First, I think you have to acknowledge that he's had considerable success since leaving the Twins. In addition, one of the reasons some (including me) were ready to see him go is that he didn't seem to be getting any better and was about to start getting more expensive. The Twins were going to have to commit to him for more money and more years and, based on the performance levels at the time, it made more sense to get something for him. It appeared that, regardless of who's fault it was, the Twins' coaches and Liriano were not likely to find any kind of magic together that would allow him to live up to his potential.

 

I don't know if it's true the Pirates coaches "fixed" something with Liriano or not, but I think you have to allow that it's a distinct possibility.

 

I wouldn't suggest bringing him back if it would be a reuniting with Rick Anderson and Ron Gardenhire, but that is not the case.

Sure, he has been clearly better, including one stretch his first year as a Pirate that was close to his glory days in a Twins uniform (with Andy as his pitching coach and Gardy as his manager).  He also had a mediocre stretch that first year and a pretty bad stretch at the beginning of last year.  So, its a variation on the same theme - you really don't know what you get with him and those aren't the kinds of pitchers you want to sign to big dollar, long term deals.

 

I'm also skeptical that he was magically fixed in PA.  I think he has a great arm and wild mechanics that will always lend itself to streaks of peaks and valleys.

Molly as the manager, Hunter in RF, Liriano to the mound, Pat in the pen and Baker on a minor league deal. Sounds like a TR off season. I could see it. I'm sure some around here would like it but gross.

If he pitches well next year, would he sign one?

If his NY experience was that bad and his experience here that good it would not be unreasonable for him to sign an extension.

CJ Wilson might be available via Trade - he had a bad 2014, but that may mean a team would be buying low on him.

 

I can't decide if I think it would be worse for the Twins to do nothing, or to add a starter that's not as good or better than Ricky Nolasco 

A bounceback sort of year for Nolasco would be similar to the year Wilson had last year in a bad year

Add to more names to the list of pitchers the Twins are interested in.

 

One is Logan Ondrusek, a righthander who was non-tendered by the Reds after posting a 5.49 ERA in 40 appearances last season.

 

The other is righthander Dustin McGowan, who was 5-3, 4.17 in 53 games (eight starts) with the Blue Jays last season.

 

If the Twins sign Ondrusek, it might be to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.

 

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/blogs/285120481.html

 

 

Please note it is LEN3 who confysed two and too.

 

 

 

 

Thought this was as good a place  as any to add more names.

Edited December 8, 201411 yr by JB_Iowa

Add to more names to the list of pitchers the Twins are interested in.

 

One is Logan Ondrusek, a righthander who was non-tendered by the Reds after posting a 5.49 ERA in 40 appearances last season.

 

The other is righthander Dustin McGowan, who was 5-3, 4.17 in 53 games (eight starts) with the Blue Jays last season.

 

If the Twins sign Ondrusek, it might be to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.

 

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/blogs/285120481.html

 

Oh snap. 

A bounceback sort of year for Nolasco would be similar to the year Wilson had last year in a bad year

 

Nolasco had a 4.30 FIP last year - CJ Wilson was at 4.31

 

A bounceback year for Nolasco should be better than Wilson's 2014.

A bounceback year for Wilson could be much better.

 

Wilson's been consistently league average or (much) better with the exception of 2014. Nolasco's ceiling looks like League Average.  

 

I think if the Twins add anyone to the rotation, they should at least have the reasonable potential to be better than league average.

Please note it is LEN3 who confysed two and too.

 And 'to'.

 

One is Logan Ondrusek, a righthander who was non-tendered by the Reds after posting a 5.49 ERA in 40 appearances last season.

 

If the Twins sign Ondrusek, it might be to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.

 

 

Um, shouldn't that go without saying?  Why the hell is there a 'might' in there? That sentance should be devoid of all 'mights.'

Twins fans have a love, hate relationship with Liriano.

We love the good Franky

We hate the bad Franky

Add to more names to the list of pitchers the Twins are interested in.

 

One is Logan Ondrusek, a righthander who was non-tendered by the Reds after posting a 5.49 ERA in 40 appearances last season.

 

The other is righthander Dustin McGowan, who was 5-3, 4.17 in 53 games (eight starts) with the Blue Jays last season.

 

If the Twins sign Ondrusek, it might be to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.

 

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/blogs/285120481.html

 

 

Please note it is LEN3 who confysed two and too.

 

 

 

 

Thought this was as good a place  as any to add more names.

 

I am perplexed that someone who uses a number in his name would pay such little attention to the proper usage of to, too, two! (Kind of sounds like a toy train). What if he was erroneously called LEN ll, more commonly referred to as Jr.!

 

 

I think signing Hughes to a contract extension should be the top priority.

We have an ace, let's keep him. (Or trade him down the line, like Oakland always does).

This Lirano talk is crazy.  The powers that be do not welcome ex-Twin players back into the fold until they are at least 35.  In a couple more years perhaps when he has a veteran presence and can be good for the club house.

Edited December 8, 201411 yr by D. Hocking

Liriano's success with the Pirates is, and isn't an aberration.  Liriano's success depend greatly on his slider.  A slider that needs to be thrown with a tremendous amount of torque using poor pitching mechanics.  With the Twins, Liriano made a stink about pitching late in games, just like Johan Santana.  And then, Liriano broke down.  On the other hand, the Pirates kept him close to 6-7 innings.  It was easy:  no built-in DH excuse.  Pirates needed a hitter in, Liriano comes out.  At what point did Liriano get hurt last year?  After a string of 8-9 inning starts.  Pirates returned him to the previous schedule and all was well. 

 

This is the secret to Liriano's success.  So, the real question is this:  can Neil Allen convince Liriano that to maximize his success, he needs to pitch less?

Contact brings the element of chance into play every time.  Strikeouts prevent sac flies, moving runners over, errors, seeing-eye-singles, Texas Leaguers, hit-and-runs and your all too common brain farts that are a favorite of Twins outfielders.

 

 

I get the sentiment but it just doesn't make sense to me.  Contact keeps the fielders on their toes, should lessen the likelihood of walks and wild pitches and gives you the more likelihood of double plays.   Of course we all want Verlander or Clemens at his best to be our normal 1-5 starters but just look at Liriano.   In some of his worst ERA years his strikeout rates were his best.       Again, KC and San Fran were in the bottom third in strikeouts/9 while being in the top third for ERA.   Would you really prefer the reverse?   I want starters with control and stuff.  Stuff includes velocity, and bat misability but could also include getting batters to hit weak pop ups and ground balls.     At the end of the day it is about runs scored rather than strikeouts.

 .  At what point did Liriano get hurt last year?  After a string of 8-9 inning starts.  Pirates returned him to the previous schedule and all was well. 

 

 

When was that string of 8-9 inning starts?

 

Liriano had no 9 inning starts last year.  He had only one 8 inning start.

There is still one thing, or should I say one answer missing in this off season puzzle. Is our vaunted minor league system not really that vaunted? Are the Twins as an orginasation philosophically opposed to taking an "unforced" chance on young talent? Or is TR completely misconstructing the roster? Every move made is of the bland vannilla variety!

Our vaunted farm system is that vaunted but most of those pieces are not as big league ready as our fan base would like them to be.  Thus the one year flyer on someone like Torii and possibly the same on guys like Anderson or Liriano.  Some of us are perfectly content going with status quo and building for the future even if it means another sub .500 season but many are not.

I actually thought about Liriano for a bit when the season was ending. I thought about him a lot. And if Liriano wasn't Liriano, I'd be in great favor of signing Liriano. But Liriano IS Liriano, and we've been down this path with him before. The ChiSox tried to walk the Liriano path with Liriano and waved their hands petty quickly. For whatever reason, the Liriano the Pirates ended up with isn't our past Liriano. And if Liriano weren't Liriano, he is EXACTLY the type of pitcher we should be signing, LH, lightening occasionally harnessed, just over 30, perhaps just figuring stuff out at 30/31 and wouldn't be the first guy to do so.

 

But Liriano IS our Liriano. So unless there is something more concrete that indicates a turnaround in Liriano and his new fortunes,(somewhat limited/inconsistent thought they may be) other than being in the NL or just finding the right time and place and team to be with, then I'm not interested in signing Liriano, even though Liriano, in theory, is exactly the type of SP we SHOULD be signing, because...well...he's Liriano.

MLBTR saying Liriano and Pirates agree to 3/39 deal.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2014/12/pirates-to-re-sign-francisco-liriano.html