Game Thread: Twins @ Guardians, noon:10 cdt, 0th July 2022ad

[chpettit19]

1 minute ago, AstrosTwins said:

The problem is, the plan they are operating under with Wes is probably an “organizational plan.” Wes leaving might have little impact. 

The last few days many in charge over there have spoken about how vital Wes has been in the planning process. The 3rd time through the lineup stuff is definitely an organizational thing, but Wes plays a large role in everything. And I'm not trying to place this at his feet. The FO needs to get better pitchers for the pen. I put most of it on them. Just saying it's a natural point to change things up. Guy who runs the staff is leaving and you have a new voice in charge. Clearly need to change things. Seems too obvious not to change some things. Hopefully pretty drastically.

[ChermesZ]

1 minute ago, notoriousgod71 said:

Laudner says this is "still" a "good" bullpen.

 

 

That’s called ‘propaganda’.

 

[SwainZag]

Just now, operation mindcrime said:

It would've been nice to have Graterol and Rogers pitch today! And Yesterday!!!

Can we quit beating the Rogers dead horse, please?  Graterol was traded 2.5 years ago. 

[Jerr]

Listening to the after coverage on the radio will be painful, but I think I'll be able to laugh...as excuses are spoken....can't wait for the manager to talk....

[MMMordabito]

2 minutes ago, notoriousgod71 said:

Laudner says this is "still" a "good" bullpen.

 

 

They've made lots of improvement to the catcher's protective head gear since he played.

[Schmoeman5]

1 minute ago, operation mindcrime said:

It would've been nice to have Graterol and Rogers pitch today! And Yesterday!!!

Nah. More useful as trade chips. You can put anyone in the bullpen and be successful 

[USAFChief]

1 minute ago, SwainZag said:

Can we quit beating the Rogers dead horse, please?  

Why? Seems pretty relevant to me. 

[AstrosTwins]

Archer just said it’s probably good they play tomorrow so they can turn the page quickly on today. Who was the designated page turner last night. Did someone not do their job? 
 

I’m thinking it’s time to get a new damn playbook!

[SwainZag]

Just now, Schmoeman5 said:

Nah. More useful as trade chips. You can put anyone in the bullpen and be successful 

Maeda finished 2nd in Cy Young voting in 2020.  Yes, Graterol would be great, but a healthy Maeda this year would make a world of difference as well.  

I'm just hoping the past week actually sparks something to be done.

[Jerr]

And the spin starts with "we have a new pitching coach" ?

[Winston Smith]

5 minutes ago, notoriousgod71 said:

Laudner says this is "still" a "good" bullpen.

 

 

Bally sports has cases of lipstick.

[SwainZag]

1 minute ago, USAFChief said:

Why? Seems pretty relevant to me. 

There's pages and pages and threads and threads and threads about the trade.  If you want to keep beating it to the ground it's not going to change a damn thing.  

[AstrosTwins]

1 minute ago, SwainZag said:

Maeda finished 2nd in Cy Young voting in 2020.  Yes, Graterol would be great, but a healthy Maeda this year would make a world of difference as well.  

I'm just hoping the past week actually sparks something to be done.

Agree. Pagan has been a disaster to this point but Pollock was promising before his injury. Bad luck for the Twins. 

[Jerr]

Enough pain here today, just going to listen to the post game on the radio. Hopefully my radio does not fly out my window.

[Aggies7]

Quick! Someone tell me how many games other teams have blown!

[wsnydes]

1 minute ago, Jerr said:

Enough pain here today, just going to listen to the post game on the radio. Hopefully my radio does not fly out my window.

Thought you said enough pain!  You seek more? 

[nicksaviking]

Ok, my prediction for the staff come Monday.

Rotation: 

Gray, Ryan, Smeltzer, Winder and Bundy (gag)

Pen:

Duran, Jax, Duffey, Thielbar, Moran, Archer, Ian Hamilton and Simeon Woods Richardson.

[USAFChief]

3 minutes ago, SwainZag said:

There's pages and pages and threads and threads and threads about the trade.  If you want to keep beating it to the ground it's not going to change a damn thing.  

It was a stupid ******* trade. It's absolutely hurting this team, as was reasonably predictable. 

People who crowed about it at the time now want to forget it?

Well sorry, but when we're watching Tyler Thornburg cough up yet another game, the performance of the front office in assembling a pen is fair game.

[SpicyGarvSauce]

4 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

It was a stupid ******* trade. It's absolutely hurting this team, as was reasonably predictable. 

People who crowed about it at the time now want to forget it?

Well sorry, but when we're watching Tyler Thornburg cough up yet another game, the performance of the front office in assembling a pen is fair game.

It really was - the actual trade, the timing of the trade, etc.

Pagan was bad last year, and Paddock was damaged goods and not very good of late with the Padres in the NL. It was a total salary dump for the Twins where they also thought they could look good again by taking on some fringe arms and making them productive.

 

[AceWrigley]

12 minutes ago, MMMordabito said:

They've made lots of improvement to the catcher's protective head gear since he played.

I hope Laudner was wearing it when he said this is still a good bullpen.

[Squirrel]

2 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Simeon Woods Richardson.

Lol ... you've been pulling for him all year ... who comes off the 40-man? I mean ... that's such a tough choice!

[Winston Smith]

4 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

It was a stupid ******* trade. It's absolutely hurting this team, as was reasonably predictable. 

People who crowed about it at the time now want to forget it?

Well sorry, but when we're watching Tyler Thornburg cough up yet another game, the performance of the front office in assembling a pen is fair game.

The it's "nobody's fault" sect is a big reason why this team  0-18 in the playoffs and hasn't been to a world series in over 30 years. Willing to accept crap year after year.

[TwinsDr2021]

20 minutes ago, SwainZag said:

Maeda finished 2nd in Cy Young voting in 2020.  Yes, Graterol would be great, but a healthy Maeda this year would make a world of difference as well.  

I'm just hoping the past week actually sparks something to be done.

The Twins traded a minor league prospect for a player that was or should have helped the team for three years, I will NEVER complain about a trade like that. Don't care Maeda got hurt, it was the right thing to do.

[Squirrel]

4 minutes ago, Winston Smith said:

The it's "nobody's fault" sect is a big reason why this team  0-18 in the playoffs and hasn't been to a world series in over 30 years. Willing to accept crap year after year.

This is completely false ... these generalities do nothing for discussion ... nothing ... I think MOST EVERYONE blames some form of the organization for that, and doesn't leave everyone blameless. To what degree which of us holds those various entities to blame differs, but stop with this. I've said it many times ... I hold the FO to the majority of the blame. Execution is another part of the blame ... I hold players to more of that than others ... but the coaches and manager do get some. But I don't think anyone thinks no one is faultless.

[Rosterman]

Sad that Wes Johnson leaves on such a sour note.

[Rosterman]

14 minutes ago, SpicyGarvSauce said:

It really was - the actual trade, the timing of the trade, etc.

Pagan was bad last year, and Paddock was damaged goods and not very good of late with the Padres in the NL. It was a total salary dump for the Twins where they also thought they could look good again by taking on some fringe arms and making them productive.

 

But it wasn't a salary dump as the Twins still paid the salary of Rogers!

[Aggies7]

6 minutes ago, Rosterman said:

Sad that Wes Johnson leaves on such a sour note.

Sad for who? I’m sure he’s going to be as happy as Andy Dufresne on his boat 

[Bigfork Twins Guy]

18 hours ago, SpicyGarvSauce said:

Pagan was bad last year, and Paddock was damaged goods and not very good of late with the Padres in the NL. It was a total salary dump for the Twins where they also thought they could look good again by taking on some fringe arms and making them productive.

What salary dump.  We are paying 100% of Rogers salary.

[Rosterman]

17 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Ok, my prediction for the staff come Monday.

Rotation: 

Gray, Ryan, Smeltzer, Winder and Bundy (gag)

Pen:

Duran, Jax, Duffey, Thielbar, Moran, Archer, Ian Hamilton and Simeon Woods Richardson.

Bundy and Archer stay in the rotation because on fontracts, sadly.

Long relief? Can the Twins NOT use Jax for two innings (or even three) every other day if necessary? Of course, that is moot if the rotation can pitch into the sixth.

Thielbar, Duffey, Smith, Thornburg, Pagan, Cotton. All have to be in hot seats. All will be worn out soon. Megil might replace one. Duffey gets another chance. Thielbar is still a lefty and until Coulombe comes back (if ever) will be kept. Time has come to say goodbye to Thornburg and Cotton for good?

Yes, would like to see WInder up, but is he just a tag-team long relief guy? Is he more valuable getting reps in as a rotation arm if ane when?

Who is in St. Paul? Cano. Sands as a relief option? Balazovic as a relief option? 

Most of the other amrs become free agents if they don't quite work out: Hamilton, Pinto, Wood, whatever.

Can the Twins PLESE trade for a bonifide closer who can pitch two and EVEn three innings if possible and have a modicum of success?

Wish could count on Alcala!

[Squirrel]

20 minutes ago, SpicyGarvSauce said:

It really was - the actual trade, the timing of the trade, etc.

The timing was bad, but I honestly didn't mind the trade EXCEPT that they didn't then do something else (before OR after) to shore up the BP and just left it Rogers-less and not adding a QUALITY piece. That's what was wrong, imo. These losses, imo, are 95% on the FO.