I would prefer the Twins take whatever steps necessary to acquire a full time solution that will be here for a few years than a possible short term platoon mate.

 

That probably requires a trade.

While he's not perfect, I'd be all on board with a run at Wieters. All it requires is money.

While he's not perfect, I'd be all on board with a run at Wieters. All it requires is money.

And likely a first round draft pick.

I see a catcher caught 1078 innings and only had 54 attempts against him.

Yah, I looked up somebody too, while doing a tiny amount of context-checking before my last post. You thought of one guy, I thought of the other. So now I'm poking around some more.

 

Washington and St Louis were head and shoulders above the rest of the NL teams in preventing base-theft attempts, 85 and 83 respectively, while no other team was below 99.

 

Atlanta was about in the middle of the pack with 117, and there were teams like Pit and San Diego with 187 and 182. These are team numbers of course - individual catchers will vary within teams, but somebody on the Bucs and Pads was getting a lot of practice throwing to second and I'm not taking the time to point fingers individually for this discussion.

 

So no, I wouldn't embarrass AJ by comparing him to Ramos or Molina. I wasn't saying he was the best. He's not even average - backup catchers for Atlanta helped salvage their total numbers (which of course pretty much negates the WHIP argument).

 

But if teams were running wild on him (someone else's term for it, not necessarily yours), we need a stronger adjective for several other catchers who logged a lot of innings in the league.

And likely a first round draft pick.

True. I overlooked that aspect of it.

 

http://mweb.cbssports.com/mlb/writer/jon-heyman/25350518/inside-baseball-ins-and-outs-of-mattinglys-exit-skipper-searches-and-more

Per Heyman.

Twins fans, would you still boo him?

yup, and Terry Ryan too

yup, and Terry Ryan too

If Terry boos a guy he just signed, he should probably get evaluated for schizophrenia.

And likely a first round draft pick.

Not if we sign Davis first, then it's a 2nd!

 

If Terry boos a guy he just signed, he should probably get evaluated for schizophrenia.

sorry, let me clarify, I would boo AJ and TR 

 

That sounds like you're asking for TD to be a reputable source of breaking Twins news (which it's really not supposed to be) but with none of that pesky journalistic integrity.

 

Nope. Far from it.

Heyman made his claim without disclosing any sources, ours was made by a poster who flat out named names. If Heyman was going to name names, he would have confirmed that he could disclose this news on the record, and if he was reputable, an editor would have further confirmed this information.

 

Our poster was being helpful to TD, but clearly did not get permission to use this information from his source. If an actual reporter wrote the same piece as our poster, and his editor called the Twins to confirm, but they denied everything, it wouldn't have been published either.

What? You think a paper wouldn't run a story if the team denies it? My goodness. That's not how news organizations work at all... furthermore did the Twins deny the info or did they instead demand you censor a post because it was too sensitive?

 

Face it, it was a chicken excrement decision by the site founders, who showed they value access above all else.

 

But whatever its not my site so you guys can do as you like.

Edited October 25, 201511 yr by clutterheart

Moderator note: Let's stick to topic here. This is a thread about AJ. If you have questions about the site and how and why it does what it does, ask a question in the MinnCentric forum or feel free to PM one of the site owners or a moderator.

 

Thanks.

Wieters is a good first choice, AJ can be a plan B. I'm also hoping Garver makes a leap up.

No - I would boo Terry Ryan for another Twins bum of the year signing.  Move on, do we have to let every former Twin end his career here?  Someone younger with an arm would be my choice and I do not hate AJ, but of course I also do not see him as the new club house Torii.

 

No - I would boo Terry Ryan for another Twins bum of the year signing.  Move on, do we have to let every former Twin end his career here?  Someone younger with an arm would be my choice and I do not hate AJ, but of course I also do not see him as the new club house Torii.

 

 

Wieters is a good first choice, AJ can be a plan B. I'm also hoping Garver makes a leap up.

 

Bum of the year?  That's a little harsh- save that for signings of guys like Stauffer.  Kurt Suzuki produced -0.1 fWAR in 2015, AJ produced 2.1 fWAR in part-time duty- that's not the production of a "bum".

 

It would certainly serve the interests of both the Twins performance-wise, plus the fan-base if they make some move, any move, in the offseason to both upgrade the catching position and give them flexibility with Suzuki after 2016. Accomplishing the ideal- signing Wieters or acquiring a top veteran or up-and-coming youngster via trade are costly and/or risky options.

 

Signing AJ on a one-year deal is a good Plan C in my book.  It wouldn't be a great signing, but it would be a lot better than standing pat. And it has the added benefit of allowing for the mid-season emergence of Garver or Turner-  making it easy to either trade or DFA one of the veterans. 

Edited October 25, 201511 yr by jokin

AJ defied the calendar in 2015 at age 38 to an even greater extent than Torii did at age 40. While at some point we can expect a decline, the question everyone interested in his services will ask is whether the decline will be subtle or dramatic. Given his long career, there is a pretty good chance he will be at least 80% of what he produced last year.

 

He had well over 400 plate appearances, so it isn't like he played twice a week, more like he was platooned, which would be the exact situation he would find himself in for the Twins in 2016.

 

In order, I would like to see a good catcher like Lucroy or Wieters acquired, preferring Lucroy as a better blend of health, cost, defense and offense. Second, a good to excellent prospect (less than a full year of service time) and third, a one-year contract for someone to share time with Suzuki, with a lefty hitter probably getting more time than Zuke. My biggest reservation about Pierzynski is his defense, particularly his throwing and the small risk that he will regress dramatically.

AJ was a 2.1 WAR player in 113 games played.  That's top 10 at the position. Hunter was a 0.5 WAR player in 139 games played.  Of the 33 RF who had 400 or more PAs, that ranked him 25th. 

 

Yet I'd rather have Hunter back than sign AJ.  Best option would be neither is signed.

Edited October 25, 201511 yr by jimmer

Look, I'd love to see the Twins find the right deal, for the right price, and acquire a young catcher who can hit, provide some pop, not be a windmill at the plate, and play solid defense, call a nice game and throw. But I'm not interested in Berrios and Kepler for some young prospect. 

 

We're not going to trade for Mauer. But I don't want to trade for Butera either. (Or Walbeck, the last catcher I can recall the Twins calling for) If the right deal isn't there, the question I ask myself is; "are we a better team with AJ on board sharing time with Suzuki, (probably as the primary), providing experience and a solid bat with some power vs Herrmann or Fryer?" The answer is YES, we are a better team with AJ than without him.

Suzuki and AJ would pair to be the worst defensive combo in the league. And AJ could plummet really quickly. I don't really care about what side of the plate the Twins catching acquisition hits from, honestly.

 

Suzuki and AJ would pair to be the worst defensive combo in the league. And AJ could plummet really quickly. I don't really care about what side of the plate the Twins catching acquisition hits from, honestly.

 

Yes, he "could" plummet quickly, that's part of the risk. But, you can't just ignore that the risk will be mitigated somewhat in utilizing a L-R platoon to some degree. And isn't the current defensive combo already just about the worst in the league? At least there would be the chance to add some punch to the bottom of the lineup.

 

Again, AJ should be a Plan C.  But... there's plenty of risk in signing Wieters and his shaky health situation as a Plan A (even though this is the catcher I prefer that they target).  And the costs of trading for a catcher has its own set of costs and risks- Plan B..  There's only so much that Plouffe and Arcia can get you, especially when other teams know how much you wouldn't mind getting rid of  them.

Edited October 25, 201511 yr by jokin

 

Look, I'd love to see the Twins find the right deal, for the right price, and acquire a young catcher who can hit, provide some pop, not be a windmill at the plate, and play solid defense, call a nice game and throw. But I'm not interested in Berrios and Kepler for some young prospect. 

 

 

 

How about Gonsalves for McGuire or Contreras?

How about Gonsalves for McGuire or Contreras?

Assuming you are referring to Wilson Contreras and Reese McGuire? McGuire hits LH, which is a lot more rare, but Contreras looks to be the better hitter and played at AA I believe, so he's closer. So I'd have to say Contreras at this point, but would have to do more research.

 

While Stewart is still rated higher and seems to have the highest upside potential, I think I'd rather trade him than the top LHSP prospect in my system, Gonsalves. But would either of these two really provide an upgrade over Turner and Garver at this point?

 

I'm not going to get into a prolonged argument about it but we hardly "beg" for access. As I've come to discover, there was one piece of that post the Twins didn't want released publicly and it's probably the last thing you'd expect. And we respected that request after prolonged debate.

Criticize us as you will but at least show a little integrity when you do it. We were transparent not as an acquiescence to the Twins, but to be honest with our users.

We could have simply deleted the thread and brushed it off as moderation because that thread was ripe for it. Instead, we tried to be open and honest about it. If you want to criticize that decision, so be it. That's fair... But your petty shots at the writers who spend thousands of hours a year delivering content YOU want to read will not sit well with me.

 

 

 

I'll straight out this is my favorite baseball site on the web, even though I think half of the new metrics are ridiculous and Billy Beane gets 1000 times too much credit here.  I appreciate the mods and the info here greatly.

 

That said, this is bull.  Any thread has questioned this gets locked.  Any poster who dares to question this topic gets petty shots taken at them.  I have a bigger issue with reactions from mods than the deletion itself. 

 

/rant

And AJ is not an option at catcher.  I question Ryan more each season, this has disaster written all over it.  Extremely little upside and a high chance of failure statistically, professionally, and instructionally.  Terrible idea, might as well have Pinto go out and catch at that rate. 

You know, there's another thing to think about.  While Suzuki was a poor framer last year, AJ was even worse.  How might that help our staff?

 

http://www.statcorner.com/CatcherReport.php

 

 

You know, there's another thing to think about.  While Suzuki was a poor framer last year, AJ was even worse.  How might that help our staff?

 

http://www.statcorner.com/CatcherReport.php

Zuke was a worse framer in prior years but put in a lot of work with the coaches last spring. This was well documented on the early season pre-game shows on GO. I hope its safe to assume they would coach up Pierzynski too to where he is at least not a complete liability framing-wise.

 

Zuke was a worse framer in prior years but put in a lot of work with the coaches last spring. This was well documented on the early season pre-game shows on GO. I hope its safe to assume they would coach up Pierzynski too to where he is at least not a complete liability framing-wise.

 

Suzuki did put in a lot of work to get better at this and it showed early in the season where people were noting he was a positive framer now (people like pointing out, and even like to write about, changes that occur in small sample sizes and proclaim the changes are for good if the player is a Twin).  He kind of fell back into old habits as 30+ year old veterans tend to do (kind of how his offense did during second part of 2014 and continued in 2015). Now think about how that would go with a 39 year old catcher.

Edited October 27, 201511 yr by jimmer

 

Suzuki did put in a lot of work to get better at this and it showed early in the season where people were noting he was a positive framer now (people like pointing out, and even like to write about, changes that occur in small sample sizes and proclaim the changes are for good if the player is a Twin).  He kind of fell back into old habits as 30+ year old veterans tend to do (kind of how his offense did during second part of 2014 and continued in 2015). Now think about how that would go with a 39 year old catcher.

I'd hesitate to lump in framing with hitting since a lot of people didn't acknowledge framing as a thing until recently, including Suzuki. Some still don't acknowledge it. If Zuke hadn't even practiced framing  before last spring, which seems likely, then it seems unfair to assume he'll regress as he would hitting or other parts of his game. Perhaps what he put up last season is the new mean? Not to mention, he caught 8800 pitches last season so the stat would seem more reliable than a ~500 sample of hitting, at first glance anyway.

 

I'd hesitate to lump in framing with hitting since a lot of people didn't acknowledge framing as a thing until recently, including Suzuki. Some still don't acknowledge it. If Zuke hadn't even practiced framing  before last spring, which seems likely, then it seems unfair to assume he'll regress as he would hitting or other parts of his game. Perhaps what he put up last season is the new mean? Not to mention, he caught 8800 pitches last season so the stat would seem more reliable than a ~500 sample of hitting, at first glance anyway.

Only if one fails to exclude all the pitches that were obviously balls and obviously strikes.  Those don't need framing.  And if one excludes that batting is a much harder thing.

 

Also, as we know, in order to gauge true performance talent, the more samples the better. That's why the last three or four years is the best measure for true performance talent.  Doesn't make one year samples irrelevant when talking about how a guy did one season, just doesn't tell us his true performance talent.

 

Either way, at 39 AJ is likely who he is as a defender.

Edited October 27, 201511 yr by jimmer