Article: What does the Twins roster shake-up mean?

[Cody Christie]

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.com/content.php?r=2088-What-does-the-Twins-roster-shake-up-mean

[IdahoPilgrim]

I'm curious that you say Justin Morneau will likely be in a different uniform by the end of the month. I'm sure the Twins would like to receive offers, but most of the threads I've followed assume that not much will be offered for him. I would have guessed that there was a better chance he is still a Twin in August than he would not be. Next year, of course, is an entirely different matter...

[MichiganTwins]

I think the FO was not very positive toward the idea of resigning Morneau (when Morneau and his agent approach the Twins) so some have suggested that the Twins might trade Morneau.

[blairpaul715]

Really!!!??? We are going to send down Arcia and Parmalee instead of giving them everyday jobs for he rest of the year, to see if they can make adjustments? I don't see the value in sending them down in another lost year. As far as Escobar goes, he is a utility guy anyways as is Floriman , in my opinion , so why not give a taste to Santana , instead of a 33 yr old minor leaguer that you have no plans for. Im just lost on this. In my opinion, if we give up on Parmalee, he will be good for someone, can see the talent there.

[ashbury]

It's a fine line between the overly-quoted "no scholarships" position and "let's see what the young guys have got". Parmelee seems to be falling on the wrong side of that line with his demotion.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Good article, points well made. I'm on the fence regarding whether or not Morneau will be traded. Just because the Twins are hesitant to give Morneau a mid-season extension, doesn't mean a trade is imminent, however, it does point that way.

[troyhobbs]

I agree that sending these guys down in a lost year is silly. Calabello deserves a call up but not sure I'd send more than 1 of those 3 down unless transactions are in the works. What's up with all the IFs and only 2 OFs?

[powrwrap]

Parmelee and Arcia being sent down is a message the Twins FO is sending to these guys. Just because the Twins have a dearth of OFers doesn't mean your job is secure.

 

Parmelee has had plenty of major league AB's and I think it has been determined that he is a great AAAA ballplayer. Personally, I hope I never see him in a Twins uniform again. I see nothing wrong with bringing Colabello up and plugging him into the lineup for 2-3 weeks or so. It's a lost season, let's see if he can leave AAAA ball and be a major leaguer.

 

Arcia needs to settle down, relax, and find his swing again. It's obvious he's pressing and trying to do too much at the plate. A stint at AAA will be therapeutic.

 

I'm OK with giving Bernier his cup of coffee. Why not?

 

I think the Twins will try to trade Morneau, find no offers, and then try to re-sign him for 2 more years at a discount. It's unlikely he will sign, the temptation to see what the free market would bring will be too tempting. He could always test the waters and come back to the Twins.

 

I really think that Jamie Carroll is the most likely Twin to be traded.

[dakotanative]

I have been a die hard Twins fan since 1965 when a team of Twins coaches came to my home town of Minot ND and in the old cement ballpark with a 500' centerfield fence game us a skills clinic. I was 12 at the time and I have been a faithful follower since. Over the years I have seen different waves of talent come forth from the minors or in trades. The most memorable being the wave from the early 1980s that brought us Hrbek, Viola, Puckett, etc. and two world championships. I remember the wave that came with Becker, Banks, Stahoviak, etc. - man what a failure. Of course I assume most of us know the Hunter, Lawton, Guzman wave, which was augmented with Santana, Mauer and Morneau. Well, except for the last extended wave all previous waves were proceeded by losing teams and changing economics and, unfortunately, we are in a losing trough now. From my 48 year vantage point we are looking at what may be the finest group of talented prospects the Twins have ever produced. I see Ryan and the organization sifting that young talent, looking for a many gold nuggets. Nuggets that mature into solid major league players. Thus far the ones being sent down are being sifted. How do they respond? Can they take instruction and get their heads back on? Do they have the character to mature into professional major leaguers? I agree with what Ryan is doing. I am a retired Marine and I earned that title. Being a Major League Baseball Player is a title that must be earned and not given away. If there is any fight in these players they will respond and come back is be productive major league players.

 

Trust me this this will continue with Sano, Buxton, Meyer, Rosario, etc. until they earn the right to stay. How many tips to the minors did it take Hunter to grow into a major leaguer? It is better to taste the major leagues, fail, be sent down to learn and then come back to test what you learned, than to play everyday in the majors and to continue to fail without a chance to clear your head. Baseball is littered with talented players who needed a break, but were not given it and failed as a result. Not every prospect will be a Joe Mauer or Kent Hrbek. Most will be like Hunter if they are going to make it.

[ThePuck]

I have been a die hard Twins fan since 1965 when a team of Twins coaches came to my home town of Minot ND and in the old cement ballpark with a 500' centerfield fence game us a skills clinic. I was 12 at the time and I have been a faithful follower since. Over the years I have seen different waves of talent come forth from the minors or in trades. The most memorable being the wave from the early 1980s that brought us Hrbek, Viola, Puckett, etc. and two world championships. I remember the wave that came with Becker, Banks, Stahoviak, etc. - man what a failure. Of course I assume most of us know the Hunter, Lawton, Guzman wave, which was augmented with Santana, Mauer and Morneau. Well, except for the last extended wave all previous waves were proceeded by losing teams and changing economics and, unfortunately, we are in a losing trough now. From my 48 year vantage point we are looking at what may be the finest group of talented prospects the Twins have ever produced. I see Ryan and the organization sifting that young talent, looking for a many gold nuggets. Nuggets that mature into solid major league players. Thus far the ones being sent down are being sifted. How do they respond? Can they take instruction and get their heads back on? Do they have the character to mature into professional major leaguers? I agree with what Ryan is doing. I am a retired Marine and I earned that title. Being a Major League Baseball Player is a title that must be earned and not given away. If there is any fight in these players they will respond and come back is be productive major league players.

 

Trust me this this will continue with Sano, Buxton, Meyer, Rosario, etc. until they earn the right to stay. How many tips to the minors did it take Hunter to grow into a major leaguer? It is better to taste the major leagues, fail, be sent down to learn and then come back to test what you learned, than to play everyday in the majors and to continue to fail without a chance to clear your head. Baseball is littered with talented players who needed a break, but were not given it and failed as a result. Not every prospect will be a Joe Mauer or Kent Hrbek. Most will be like Hunter if they are going to make it.

 

I don't remember that game being played with Hunter. As I remember it, he had a pinch running game one year, and that's it. Barely sniffed the team the next (I think due to injury), then from then it was on. I probably remember incorrectly though, I was out of the country at around that time.

[IdahoPilgrim]

I think the FO was not very positive toward the idea of resigning Morneau (when Morneau and his agent approach the Twins) so some have suggested that the Twins might trade Morneau.

 

And I would have no problem with that. My only point was that you probably won't get much for him, and at some point you have to ask if the limited return even justifies a trade. It's not that they won't try to trade him, but they may not be able to.

[Craig Arko]

I think the Twins will try to trade Morneau, find no offers, and then try to re-sign him for 2 more years at a discount. It's unlikely he will sign, the temptation to see what the free market would bring will be too tempting. He could always test the waters and come back to the Twins.

 

I really think that Jamie Carroll is the most likely Twin to be traded.

 

This is how I see it, too. After Morneau hits FA the 80% rule on salary reduction will no longer apply, and then I could see Ryan making a lower multi-year offer.

[DaveW]

This is how I see it, too. After Morneau hits FA the 80% rule on salary reduction will no longer apply, and then I could see Ryan making a lower multi-year offer.

That makes sense and is probably why the Twins have told Morneau they aren't interested in discussing an extension yet.

 

As far as Arcia and Parmelee go.

 

1. Parmelee needs to figure it out soon or he is going to be eventually let go. You can't have a guy with no real defensive value continue to have a sub .700 OPS. He has had almost 500 PA the last two years and has a .228 BA, a sub .300 OBP and only 13 HR. I like the kid and hope he can turn it around, but production like that isn't exactly hard to find.

 

2. Arcia is lost at the plate, in his last 16 at bats he had 11 strike outs. Clearly something is up with his swing, give it a week or two of mashing at AAA and working out the kinks and he will be back up soon enough. They need to do whats best long term for Arcia and I think this is prob the best bet. He has a pretty putrid line in his last 15 games as well, 22K in 59 AB and a .432 OPS (with a non horrible .297 BABIP)

 

Arcia will be back.

 

It doesn't hurt to give these other guys a cup of coffee, especially a potential Garrett Jones type in Collabero. It would be nice to see him produce and become our 25th roster spot guy next year as a bat off the bench/DH/1B depth.

[twinstalker]

Is it really that difficult to spell Parmelee's name right? Typos are one thing...

[dakotanative]

Remember the game well. Here is a summary of where he played through the 2000 season. When he went down at the beginning of the 2000 season he tore up triple A pitching. I think they pissed him off after he spent all of the previous season on the big club. Regardless, he came back motivated and has had a fine career as a result.

 

[TABLE=width: 288]

[TD=class: xl65, width: 64, bgcolor: white]Year[/TD]

[TD=class: xl65, width: 64, bgcolor: white]Age[/TD]

[TD=class: xl65, width: 64, bgcolor: white]Tm[/TD]

[TD=class: xl65, width: 64, bgcolor: white]Lg[/TD]

[TD=class: xl66, width: 64, bgcolor: white]G[/TD]

[TD=class: xl66, width: 64, bgcolor: white]PA[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1993[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]17[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]Rk[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]28[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]114[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1994[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]18[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]A[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]91[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]372[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1995[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]19[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]A+[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]113[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]447[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1996[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]20[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AA,A+[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]103[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]405[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1997[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]21[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AA[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]127[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]528[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1997[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]21[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AL[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]0[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1998[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]22[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AA,AAA[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]108[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]435[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1998[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]22[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AL[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]6[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]19[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]1999[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]23[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AL[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]135[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]422[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]2000[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]24[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN-min[/TD]

[TD=class: xl70, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AAA[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]55[/TD]

[TD=class: xl71, width: 64, bgcolor: white]227[/TD]

[TD=class: xl67, width: 64, bgcolor: white]2000[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]24[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]MIN[/TD]

[TD=class: xl69, width: 64, bgcolor: white]AL[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]99[/TD]

[TD=class: xl68, width: 64, bgcolor: white]358[/TD]

[/TABLE]

[ashbury]

I think the Twins will try to trade Morneau, find no offers, and then try to re-sign him for 2 more years at a discount.

 

I think there is a CBA limit to how much of a cut (20%?) they can offer him while he is still under contract. Once he goes into free agency, then any agreed-upon contract can be signed, but of course any of the 29 other teams can offer something too, and by the time the player has reached that point, he may as well listen.

[Jim H]

I suspect that the recent moves are probably a short term thing. Likely, Ryan wouldn't mind trading Carroll, Doumit and Thomas. None can figure in the long term plans and might not even fit next year. In order to trade those guys, they need to play until the trade deadline or until they are traded. So you send down Arcia, Parmelee and Escobar and let these 3 play nearly everyday.

 

These guys won't likely fetch much in a trade, but Ryan has found useful pieces in trades like this before. So, I would root for Thomas, Carroll and Doumit to have a hot couple of weeks and see if Ryan can make an interesting trade for a couple of these guys. Certainly, all three could be useful to a contender in the right circumstances.

[Craig Arko]

The Phillies need a center fielder again short term; Thomas plays center field.

[ashbury]

The Phillies need a center fielder again short term; Thomas plays center field.

 

I like the way you think.

[Cris E]

Arcia got hit on the hand back on July 6 and had to come out of that game. Since then he's 1-22 with twelve of those strikeouts. He's clearly hurt. He wasn't exactly tearing it up in the weeks before then, but there's no chance for him to get through this until the hand is better. I'm guessing the difference between AAA and the DL was just service time, but that's just speculation.