Article: Joe Maddon is Out in Tampa. Could Twins Get Him?

[Otto von Ballpark]

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081022035028/egamia/images/0/0d/Madden90SNES.jpg

Who's holding the football in that picture?  And why is Madden so excited?

[D. Hocking]

Who's holding the football in that picture?  And why is Madden so excited?

He is excited because the Pohlads offered him the Roseau/ND leg of Twins Caravan next winter to cinch the deal.  He now knows he is going to an organization that will do anything to build a championship team.

[Deduno Abides]

In a lot of ways the managing skills and general high level of respect for Joe Maddon reminds me of another long-time professional: the late Gene Mauch.

 

Just remember Mauch wasn't able to work miracles for the Twins. It still comes down to who you can put on the field.

Maddon is the anti-Mauch, who was one uptight dude.  On the other hand, Maddon makes players comfortable and builds team spirit.  

[nicksaviking]

So Jim Pohlad has begun taking part in the interview process?

 

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/blogs/280564562.html

 

Um, not sure what to make of that.  If it's a lack of confidence in Ryan's decision, it probably means Ryan shouldn't be there in the first place.  If he actually thinks his baseball IQ will be usefull in the decision, then I fear we may have a burgeoning George Steinbrenner or Jerry Jones.  I guess option #2 wouldn't be bad if he started commiting payroll like an owner that views the team like a hobby.  Not holding my breath though.

[Otto von Ballpark]

So Jim Pohlad has begun taking part in the interview process?

For an outside candidate, Pohlad might be playing the role of recruiter rather than interviewer.  (Or cheerleader -- my guess is he just wants to meet the guys.  Not sure if this is unusual in MLB managerial searches.)

[Mike Sixel]

It's the 2nd or 3rd most important job in his company (not counting players, where he seems to be staying out).....I'd expect him to be involved at this point. He would be for any other company he owns, I'd guess, at that level.

[JB_Iowa]

Mike Berardino ‏@MikeBerardino  · 3m3 minutes ago 
Person with direct knowledge says there has been "zero contact" between #MNTwins and Joe Maddon's camp since he became a free agent Friday.

 

Mike Berardino ‏@MikeBerardino  · 2m2 minutes ago 
“There has been no contact -- at all,” the source with direct knowledge emphasized re: #MNTwins and Joe Maddon.

 

Sigh....failure to even inquire while still in the interview process (Lovullo had yet to have his second interview) is just a slap in the face to Twins fans.  You'd think they would at least go through the motions.

 

Lovullo, please.  I can barely stomach the thought of Molitor ... even if he is a different managerial type, he is part of the old guard.  The Twins need a change,

 

 

For more:  "Joe not in their budget":  http://blogs.twincities.com/twins/2014/10/28/twinsights-contact-twins-joe-maddon-source-says/

Edited October 28, 2014 by JB_Iowa

[jokin]

Mike Berardino ‏@MikeBerardino  · 3m3 minutes ago 

Person with direct knowledge says there has been "zero contact" between #MNTwins and Joe Maddon's camp since he became a free agent Friday.

 

Mike Berardino ‏@MikeBerardino  · 2m2 minutes ago 

“There has been no contact -- at all,” the source with direct knowledge emphasized re: #MNTwins and Joe Maddon.

 

Sigh....failure to even inquire while still in the interview process (Lovullo had yet to have his second interview) is just a slap in the face to Twins fans.  You'd think they would at least go through the motions.

 

Lovullo, please.  I can barely stomach the thought of Molitor ... even if he is a different managerial type, he is part of the old guard.  The Twins need a change,

 

It just gets more depressing:

 

 

 

Besides the Rays, the Twins are the only other team with a current managerial vacancy.

 

“I think they realize Joe is not in their budget,” said a source close to Maddon.

 

Maddon, the source added, “would have been pleasantly surprised” to hear from the Twins

 

but ideally is looking for a team that’s closer to contention.  

 

Maddon also has received multiple offers to go into broadcasting or to move into a high-ranking front-office role, Nero has said.

Edited October 28, 2014 by jokin

[Highabove]

It just gets more depressing:

The Twins are so short sided. They would make some of the money up with publicity and marketing Joe Maddon. There's always money for a player like Mike Pelfrey. 

Edited October 28, 2014 by Highabove

[D. Hocking]

I am gullible and naive enough that I would have (probably foolishly) given them the benefit of the doubt if they had not hired him because either he did not want to come, or they really felt he would not have been a fit, and maybe would have understood had they felt that one of the other candidates would have been just as good for a cheaper price, if they would have at least contacted and talked to him.  

 

For them to not even do a cursory chat due to budget reasons not only seems like a bad choice baseball wise, but for any business not to talk to someone who is the best at their job when you have that particular need seems like a bad business move period.

 

I am not of the mind-set where I think spending money is the answer (you need to spend wisely - but sometimes you should spend), but after this it is going to be harder to swallow any of the spouting of their low salary philosophy when rationalizing a cheaper payroll.  I am less likely to believe that they want to spend wisely, but simply that they are cheap and are more interested in their balance sheet than their win-loss columns.

 

[sorry that was rambling and incoherent - am working on something convoluted at work and this was a mental health break.  Not sure the mental health is any better.]

[tobi0040]

Do you think the Twins wouldn't give him $5M if he wanted the job?

 

I think they would. I also think he'll end up getting more than that.

 

Jay,

 

1) We have not reached out to him and he has been available four days

 

2) He would be pleasantly surprised if we did reach out

 

Is this enough proof that we do not have the budget, as a source and multiple people on this site have guessed?  I mean how would we know how much he is demanding if we didn't reach out to him? 

 

Or do you think the Twins don't view him as the type of talent as Molitor or Luvollo?

 

It was always about the money

Edited October 29, 2014 by tobi0040

[USAFChief]

Jay,

 

1) We have not reached out to him and he has been available four days

 

2) He would be pleasantly surprised if we did reach out

 

Is this enough proof that we do not have the budget, as a source and multiple people on this site have guessed?  I mean how would we know how much he is demanding if we didn't reach out to him? 

 

Or do you think the Twins don't view him as the type of talent as Molitor or Luvollo?

 

It was always about the money

That's the thing though...it almost CAN'T be about the money. It's not a significant amount of money. And I'm someone known to mention money on occasion.

 

So what is it?

 

It is baffling to me.

[drock2190]

Dont forget they are paying Gardy two million for this next year.

 

As for Maddon, not sure why you guys got your hopes up. He commands too much money and is getting up there in age, not exactly a good fit for a team that is a few years away from contending.

[jay]

Is this enough proof that we do not have the budget, as a source and multiple people on this site have guessed? I mean how would we know how much he is demanding if we didn't reach out to him?

 

Or do you think the Twins don't view him as the type of talent as Molitor or Luvollo?

 

It was always about the money

I highly doubt that TR doesn't know what Maddon is looking for. It doesn't take officially reaching out to Maddon to find that out.

 

I probably have to go with TR isn't interesting in meeting his needs. That could be money, but could just as well be about the terms of the position and the amount of power. Not sure yet, but we'll have a better idea based on where he ends up and what it looks like as he says he's willing to wait for the right opportunity.

[tobi0040]

We all know that nobody has a better resume than madden. We also know that our due diligence has not resulted in a phone call.

 

Yet we are still pretending it may not be about money.

 

What exactly could it be? We are purposefully avoiding the best guy because we don't like his glasses?

[jay]

Is it possible that Maddon is looking for more than just the opportunity to be the coach for a different team making more money? That would certainly make sense to me based on what we've heard.

 

That's all I'm saying. It could very well be about the money, but let's look at the whole picture as well.

[tobi0040]

So we haven't called him because we think he may want something else?

 

Seems an easy way exists to find out what he is thinking. Dial his number.

[jay]

Dial his number to confirm what you already know? Why do we assume that an MLB GM isn't connected enough to know what he's looking for? That seems ridiculous.

 

"Uh, hi Joe. I already know you're looking for x, but could you verify that for me and then also be sure to start mentioning to the media that we had a chat?" Really??

[tobi0040]

If it is not the money and he is the best guy on the market, why doesn't the gm make a simple phone call?

 

Even if he thinks something, what will it hurt to make a phone call?

 

I agree terry knows roughly what he is looking for and it is so much more than we are going to pay that he hasn't called. You have still the door open for another reason. That is the basis for the disagreement.

Edited October 29, 2014 by tobi0040

[jay]

Okay, a phone call will not physically hurt anything. No small children will suffer if TR calls Joe Maddon.

 

That doesn't mean it accomplishes anything.

 

Is knowing he called all it would take to feel satisfied here? I'm almost sure the answer is no.

[tobi0040]

Well. We are on the market for a coach. He is the best coach out there. He likely opted out to be paid among the top coaches. So we know what that will cost. And we haven't called.

 

Anyone that acts like another reason exists other than money for the lack of interest on our end is kidding them-self

 

Satisfaction for me would be exploring all options to improve our team. I can understand not calling max sherzers agent. But not a 5m coach with no injury risk?

Edited October 29, 2014 by tobi0040

[jay]

Why not call him? Call him.

Why not interview him? Interview him.

Why not hire him? ...

 

No matter what, the final answer there is the Twins are cheap. I'd hope we can get a deeper level of analysis here on TD. I can get plenty of that in the strib comments. I don't see how it adds value to the conversation.

 

Yes, Maddon will be well paid. With all the talk of front office jobs, wouldn't it make sense to think he's looking for more responsibility that just being the coach? Maybe he wants full authority over the 25 man roster? Maybe he wants more? Maybe he wants a guaranteed GM job in three years? Maybe TR doesn't want to cede any of that to his manager and maybe, just maybe... it's not definitively 100% about the money because the Twins are so cheap.

[USAFChief]

I honestly don't think it's money.

 

I kind of wish I did think it was money. That would be easier to explain.

 

But IMO we're left with other explanations, none of which seem at first glance very complimentary to the Twins.

[Kwak]

It's not the money.  The real issue is control.  Were three interviews necessary wth Molitor?  My goodness they have known him for many years an should be well aware ofhis personality, character, values, and plans to manage the Twins.  There was quite a gap in time between the to interviews with Lovullo.  There has to be  reason.  My guess is that Molitor wouldn't budge [enough] so it's bak to Lovullo who I suspect is more pliable.  Maddon would make demands not concessions--so he isn't in the picture.

[Squirrel]

I honestly don't think it's money.

I kind of wish I did think it was money. That would be easier to explain.

But IMO we're left with other explanations, none of which seem at first glance very complimentary to the Twins.

As was stated by an excellent poster above 'We just don't know his end game.' But why does that have to mean that his end game is uncomplimentary toward the Twins? Just maybe someone knows something about what that answer is and very likely we won't ever know.

[Squirrel]

Anyone that acts like another reason exists other than money for the lack of interest on our end is kidding them-self

 

As a moderator, I am urging you (everyone) to have some caution with these types of statements. Everyone on this board is entitled to have an opinion and every opinion is valid, including ones that disagree from one's own. You may think you are absolutely right and everyone else is absolutely wrong, but you still need to accept differing viewpoints without going down the disrespect path of dismissal over those differing viewpoints. Again, I don't care how right you THINK you are, especially over something in which we are not privy to ALL the information; perception and speculation are still not certain answers and we need to be clear and respectful on how these things are shared with one another.

[tobi0040]

Why not call him? Call him.

Why not interview him? Interview him.

Why not hire him? ...

 

No matter what, the final answer there is the Twins are cheap. I'd hope we can get a deeper level of analysis here on TD. I can get plenty of that in the strib comments. I don't see how it adds value to the conversation.

 

Yes, Maddon will be well paid. With all the talk of front office jobs, wouldn't it make sense to think he's looking for more responsibility that just being the coach? Maybe he wants full authority over the 25 man roster? Maybe he wants more? Maybe he wants a guaranteed GM job in three years? Maybe TR doesn't want to cede any of that to his manager and maybe, just maybe... it's not definitively 100% about the money because the Twins are so cheap.

 

I am capable of deeper level of analysis, but a chance exists here that a drive for deeper anaylsis is causing some to identify reasons that don't seem plausable or are extremely unlikely. If we want the answer to be something else or make this site superior to the star tribune comments, we can throw all sorts of theories.

 

The control theory does not make a ton of sense to me.  Tampa Bay makes more decisions based on money than we do and he has not spoken out or been a thorn in the GM's side, so I would not expect that to start anytime soon.

 

Maybe he wants to be GM, maybe he wants a blue unicorn, you know what would be the best way to find out?  By calling him. 

 

My theory is that Tampa has done a remarkable job flipping guys year in and year out and fielding a very good young pitching staff.  That has allowed Maddon to platoon a decent offense and win a bunch of games.  They lost Shields last year. They won 77 games and now lose Price this year.  Hellickson and Moore are a question mark health-wise and he doesn't think this is sustainable much longer.  He is at peak value and wants to cash in.  On the timing front, the world series will be over soon and free agency will start soon.  So chance exists that he would rather take $5M from the Twins on a buy low move, rather than potentially sit out this year or be a broadcaster.  Maybe those things don't interest him at all.  Again, a phone call is the best way to figure it out and it costs nothing.  Not asking around.  Hearing it from the horses mouth.

Edited October 29, 2014 by tobi0040

[tobi0040]

As a moderator, I am urging you (everyone) to have some caution with these types of statements. Everyone on this board is entitled to have an opinion and every opinion is valid, including ones that disagree from one's own. You may think you are absolutely right and everyone else is absolutely wrong, but you still need to accept differing viewpoints without going down the disrespect path of dismissal over those differing viewpoints. Again, I don't care how right you THINK you are, especially over something in which we are not privy to ALL the information; perception and speculation are still not certain answers and we need to be clear and respectful on how these things are shared with one another.

 

I went to delete that comment and it is locked.

[DocBauer]

Sorry if I am repetitive, but I have concerns about this whole issue.

 

1) "Sources" say this, and "sources" say that. Some of these "sources" say things that seem to contradict one another. Sorry if I'm a bit jaded or suspicious of Mr Source, but over the years I've just hear and read too much from him to get immediately worked up about what he says.

 

2) The Twins have a manager opening. They are the only team with said opening when Maddon becomes a FA. Maddon is a respected baseball guy with a quality track record. And yet, for some reason, Terry Ryan, a veteran and very respected baseball man in his own right completely and utterly ignores Maddon. Nothing. Nope. Nada. Even Ryan's bosses make no attempt at contact, or urge/force him to make a simple phone call. Does anyone else a flaw in basic logic here? Either there is something here we are not privy to, or Mr Source is mistaken.

 

3) Maddon is now a FA, and there is one team with an immediate opening. And it's reported he respects the organization, likes Target Field, and would welcome speaking with the Twins. And yet he and his team take absolutely no initiative on their own to make a simple phone call to inquire interest?

 

Am I the only person that sees complete disconnect here?

[Otto von Ballpark]

3) Maddon is now a FA, and there is one team with an immediate opening. And it's reported he respects the organization, likes Target Field, and would welcome speaking with the Twins. And yet he and his team take absolutely no initiative on their own to make a simple phone call to inquire interest? Am I the only person that sees complete disconnect here?

The job seeker cold-calling a prospective employer is not the standard expectation here (unless perhaps the job seeker had a strong preference for this particular employer, i.e. home nearby or past professional history).

 

Should Jon Lester be expected to call the Twins this offseason, just to inquire interest?