Reusse: Twins Fielding Calls On Eduardo Escobar

[Parker Hageman]

According to 1500ESPN's Patrick Reusse, the Minnesota Twins have other teams contacting them regarding the availability of infielder (and occasional center fielder) Eduardo Escobar:

 

https://twitter.com/1500ESPN_Reusse/status/576760125429411840

 

In a recent Twins Daily forum thread, the community asked if Escobar was not receiving the respect he deserved. What are your thoughts on a potential Escobar trade? 

[jay]

Danny Santana and, further behind him, Jorge Polanco have a ways to go before you could call them proven MLB options. It'd be a shame to see the best SS since JJ Hardy dealt away at this point. He can provide a lot of value even as depth for the IF positions.

 

Not sure what the return would be, but the farm system has all kinds of depth already. We need more quality MLBers.

[jokin]

 

According to 1500ESPN's Patrick Reusse, the Minnesota Twins have other teams contacting them regarding the availability of infielder (and occasional center fielder) Eduardo Escobar:

 

https://twitter.com/1500ESPN_Reusse/status/576760125429411840

 

In a recent Twins Daily forum thread, the community asked if Escobar was not receiving the respect he deserved. What are your thoughts on a potential Escobar trade? 

 

I'm curious, given the Escobar CF video "highlight" you included, exactly where is your level of respect in regards to Escobar?  And I'd like to get your opinion, Parker, on exactly what a 26-year old decent utility infielder can command in trade.

[Parker Hageman]

I'm curious, given the Escobar CF video "highlight" you included, exactly where is your level of respect in regards to Escobar?

 

 

I respect him. I didn't respect the moves that resulted in Escobar having to play center field. Out of his element. Not his fault. Credit him for going out there. 

 

I believe he's a solid SS with average range/arms but good hands. As a defensive shortstop, he's probably overexposed as an everyday guy. Now, statistically, UZR says he had a very good season and I think that is because he was able to make all the plays that he should have (and even a good percentage of out-of-zone plays). On the other hand, Plus/Minus' stats didn't like him at short (-4) and neither did the wisdom of the crowd (-3 on Fangraphs' Fan Scouting Report). In all, I think he's a steady defender. 

 

I think he has issues on the bases -- particularly in stealing bases. Either he can't get a read or can't get a jump because he only attempted to run twice despite having the green light (according to Terry Ryan). 

 

Offensively, I think he's capable. His first half doubled totals probably gave people the wrong impression of his skill set but he did demonstrate some good gap power. He doesn't walk enough and strikes out too much. With a full season worth of starter plate appearances I'd say he has a slash line close to his minor league totals (.270/.315/.360). 

 

Overall, you like to have that kind of flexibility on the roster. I'd like to keep him and trade the other Eduardo but his value is probably significantly much lower than Escobar. 

 

How's that?

[Boom Boom]

What do you trade him for?

 

A starting pitcher? There's a logjam there at the moment of some not-so-spectacular options that's blocking May and Meyer and potentially Berrios.

 

A center fielder? Someone to hold the fort for a few months until Buxton might get the call? That seems like poor value.

 

Bullpen arms? I don't know about everyone else, but I'm not a fan of trading position players with starting capability for relievers.

 

I think you hold on to Escobar. I'm not 100% convinced that Santana's 2014 wasn't a massive fluke anyways

[jokin]

 

I respect him. I didn't respect the moves that resulted in Escobar having to play center field. Out of his element. Not his fault. Credit him for going out there. 

 

I believe he's a solid SS with average range/arms but good hands. As a defensive shortstop, he's probably overexposed as an everyday guy. Now, statistically, UZR says he had a very good season and I think that is because he was able to make all the plays that he should have (and even a good percentage of out-of-zone plays). On the other hand, Plus/Minus' stats didn't like him at short (-4) and neither did the wisdom of the crowd (-3 on Fangraphs' Fan Scouting Report). In all, I think he's a steady defender. 

 

I think he has issues on the bases -- particularly in stealing bases. Either he can't get a read or can't get a jump because he only attempted to run twice despite having the green light (according to Terry Ryan). 

 

Offensively, I think he's capable. His first half doubled totals probably gave people the wrong impression of his skill set but he did demonstrate some good gap power. He doesn't walk enough and strikes out too much. With a full season worth of starter plate appearances I'd say he has a slash line close to his minor league totals (.270/.315/.360). 

 

Overall, you like to have that kind of flexibility on the roster. I'd like to keep him and trade the other Eduardo but his value is probably significantly much lower than Escobar. 

 

How's that?

 

That's a good , and fair, write-up.  And that's exactly what I felt about his misadventures in CF, that was entirely on management, sorry, it just felt like a cheap shot on first read.

 

 

OK. So now since we're in general agreement, what exactly does an above-average utility guy draw in trade? If Esco can bring back a youngish, high leverage RP, don't you have to at least consider the offer, even if you're left a little short in the infield in 2015?

[Thrylos]

Trade Dozier or even Santana.  Their perceived value is higher than Escobar's, so the Twins will get something better back.  And I think that their perceived value is about at their peak, so... 

 

Neither of those 3 should be blocking Polanco.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I don't see anyone offering good value for Santana right now. I sure wouldn't... I haven't seen a Twins player scream "REGRESSION" that loudly in a long time.

 

Sure, you can trade Dozier but then you just open another hole in the lineup. I don't see much sense in that.

 

Nobody is blocking Polanco because Polanco isn't ready for MLB. His first taste of the upper minors returned a .665 OPS in 2014. That stew needs to cook a little longer.

[nytwinsfan]

Depends if the Twins think he was playing above his head last year. If they do, trade him now. If not, don't trade him unless someone offers a lot. Just playing at the same level as last year will increase his value, because it seems like a lot of teams think he was playing above his head last year. Plus it would be much better to trade him in June when we have a sense of whether Santana can handle SS.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Depends if the Twins think he was playing above his head last year. If they do, trade him now. If not, don't trade him unless someone offers a lot. Just playing at the same level as last year will increase his value, because it seems like a lot of teams think he was playing above his head last year. Plus it would be much better to trade him in June when we have a sense of whether Santana can handle SS.

This is my take. Personally, I think Escobar was in over his head last season but that doesn't mean he's not a valuable player; even if his OPS drops to .670-.680 and he stays consistent with the glove, that's a valuable player in today's game.

 

Given the Twins' enormous question marks at short, I'd keep Eduardo unless the offer was too good to refuse.

[Thrylos]

 

 

 

, I'd keep Eduardo unless the offer was too good to refuse.

 

Would you trade him and (let's say) Darnell or even Milone, for Liriano?

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Would you trade him and (let's say) Darnell or even Milone, for Liriano?

Of course. Liriano has huge upside when his head is right.

 

Ask me in July when Liriano is scuffling and on an expiring contract. Then the decision becomes much more difficult.

[USAFChief]

If the Twins truly are committed to playing Santana at SS, then I'd certainly listen to offers for Escobar, while those offers presumably still put Escobar's value at "starting SS."

 

He very likely won't have that perceived value a year from now.

[nytwinsfan]

 

Would you trade him and (let's say) Darnell or even Milone, for Liriano?

 

Yes, assuming Liriano looks like he has his $hit together and has been doing his arm exercises over the winter.

[High heat]

We get some decent players around here and everyone thinks they have excessive amounts of value and we should trade them.  A good utility guy is a life saver through out the season, injuries poor play, suspensions happen.  A guy who can come in and play anywhere in the infield and be solid defensively.  Puts the ball in play, can run a little has sneaky power.  He doesnt have any above average tools which is why he doesnt have a lot of value but he also doesnt have much weaknesses.  I wouldnt be suprised if guys miss time this yr and Escobar gets close to 400 AB's.  Escobar doesnt have much trade value around the league but can give the Twins great insurance value for multiple positions.

[Thrylos]

 

We get come decent players around here and everyone thinks they have excessive amounts of value and we should trade them.

 

Yes they do.  And we got the data to prove it:  99 + 96 + 96 + 92.  No player in those teams should be untouchable.  If they were all that valuable, the Twins would not have been that horrible.  Unless it is all the manager's and the pitching coach's fault.

 

Cannot have it both ways.

 

If they were all decent the Twins would have had a decent team.

[nicksaviking]

Anyone willing to pay starter value for a bench player has a deal in my book. This team is rebuilding, most players should be available.

 

Besides, if Santana falters, folks here most likely will be calling to see Polanco in short order.

[gunnarthor]

I guess it depends on what we get back but Escobar is good insurance for Santana - either if he regresses a bunch or needs to get moved to CF.  There's also the possibility that he could hold down third base if Plouffe was moved before Sano came up.  If another team is actually willing to give up something that suggests they view him as a starting SS, great.  But if it's just a bullpen arm or a C+ prospect, I'd rather have him on the roster.

[stringer bell]

I'll dispute one thing with Parker's analysis--Escobar has a plus arm.  As others have stated, he makes the routine plays and he is versatile (in the infield).  He probably won't ever hit for more extra base power than he did last year and I doubt he can hit .270 every year.  I don't think Escobar qualifies as more than average in range/running speed.  I don't think he would ever steal a lot of bases in the big leagues, even if he were a full-time player.   

 

I am among the unconvinced about Santana's ability to be an everyday shortstop and I know that he can't continue to strike out as much as he did and be a .300 hitter.   I think Escobar is fairly likely to get regular reps at short before mid-season. 

 

As far as trading Esco, I think there are too many question marks to deal him right now. 

[HitInAPinch]

 

Would you trade him and (let's say) Darnell or even Milone, for Liriano?

 

If I'm trading Escobar, I'd try to clear a spot in the starting rotation.  I have no love for Nolasco, so he'd be the guy I'd pick.  I honestly think Escobar deserved a shot at the starting SS job.

 

I'm really surprised to read people turning on both Escobar and Santana.  They both stepped up when called on.  They both responded well when facing MLB pitchers for the first time.  And now that MLB pitchers have full scouting reports on both, well, let's wait and see.

[nicksaviking]

I guess it depends on what we get back but Escobar is good insurance for Santana

I agree, he's great insurance. If this was a better team, I'd want to keep him. I'm of the mind that an insurance kind of player is a luxury a rebuilding team should put pretty low on their priority list though. I'd rather have an asset that better projects to fill a future hole if one was available. Of course this is all speculation, and one may not be available.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I'm really surprised to read people turning on both Escobar and Santana.  They both stepped up when called on.  They both responded well when facing MLB pitchers for the first time.  And now that MLB pitchers have full scouting reports on both, well, let's wait and see.

I don't think anyone has turned on Santana or Escobar as much as they're tempering their expectations for the two players.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

If I'm trading Escobar, I'd try to clear a spot in the starting rotation.  I have no love for Nolasco, so he'd be the guy I'd pick.  I honestly think Escobar deserved a shot at the starting SS job.

 

I'm really surprised to read people turning on both Escobar and Santana.  They both stepped up when called on.  They both responded well when facing MLB pitchers for the first time.  And now that MLB pitchers have full scouting reports on both, well, let's wait and see.

i agree with Brock, not really turning on them...

I think both deserve a shot at starting short stop, as well as Polanco. But this team has a lot of needs, and while depth is nice, having a starting CF is good too. I really like the concept of trying to package Escobar and Nolasco for a stop gap CF.

[Platoon]

I, an advocate of a total rebuild woud keep him. Yes he has more value than Nunez, that's because he is a better player. Every team needs a guy like him that you can count on, can play 3 spots, and hit enough so he cannot be ignored. Trading him for a minor league middle prospect who we won't use for 4 years, if at all is not a good idea. I really prefer him over Nunez. And I actually prefer him, especially defensively over Plouffe, when the Sano era starts. Lastly, if something happens to Santana or Dozier he is not going to hurt you significantly, if at all.

[nicksaviking]

I, an advocate of a total rebuild woud keep him.

Shouldn't a rebuilding team look to fill current, and more importantly, future holes instead of worrying about a bench player who won't play most days?

[bird]

 

If the Twins truly are committed to playing Santana at SS, then I'd certainly listen to offers for Escobar, while those offers presumably still put Escobar's value at "starting SS."

He very likely won't have that perceived value a year from now.

 

If his perceived value at the trade deadline is high-average utility player, I'd keep him around, although if Polanco is really blowing up and Santana proves to be for real and Levi Michael comes of age and Nick Gordon is a stud and Wander Javier....

 

If his perceived value is average everyday SS at the deadline and Santana and/or Polanco are superior options, I'd definitely trade him for a lower-level prospect with a high-risk high reward profile.

[Dman]

 

Shouldn't a rebuilding team look to fill current, and more importantly, future holes instead of worrying about a bench player who won't play most days?

The thing is what do teams give up for utility infielders?  Anything of real value?  He has more value to the Twins than they can get in trade.  The Twins have plenty of C level prospects with more on the way in the next draft.  

 

Esco has way more value right where he is.  Teams that want to trade would need to give up something valuable and I don't think they will given his current stats and future projection. If someone is willing to give up something valuable I think everyone on here would be fine with the trade as we have several young players that could fill that role shortly.

[Seth Stohs]

We were standing around in the clubhouse the morning or two before Patrick's article came out on Escobar. I posed the question to them, rhetorically, and I tweeted it a couple of weeks ago to. I'd love for someone to do the research. Has any 25-year-old shortstop ever put up the numbers that Escobar did in 2014 (.720ish OPS - OPS+ may be better too look at because of the era - with 35 doubles) and not been just handed the starting job the following season?

 

I can't imagine it's happened too much.

 

As one of the other writers said, I believe Phil Miller, "That's the power of the label." 

 

Escobar has always been deemed a utility player. He came up with the White Sox as a late-inning defensive replacement because they saw him as a utility guy. I think he can be a solid MLB shortstop.

 

I also think most organizations view him as a utility guy, so I don't think they would get much for him in trade.

[DocBauer]

Perspective and opinion.

 

Despite several years of average to downright poor/disappointing seasons defensively and offensively, the Twins had a primary starting SS in 2014 who is no GG, but played solid everyday SS defensively and hit a quad slash of .275/.315/.406/.721 and ranked amongst league leaders with 35 doubles and 6 homers.

 

Folks, in the past 30 year history of the Twins, this is Smalley and Guzman territory, with all deference to the immense contributions of Gagne.

 

And as impressive as that is, this player, and his production, may be replaced by an even more athletic and dynamic player, both offensively and defensively, in Santana. It's not an insult to the productive and talented Escobar. It's just a reality to a certain talent level. If you produce to your very best, and it's bested, it doesn't mean you suck. It just means you do the best you can when in there.

 

Look at all of Escobar's numbers, and age, again, and tell me someone will give the Twins top value for him. A young SS who is NOT proven elite, but who can PLAY and hit, and hit with authority, and tell me what he's worth.

[nicksaviking]

The thing is what do teams give up for utility infielders?  Anything of real value?  He has more value to the Twins than they can get in trade.  The Twins have plenty of C level prospects with more on the way in the next draft.  

 

Esco has way more value right where he is.  Teams that want to trade would need to give up something valuable and I don't think they will given his current stats and future projection. If someone is willing to give up something valuable I think everyone on here would be fine with the trade as we have several young players that could fill that role shortly.

If teams aren't offering anything for him of course you don't trade him, but the value he has to the Twins is of the immediate variety and I could barely care less about immediate value, we shouldn't be expecting gratification from the win column this year.

 

He might end up being a better SS than Santana, but we are soon going to need to see if Polanco can cut it at the MLB level, and Micheal, and Gordon. I just don't see full time work available for Escobar in his future, and if you're not playing full time, you are absolutely expendable to a rebuilding team.