Mr. Smith did make deals, mostly bad ones...

I guess I'd take TR any day.  He got Milone for a waiver wire pickup this year.  There was no market at all for Hammer and Correia.

Hammer I agree..but Correia..im really surprised teams didnt want him but he did lay two eggs just before trading got hot...

Hammer I agree..but Correia..im really surprised teams didnt want him but he did lay two eggs just before trading got hot...

Nah...

Teams that are in contention aren't going to look at Kevin Correia and say "Hey, this guy would really carry us to the postseason!"

Well certainly not like David Price, but how many Prices are there?

You must be right though, I think the teams were thinking just as you stated

While I don't think Smith did that great of a job the one thing I do respect him for is actually doing the job.  When some of the toughest decisions in recent Twins history were coming due (Torii Hunter Free Agent, Johan Santana Trade, Joe Mauer Contract) Terry Ryan quit and went home.  Bill Smith stepped forward and actually had the guts to make these decisions, right or wrong.  When the tough calls were made and it was back to prospect development Terry Ryan rushes back in and takes over pushing Smith to the side.  Smith is remembered for his many failures while Terry Ryan gets almost no heat at all for ducking those big issues.

nice observation...and agree

While I don't think Smith did that great of a job the one thing I do respect him for is actually doing the job.  When some of the toughest decisions in recent Twins history were coming due (Torii Hunter Free Agent, Johan Santana Trade, Joe Mauer Contract) Terry Ryan quit and went home.  Bill Smith stepped forward and actually had the guts to make these decisions, right or wrong.  When the tough calls were made and it was back to prospect development Terry Ryan rushes back in and takes over pushing Smith to the side.  Smith is remembered for his many failures while Terry Ryan gets almost no heat at all for ducking those big issues.

Don't know if he was ducking them, as much as playing them smart.  No reason to trade Hunter when he's affordable, you're in contention, and you can net two draft picks for him (#27 and #31 overall in 2008).

Smith should have done the same with Santana and Nathan in 2008.  Instead, he forced a trade of Santana and extended Nathan for $14 mil per year.

Probably should have extended Mauer earlier, although it takes two to tango, not all players want to sell their FA years at a discount, years in advance (although TR and the Twins did appear to be behind in this trend).

I was ready to tear my hair out by the end of his tenure, but I agree that it was really refreshing to have a GM who was aggressive once in a while. The Delmon trade did look OK on paper, and the Johan trade didn't look that bad either even if we could've gotten more out of the Yankees or Red Sox. He signed Sano, too. I doubt TR would've made that move. 

It was the trades he made later plus the Nishioka signing that made it all go up in flames, and he deserved to lose his job for it. I'm lukewarm on TR at this point, and it would've been nice to have them go outside the org. for Smith's replacement. 

Is this thread for real? All anyone has to say is Matt Capps. Period (also Nishioka, trading away Gomez, trading JJ, trading for Garza...one of worst gm tenures ever).

The Delmon trade did look OK on paper...

It looked like the Twins got their pockets picked on paper, trading undervalued assets for overvalued ones.  It wasn't as bad as Capps for Ramos or the JJ Hardy giveaway, but it was bad.

Delmon Young trade did not look good on paper.  Young had a significant sample of MLB PA at that point (and also his AAA PA) which had exposed some vital and not-easily-corrected flaws.

Santana trade looked better, but not good.  Gomez at least was still more a prospect than a suspect like Young, but Gomez was really the only prospect of value in that trade.  Humber?  Mulvey?  Seriously?  It's like Bill Smith said, "I'm trading Garza and Santana, I need some near MLB starting pitchers back" but didn't care whether the pitchers were actually good or not.  Would have been better off holding out for a better deal or just taking the draft picks.

I'd rather have had a GM who wasn't afraid to let Santana walk, or let Hunter walk without simultaneously overpaying for an alleged "RH power bat" replacement.  Bill Smith acted scared as GM (Capps deal is another obvious example of this).

Don't know if he was ducking them, as much as playing them smart.  No reason to trade Hunter when he's affordable, you're in contention, and you can net two draft picks for him (#27 and #31 overall in 2008).

 

Smith should have done the same with Santana and Nathan in 2008.  Instead, he forced a trade of Santana and extended Nathan for $14 mil per year.

 

Probably should have extended Mauer earlier, although it takes two to tango, not all players want to sell their FA years at a discount, years in advance (although TR and the Twins did appear to be behind in this trend).

I may not have been clear in my previous post but by "ducking" them I mean when he retired when decisions needed to be made and they were not the type of decisions he liked (Scouting and Player Development).  Here are a couple of quotes from the article when he retired:

 

The decision came after months of self-deliberation and weeks of talks with the most trusted members of the organization. Ryan had noticed a change in how the business of baseball affected him. He felt worse after losses than usual. He was worn out after the trade deadline after working the phones to try to swing a deal. The winter meetings of recent years took a lot out of him.

 

Ryan felt now was the right time for a change, pointing out that the busy season for GMs runs from Oct. 1 through spring training, when roster decisions of all kinds are required.

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/11700821.html

Terry Ryan didn't like the big contract, free agent part of the job so when that was going to start dominating his time he took his ball and went home.  After the hard decisions were made and the team had some limited success before falling apart he suddenly wanted to GM again when the focus is prospects and player development as opposed to resigning huge free agents.  Bill Smith was a poor GM but I respect that he at least had the guts to make the hard decisions.  I fully predict that Terry Ryan will retire again in the next 4-6 years as the hard contract decisions for guys like Buxton, Sano, and Meyer come due.

I may not have been clear in my previous post but by "ducking" them I mean when he retired when decisions needed to be made and they were not the type of decisions he liked (Scouting and Player Development).  Here are a couple of quotes from the article when he retired:

 

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/11700821.html

 

Terry Ryan didn't like the big contract, free agent part of the job so when that was going to start dominating his time he took his ball and went home.  After the hard decisions were made and the team had some limited success before falling apart he suddenly wanted to GM again when the focus is prospects and player development as opposed to resigning huge free agents.  Bill Smith was a poor GM but I respect that he at least had the guts to make the hard decisions.  I fully predict that Terry Ryan will retire again in the next 4-6 years as the hard contract decisions for guys like Buxton, Sano, and Meyer come due.

I would like to bold that last sentence and say: lets hope those are hard decisions. I pray that these three are worthy of big contracts and TR or whoever the next GM is has a tough decision.

I would like to bold that last sentence and say: lets hope those are hard decisions. I pray that these three are worthy of big contracts and TR or whoever the next GM is has a tough decision.

Agree, it is highly likely that at least 1 and possibly 2 of these guys will not perform at such a level where this will be a hard decision due to the nature of prospects failing.

This thread once more makes me thankful that Terry Ryan is our General Manager. (Which, I suspect is the true reason for making the thread.)

Matt Crapps is the straw that broke my back concerning Bill Smith.

He's done a great job overseeing the improvements down in Ft. Myers; let's hope he continues to do great non-baseball player related things.

I hated the Capps trade too, but you have to admit if you were trading for an elite pitcher, you would have to say good trade and Capps was the best available at the time, (starting to get sick just saying that)