Is the Twins Pipe lined with ice or sludge?

[Game7-91]

Came across this on MLBTR, interesting read on the reigning World Series Champions ability to keep their pipeline up to date, while still producing ROY quality in their new players:

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/09/the-braves-star-rookie-starter.html

Spencer Strider is 23 YOA, drafted in 4th round 2020, (college player), played a grand total of 22 games in MiLB in 2021, had 2 games with Braves end of 2021.

Michael Harris is 21 YOA, 3rd round draft 2019, (out of high school), played 197 games in MiLB in 2019, 2021, 2022 across multiple levels, now 90 games with Braves in 2022.

I can imagine Twins fans would be thrilled to have one of these guys on the roster, let alone two.

Compare that sequence to someone like Miranda, who logged nearly 400 MiLB games over 5 1/2 minor league seasons. Question then, is should Twins be much more aggressive in moving talent in the system when they are performing?

I don't know, but I do sense the Twins need a different strategy in developing their MLB potential talent.

Is this a way to better leverage that talent ?

[MABB1959]

Are they even good at assessing talent would be my question. 

[Rosterman]

Every year the AAA roster is filled with minor league free agents. Of course, once a player plays in AAA they get on the radar of another team and you have to make the dreaded 40-man roster decision.

Names like Canterino, Fundeburk, Julien, Martin et all are still at AA (althjough Martin is far from Rule 5 eligible...yet).

But patience with the new regime. Looks like they have been pushing draft picks from 2021, as well as this year's top picks.

[gunnarthor]

1 hour ago, MABB1959 said:

Are they even good at assessing talent would be my question. 

I think this is the better question. We've certainly lost talent over the years. 

I do think the Twins are generally a bit too cautious with minor leaguers. It's nice to see Brooks Lee already at A+, suggesting he'll be at AA next year and nearly ready. I think Brad Steil was better at pushing minor leaguers when he was farm director. I don't think Zoll or Hassan are as good and the system suffers a bit for it. But I could be wrong. 

[TwinsDr2021]

2 hours ago, Game7-91 said:

Came across this on MLBTR, interesting read on the reigning World Series Champions ability to keep their pipeline up to date, while still producing ROY quality in their new players:

I am calling BS on this </s>, it could not have happened. Strider pitched 12 innings in 2020 in college, 94 in 21 and is up to 120.2 there is no way a team would increase the innings that much and risk injury. Next you are going to say he threw 103 pitches in 6 innings last night.

Harris as a 18 year old played 53 games in 2019, 0 in 2020, 101 at A+ in 2021, 43 at AA, no team would bring up a player that quickly after only hitting .305 in AA.

Rumor has it they also brought up Vaughn Grissom this year at age 21 who was drafted in the 11th round in 2019. He only played 44 games at age 18 in 2019, 0 games in 2020, and 74 at A+ and 22 in AA this year.

 

[Game7-91]

44 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

I am calling BS on this, it could not have happened. Strider pitched 12 innings in 2020 in college, 94 in 21 and is up to 120.2 there is no way a team would increase the innings that much and risk injury. Next you are going to say he threw 103 pitches in 6 innings last night.

Harris as a 18 year old played 53 games in 2019, 0 in 2020, 101 at A+ in 2021, 43 at AA, no team would bring up a player that quickly after only hitting .305 in AA.

Rumor has it they also brought up Vaughn Grissom this year at age 21 who was drafted in the 11th round in 2019. He only played 44 games at age 18 in 2019, 0 games in 2020, and 74 at A+ and 22 in AA this year.

 

Heres BR Stats, am I missing something?:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/stridsp01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=&utm_medium=referral

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/harrimi04.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=&utm_medium=referral

[chpettit19]

Louie Varland was a 15th round pick in 2019 that made it to the majors in 3 years. Ryan Jeffers was a 2nd round pick in 2018 who made it to the majors in 2 years. Buxton made it to the majors in 3 years (same as Harris). Polanco debuted at the age of 20. Lewis very likely would've debuted at age 21 or 22 if it weren't for the pandemic and injury. Steer was a 3rd round pick in 2019 who made it to the brink of the majors (promoted by the Reds eventually) in 3 years. Rooker drafted in 2017, debuted 2020. 

Jose Miranda wasn't good for much of those 5.5 minor league seasons so it's hard to say he should've been promoted more aggressively. The complaint could be made that he more than earned a call up last year, but it's also hard to argue that it wasn't smart for the Twins to save service time on him during a lost year for the team. Kirilloff moved quickly when healthy. I'd wager that Canterino would've debuted by now if it weren't for injuries. 

I certainly think they could stand to be more aggressive with guys who are clearly dominating in the minors. That's been the Brave's move. Get them to AA and if they're on fire call them up when they're hot and see if they can keep the momentum going. I have every expectation that Lee has the chance to debut next year if he's dominating at AA (I assume he finishes this year at A+ and starts next year at AA).

The Twins haven't had guys go nuts like Harris, Grissom, or Strider very often. I do think they're more conservative than teams like Atlanta. The interesting players that you could debate what other teams would've done with them are the Steer, Wallner, Julien types from the 2019 draft. As for "assessing talent" goes I think it's pretty good to turn 3rd rounder Steer, 18th rounder Julien, and 15th rounder Varland all into possible major leaguers from that draft. They had CES in AA this year after they picked him in the 4th just last year. Again on the "assessing talent" I think having Petty, Hajjar, Povich, and CES be the trade pieces they were this year is a pretty good indication the league thinks the Twins assessed talent well in last year's draft. Not to mention 13th round pick David Festa looking like a real prospect in his first full season.

In conclusion, yes, I think they could stand to be more aggressive with some guys. No, there shouldn't be much question that the Twins are assessing talent pretty well. People loved to point to Baddoo last year as a huge missed assessment, yet aren't talking about his .184/.255/.213 slash line in 52 games this year. So I think they assess, and develop, pretty well, but are probably too conservative. Even though I'd say the Twins performance last year lead to some of that conservative decision making for that year in particular.

[TwinsDr2021]

16 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Louie Varland was a 15th round pick in 2019 that made it to the majors in 3 years. Ryan Jeffers was a 2nd round pick in 2018 who made it to the majors in 2 years. Buxton made it to the majors in 3 years (same as Harris). Polanco debuted at the age of 20. Lewis very likely would've debuted at age 21 or 22 if it weren't for the pandemic and injury. Steer was a 3rd round pick in 2019 who made it to the brink of the majors (promoted by the Reds eventually) in 3 years. Rooker drafted in 2017, debuted 2020.

If we are being honest the current FO does a pretty decent job of moving guys fairly quickly, so I really have no complaints about that.  What they don't do well is drafting pitchers that stay healthy, they do seem to have an eye for talented pitchers to their credit. Plus when you are drafting college seniors they have to move pretty fast, because they start off on the old side of prospect lists. For example Steer is almost 25, don't mean it to be bad but if they moved him slower, how old would he before debuting.

Comparing the twins to the braves is probably not fair, because the Braves had a pretty constant steam of extremely young guys breaking into the majors (the ones mentioned plus, freeman, Acuna, Albies, Riley, Swanson, Wright, Fried, Conterras, Soroka, Anderson, Wilson) I would guess more teams are like the Twins than the Braves.

 

[bean5302]

3 hours ago, Game7-91 said:

Heres BR Stats, am I missing something?:

 

Yep. I think you missed the sarcasm, haha.

[Game7-91]

9 hours ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

I am calling BS on this </s>, it could not have happened. Strider pitched 12 innings in 2020 in college, 94 in 21 and is up to 120.2 there is no way a team would increase the innings that much and risk injury. Next you are going to say he threw 103 pitches in 6 innings last night.

Harris as a 18 year old played 53 games in 2019, 0 in 2020, 101 at A+ in 2021, 43 at AA, no team would bring up a player that quickly after only hitting .305 in AA.

Rumor has it they also brought up Vaughn Grissom this year at age 21 who was drafted in the 11th round in 2019. He only played 44 games at age 18 in 2019, 0 games in 2020, and 74 at A+ and 22 in AA this year.

 

I blew your finely nuanced sacastic wit Doc, my apologies. Can I blame it on covid fog? Toenail fungus? More likely than not just mental density. Thanks for your excellent reply.