Trade Proposals

[Fire Dan Gladden]

We have a few weeks before P&C report.  Not much left to discuss on the FA market.  The roster looks relatively set, though there are a few spots in question.  I would like to hear if anybody has any legit trade proposals that would help this current team.

IMO the Twins have a surplus of borderline starting OF, mid-rotation SP, and high-end SS prospects.  I think this gives them some flexibility on the trade market.

One trade I think they could make would be a reunion with old friend Trevor May:
Twins get:  Trevor May
A's get:  Bailey Ober, Matt Canterino

What do you think?  What do you propose?

[miller761]

Why? 2 good young pitchers for a relief pitcher in his middle 30's? There are plenty of relief pitcher free agents out there that will cost nothing but money. Michael Fulmer anybody if there is a need to add to bullpen. I would rather have the above 3 pitchers in 3 years than a departed Trevor May.

[weitz41]

We could use another guy or two in the pen. My thought was after spring training opens and roster spots open up from 60 day IL guys.  I posted a few days ago on BTV was AJ Puk and Dany Jimenez for Round A Comp pick. 

[chpettit19]

I'd rather just put Ober in the pen than trade him for May. Let alone give up Canterino (I think he'll be in the Twins pen sometime in 2024) on top of that.

[gman]

I also vote no on that trade proposal. I think Kepler is the most likely to go. The Yankees still need a left fielder and Kepler would probably benefit from hitting in Yankee stadium. Maybe we can get Roderick Arias, 18 y.o. SS, from them.

[Brad.dahlen]

4 minutes ago, gman said:

I also vote no on that trade proposal. I think Kepler is the most likely to go. The Yankees still need a left fielder and Kepler would probably benefit from hitting in Yankee stadium. Maybe we can get Roderick Arias, 18 y.o. SS, from them.

I like this trade. I'd switch out Arias for Trystan Vrieling.

[SteveLV]

Why trade for middling bullpen talent when you can just sign that from FA without giving up prospects?

[gman]

15 minutes ago, Brad.dahlen said:

I like this trade. I'd switch out Arias for Trystan Vrieling.

Vrieling overall scouting grade is only a 45. His fastball is in the 90-93 range. I would also prefer a pitcher, but couldn't really find someone on their prospect list I thought we could get and was a good get at the same time. I wouldn't want someone who would take a 40 man spot.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

I would be cautious of overvaluing our prospects.  You need to give value to get value, especially if you believe May can solidify the bullpen.

More than feedback on my proposal, I want to hear your proposals.

[Parfigliano]

37 minutes ago, gman said:

I also vote no on that trade proposal. I think Kepler is the most likely to go. The Yankees still need a left fielder and Kepler would probably benefit from hitting in Yankee stadium. Maybe we can get Roderick Arias, 18 y.o. SS, from them.

Why do the Twins need another SS?

[Nashvilletwin]

19 minutes ago, Parfigliano said:

Why do the Twins need another SS?

I get your drift, but the truth is the Twins really only have three pure shortstops in their near- mid term system - Correa, Lewis, and Miller (I don’t count Farmer, our utility short-term rental).  Gordon, Martin, Salas, and Lee don’t really project as long-term starters as short.

[specialiststeve]

I would Target Harrison Bader from the Yankees for Kepler... should be attainable as they are about the same player with very good defense and have some pop with Bader being a bit more of a threat than we have on our roster for some stolen bases. Has the ability to play center in a pinch. Not sexy but would make some sense on both ends. 

[August J Gloop]

I still think there is a legit shot at another high impact starter either in the Rotation or LF. 

We recently heard that Josh Winder on his own was enough to tempt the Royals to send over 1.9 Win MATaylor. What about a Package that starts with Winder, Kepler and Kiriloff for Bryan Reynolds. I assume the Twins would need to put more in, but Kiriloff might have more value to a rebuilding Pirates team since he's a local kid. 

Reynolds is arb eligible through 26 so the Twins should be comfortable giving up prospect value. Winder and Kep would be flips for them, with one or both hopefully playing well enough to be turned into prospects of their own at the 23 deadline. 

I know the Pirates aren't that motivated to move Reynolds, but they should be easy enough to get there, since he's made it clear he'd like to get out and without trading all their other prospects, the Bucs aren't getting to competence before Reynold's walk year anyway. 

As to the starter I am still really digging the idea of pushing a bunch of prospect chips in on Shane McClanahan. He's got big time team control, so why would the Rays move him? Because they missed the Rays window of savings. He's gonna get paid in arbitration and clearly has said no thank you to the Rays MO of team friendly prearb contracts. This would be instead of the Reynolds deal, so you'd probably see Winder, Kiriloff or Larnach, Gordon and one top prospect (Or Max and two prospects instead of K/L/G. 

 As to why people are not fans of the May for two prospects? They could have signed may for just money and instead let Oakland do it only to send players of any value for him? Plus I'm guessing Cleveland would probably trade Clase straight up for Ober. He's a projectable MLB starting pitcher. No way a relief bust like May is getting Ober. 

[Brad.dahlen]

1 hour ago, gman said:

Vrieling overall scouting grade is only a 45. His fastball is in the 90-93 range. I would also prefer a pitcher, but couldn't really find someone on their prospect list I thought we could get and was a good get at the same time. I wouldn't want someone who would take a 40 man spot.

Fair point there. If they want to make room for someone in RF (Wallner, Larnach ect) and want Kepler gone. I'd take a big league ready arm. Even if they are a back end guy. 

[August J Gloop]

58 minutes ago, Parfigliano said:

Why do the Twins need another SS?

Because shortstop prospects are like having an everything prospect. They can play D just about anywhere on the diamond if they can hit. You'd make your whole rookie league team up of shortstops from D1 colleges if you could. 

[gman]

1 hour ago, Parfigliano said:

Why do the Twins need another SS?

Several have responded already and I agree with them. From the Yankees scouting report, he is an 18 y.o. shortstop with a 70 arm and a 60 rating on defense. He was the top rated int'l prospect in the 21-222 class by MLB Pipeline. Also included a 55 hit, 50 power and 60 run. Assume it takes 4-5 years to get to the majors and we are getting close to the end of Correa's contract. Any other shortstops currently in the system will be on another team or another position by then probably. Future stock.

[LA VIkes Fan]

I like the idea of trading for Bryan Reynolds. I understand that the Pirates aren't motivated to trade him but would consider a trade for pitching. Here's my thinking - Pirates get Larnach (replacement OF for Reynolds with upside), Ober (proven #3/4 SP potential), Raya (SP prospect with potential), and Salas (top 100 SS with potential). Would substitute SWR for Salas but Salas is more valuable. Twins get Reynolds, arb eligible in 2024, free agent in 2026 so we have him for at least 3 years. 

On the pitching front, there isn't a reliever worth it to me IF we can sign either Fulmer or Chafin.  I would rather go that route.  Would consider trading Kepler to the Dodgers or Cardinals for pitching prospects. Would rather trade him there than to the Yankees. No reason to help a potential post season competitor; trade Kepler to an NL team. Picked the dodgers and Cardinals because they both have needs in the OF and decent systems. Would love to trade Kepler and a prospect to Cardinals for Woodford but I suspect Woodford is not available. 

[TwinsDr2021]

3 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

We have a few weeks before P&C report.  Not much left to discuss on the FA market.  The roster looks relatively set, though there are a few spots in question.  I would like to hear if anybody has any legit trade proposals that would help this current team.

IMO the Twins have a surplus of borderline starting OF, mid-rotation SP, and high-end SS prospects.  I think this gives them some flexibility on the trade market.

One trade I think they could make would be a reunion with old friend Trevor May:
Twins get:  Trevor May
A's get:  Bailey Ober, Matt Canterino

What do you think?  What do you propose?

why, why, why would you do this, currently May has a negative trade value, less than Pagan. This would be a terrible trade for the Twins. There is a decent chance that both Ober and Canterino will be better this year than May.

[Parfigliano]

1 hour ago, August J Gloop said:

Because shortstop prospects are like having an everything prospect. They can play D just about anywhere on the diamond if they can hit. You'd make your whole rookie league team up of shortstops from D1 colleges if you could. 

Agree to disagree 

[Byrdman]

From PIT-David Bednar for Austin Martin & Pagan

Give us a dominants arm for 7th 8th 9th how ever they want to use him. Hopefully they can take pagan off our hands for the 40 man spot.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

why, why, why would you do this, currently May has a negative trade value, less than Pagan. This would be a terrible trade for the Twins. There is a decent chance that both Ober and Canterino will be better this year than May.

Forget trade value.  May was a strong reliable reliever prior to being injured last season.  I thought the Twins should have signed him.

Is my offer an overpay?  maybe, IMO guys like Ober (4-5 starter) can always be found and Canterino can't stay healthy.  Not a huge give if you believe May will be the May of old.

That being said, I also believe we as fans tend to overvalue the Twins prospects.  If you look at the current top 10 prospect list, how many of those are going to truly play much for the Twins?  Maybe 3-4?  Probably 1 -2 full time players out of that group?  Trading guys outside the top 10 and low level producers does not scare me.

[August J Gloop]

12 minutes ago, Byrdman said:

From PIT-David Bednar for Austin Martin & Pagan

Give us a dominants arm for 7th 8th 9th how ever they want to use him. Hopefully they can take pagan off our hands for the 40 man spot.

I agree that PIT should be forced to trade Bednar. But I dunno they should be punished for ever meeting him. 

[August J Gloop]

2 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Forget trade value.  May was a strong reliable reliever prior to being injured last season.  I thought the Twins should have signed him.

Is my offer an overpay?  maybe, IMO guys like Ober (4-5 starter) can always be found and Canterino can't stay healthy.  Not a huge give if you believe May will be the May of old.

That being said, I also believe we as fans tend to overvalue the Twins prospects.  If you look at the current top 10 prospect list, how many of those are going to truly play much for the Twins?  Maybe 3-4?  Probably 1 -2 full time players out of that group?  Trading guys outside the top 10 and low level producers does not scare me.

There's overvalue and there's value them worth half of a limited and possibly injured reliever. Bailey Ober last year with his injuries provided as much value as any two Trevor May bullpen seasons combined. Trev put up 2.5 wins in 2015, primarily because he made 16 starts. Ober can start and be effective reliably.

[TwinsDr2021]

40 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Forget trade value.  May was a strong reliable reliever prior to being injured last season.  I thought the Twins should have signed him.

Is my offer an overpay?  maybe, IMO guys like Ober (4-5 starter) can always be found and Canterino can't stay healthy.  Not a huge give if you believe May will be the May of old.

That being said, I also believe we as fans tend to overvalue the Twins prospects.  If you look at the current top 10 prospect list, how many of those are going to truly play much for the Twins?  Maybe 3-4?  Probably 1 -2 full time players out of that group?  Trading guys outside the top 10 and low level producers does not scare me.

Trading a 27 year old pitcher (who I am not the biggest fan of) that put up better numbers in an injury shortened season then a 33 year old May basically ever has (minus 2019, which was 4 season ago) is the sign of a franchise that hasn't a clue. Trading Canterino for another relief pitcher would be a mistake IMO but wouldn't be the end of the world, but pitchers like Ober can't always be found or every team would be loaded with guys like him and they aren't, the Twins have how many of him? 2 maybe if you include Winder?

Now David Bednar for those two.......

As for prospects of course they are overvalue, I have been saying that for decades, but you don't trade prospects for middling relief pitchers (unless it is the deadline) you trade them for solid major league players.

[bap3141]

Zero interest in Trevor May. He's not good.  Why trade away potential and rotation depth for him? Especially, as someone pointed out, there are still unsigned relief pitchers. 

 

 

[tarheeltwinsfan]

Trade Walner and Varland for catcher Henry Davis of the Pirates, who have 2 top 10 prospect catchers. 

[chpettit19]

19 minutes ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

Trade Walner and Varland for catcher Henry Davis of the Pirates, who have 2 top 10 prospect catchers. 

Interesting idea. They would need to invest in a wrist guard and/or get him to back off the plate so he quits getting hit by pitches. And they'd need to be really sure he'll stick behind the plate. His arm is certainly good enough, but lots of talk on scouting reviews that he's too stiff to stick back there and will be moved to RF or 3B in which case he's less valuable to the Twins.

[LA VIkes Fan]

21 minutes ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

Trade Walner and Varland for catcher Henry Davis of the Pirates, who have 2 top 10 prospect catchers. 

Interesting idea. Here's the question - When does Davis play? We have Vasquez for 3 years and Jeffers isn't a free agent until 2027 so we have him for 4 years. I know we have no depth in AAA but I'm not in favor of trading two guys who have at least some upside (Varland as maybe a #3/4 SP, and Walner as a starting OF) for depth. Would you follow up that trade by trading Jeffers?

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

Trading a 27 year old pitcher (who I am not the biggest fan of) that put up better numbers in an injury shortened season then a 33 year old May basically ever has (minus 2019, which was 4 season ago) is the sign of a franchise that hasn't a clue. Trading Canterino for another relief pitcher would be a mistake IMO but wouldn't be the end of the world, but pitchers like Ober can't always be found or every team would be loaded with guys like him and they aren't, the Twins have how many of him? 2 maybe if you include Winder?

Now David Bednar for those two.......

As for prospects of course they are overvalue, I have been saying that for decades, but you don't trade prospects for middling relief pitchers (unless it is the deadline) you trade them for solid major league players.

Bednar wouldn't hurt my feelings here.

Regarding prospect "availability", you trade away pieces for anybody you think will make you better, even if it is for middling relievers.  The issue is whether the team believes in the the prospect.  Don't get me wrong, I am not planting my flag on this Trevor May proposal, but a guy like Canterino is not close to being a useful piece to a big league club.  He is what, our 15th ranked prospect?  Injury prone as well... Are we saying do not trade the 15th best Twins prospect for useful big league piece?  (Arguing for/against May in this spot is semantics).  I would have a hard time buying into that.  Regarding Ober, I am of the belief he falls into that 4-5 SP category.  Not hard to find. (Again, my opinion).

[Fire Dan Gladden]

30 minutes ago, LA VIkes Fan said:

Interesting idea. Here's the question - When does Davis play? We have Vasquez for 3 years and Jeffers isn't a free agent until 2027 so we have him for 4 years. I know we have no depth in AAA but I'm not in favor of trading two guys who have at least some upside (Varland as maybe a #3/4 SP, and Walner as a starting OF) for depth. Would you follow up that trade by trading Jeffers?

Agreed.  Signing Vasquez basically solidified this position for a while, and moves this position pretty far down the priority list