and developed, and how long ago it was...….Miguel Sano

 

Hey, I get the frustration, and it's not like I don't question decisions management makes.  I guess it is the farmer in me that is more accepting of the vagaries and unpredictability of the big ol' cycle of life than most people.  Bad weather happens, economic forces in other parts of the world happen, diet fads happen.  All you can do is keep working.  Hopefully at the end of the day, no matter what happens, you can say you tried to do things the right way.

 

Pro sports is littered with teams changing course, attempting to chase the next big thing, be it a coach that espouses the Triangle, The Spread, or The Strikeout, or a GM that seemingly has figured out how to beat Vegas.  But it still comes down to a roll of the dice, which is what makes it a game, and for me, what makes it fun.

 

These are my guys; I'm rolling the dice with them.  It sucks that things are coming up snake-eyes right now, but hey, I'm getting a lot of stuff done around the house.

[Mike Sixel]

Sano was an international signing. I am taktalking about the US scouting and development. But sure, 1 hitter in how many years?

[troyhobbs]

Position wise I think they'll have enough prospects pan out, pitching I'm not so sure. A couple years ago a rotation of Meyer, Berrios, Stewart, May, and Gibson sounded more promising than it does these days. Their future is fine but they need to stop clinging to stale veterans and commit to rebuilding. Despite all the miserable seasons they've never blown things up yet.

[Deduno Abides]

No question, and tha'ts been a point made many time. Prospect rankings are what they are, but they are definitely not an exact science which is why my point about accumulating as much talent and prospects as possible helps the odds that one or two become stars.

This is one of my main concerns about the front office. Instead of accumulating more talented prospects by trading veterans either at the height of their value (Willingham, Hughes, Suzuki, Plouffe, Dozier) or right before they will walk as free agents (Cuddyer, Kubel), they hold onto the veteran, often at increased cost.

 

Couple that with a prospect development system that seems to be below average, which may be the reason for hanging onto the veterans, sprinkle some cultural problems on top, and you have a team with a poor record for several years.

[Han Joelo]

 

Sano was an international signing. I am taktalking about the US scouting and development. But sure, 1 hitter in how many years?

I'm not disagreeing.  It has been a while, although it looks like Chris Hermann is working out.

 

Still, looking at bigger cycles, drafting and developing 2 MVP's this century is pretty good.  How many teams can say that?  So much criticism leveled at the Twin's might be pretty blunted if it weren't for injuries to Mauer and Morneau right when they were in their primes.

[beckmt]

 

Position wise I think they'll have enough prospects pan out, pitching I'm not so sure. A couple years ago a rotation of Meyer, Berrios, Stewart, May, and Gibson sounded more promising than it does these days. Their future is fine but they need to stop clinging to stale veterans and commit to rebuilding. Despite all the miserable seasons they've never blown things up yet.

Pitching wise, I feel they will be fine.  They have Berrios and Duffy here now, with Meyer, Stewart, Gonsalves, Romero, Rosario, Thorpe, Jorge and others in the minors.  If 1/3 of these are major league starters, Twins pitching will be fine.  Bullpen has there own crop coming.

Hitting not so sure, but Twins should have money for free agents to fix whatever holes show up,  Catcher for one.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I'm not disagreeing.  It has been a while, although it looks like Chris Hermann is working out.

 

Still, looking at bigger cycles, drafting and developing 2 MVP's this century is pretty good.  How many teams can say that?  So much criticism leveled at the Twin's might be pretty blunted if it weren't for injuries to Mauer and Morneau right when they were in their primes.

 

I just wish they had moved Mauer out from behind the plate a year earlier, as many here and elsewhere suggested. His career, imo, would look totally different.

 

Of course, Mauer and Morneau are even earlier in history than Plouffe and Dozier.....

[Deduno Abides]

Most of this (maybe all of this) is on Meyer.  He has two great pitches, if he could consistently throw strikes with both pitches he would be a starter.  If he can only throw his fastball for a strike, he might not even make it as a reliever.  Compare Meyer to Berrios.  Meyer, when he is on, has better stuff than Berrios.  What Berrios has though is the ability to consistently throw 3 pitches for strike.  Because of his control, Berrios will be a much better pitcher.  (A comparison between Duffy and Meyer might be better because both essentially have only 2 pitches)

No, a thousand times no. This is how management escapes accountability. A guy has a drug problem or a bad attitude about teamwork or practice? That's on him. A talented player can't harness his skills or develop a needed skill? That's coaching. Further, look at write-ups on Meyer for the 2011 draft. It talks about his lack of control. Therefore, the person trading a MLB centerfielder for him shares fault for not knowing how to make him succeed. And that's more than "We thought we could." Some teams have demonstrated the ability to fix flaws and develop pitchers, which means they are likely better at figuring out and implementing plans to address weaknesses.

[Mike Sixel]

 

No, a thousand times no. This is how management escapes accountability. A guy has a drug problem or a bad attitude about teamwork or practice? That's on him. A talented player can't harness his skills or develop a needed skill? That's coaching. Further, look at write-ups on Meyer for the 2011 draft. It talks about his lack of control. Therefore, the person trading a MLB centerfielder for him shares fault for not knowing how to make him succeed. And that's more than "We thought we could." Some teams have demonstrated the ability to fix flaws and develop pitchers, which means they are likely better at figuring out and implementing plans to address weaknesses.

 

As one of the owners of the site pointed out, the history of tall pitchers is really bad. The Twins traded a legit starting CF for him, so it was on them to:

 

1. Understand the risk

2. Believe they could fix his issues

[Seth Stohs]

 

Why do we not know if a 26 year old "prospect" is a starter or reliever by this point?? This again points to the Twins front office having no plan for these guys. The GM and manager don't even seem like they are on the same page with these guys.

 

Because things can change... He was thought of as a starter until last year when things were not going well at all and they moved him ot the bullpen, hoping it would help. 2016 came and they said, let's try the starting thing again, and through three appearances, it'd been good. It's easier to move a guy to the bullpen.