Game Thread: Twins vs. Cleveland, 6/23/22 @ 12:10PM CT

[LVTwinsfan]

1 minute ago, Vanimal46 said:

The Twins scored 5, 10, and 1 runs this series. Obviously the game we score 1 is a winner. 

Baseball is all about pitching

[mrtwinsfan]

6 minutes ago, RpR said:

That wreaked havoc on Clevelands psychic, simple as that.

We all know that Feeling 

[RpR]

1 minute ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Only if they're adjusted. I think MLB should be running electronic zones in AAA already but it should receive at least a couple of seasons in the high minors to both refine it and give more players first-hand experience with it so the change isn't as jarring.

And totally ruin the game as it will if it ever comes.

[LVTwinsfan]

Just now, RpR said:

And totally ruin the game as it will if it ever comes.

Umpires making terrible ball and strike calls are no longer good for the game

[RpR]

1 minute ago, LVTwinsfan said:

Baseball is all about pitching

Twins had zero fielding errors today and won, looked like clowns fielding yesterday and lost after throwing away two leads; far more to game that pitchng.

[PopRiveter]

6 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I think it's on the path to being better but the horribly low batting averages and long games are still a huge problem, both of which will hopefully be fixed by the new 2023 rules.

I'm really liking the game a lot better this year, but maybe my perception is skewed by watching primarily Twins games. 

Hope it keeps trending toward more action and more contact.

[Brock Beauchamp]

3 minutes ago, RpR said:

And totally ruin the game as it will if it ever comes.

How and why? If implemented well - which isn't a huge challenge at this point - it will be basically invisible to viewers.

[RpR]

1 minute ago, LVTwinsfan said:

Umpires making terrible ball and strike calls are no longer good for the game

It has always been that way, people are not perfect and to expect them to be so, is obtuse.

[RpR]

Just now, Brock Beauchamp said:

How and why? If implemented well - which isn't a huge challenge at this point - it will be basically invisible to viewers.

Human error gives the game a soul, computers have no soul.

[weneedneshek]

1 minute ago, RpR said:

Human error gives the game a soul, computers have no soul.

Do the players not give the game a soul?

[PopRiveter]

2 minutes ago, LVTwinsfan said:

Umpires making terrible ball and strike calls are no longer good for the game

I can't imagine the technology will disappoint me more than the skewed crews and a slanted playing fields we've faced in recent playoff series. I want fair baseball. Feels like electronic strike zones will be an important step closer. 

[cHawk]

6 minutes ago, LVTwinsfan said:

Baseball is all about pitching

All aspects of the game are important. You need the full package to win.

The Twins did not have the full package in the 2020 postseason

[Brock Beauchamp]

Just now, RpR said:

Human error gives the game a soul, computers have no soul.

I simply don't get this. Getting the call right is better, especially if the viewer can't tell that a computer is the one doing the heavy lifting.

There are multiple games a week literally lost by umpires making a handful of bad calls against one team and skewing the game's outcome by 1-2+ runs in one direction. How is that good for the sport?

[LVTwinsfan]

Just now, RpR said:

Human error gives the game a soul, computers have no soul.

I agree, and I was never a fan of electronic strike zones, but now we can see how bad the umpires actually are, it’s unacceptable, it’s coming, like it or not, besides, theyve already ruined the game

[Brock Beauchamp]

Just now, PopRiveter said:

I can't imagine the technology will disappoint me more than the skewed crews and a slanted playing fields we've faced in recent playoff series. I want fair baseball. Feels like electronic strike zones will be an important step closer. 

By the way, there IS a "correct" answer why electronic strike zones can be bad. Ignoring bad, game-altering calls on a strike three or ball four, human umpires have been statistically shown to lengthen at-bats and heighten intensity. If a pitcher goes up 0-2 and throws a borderline strike, the human ump is more likely to call a ball and keep the intrigue going. The inverse is true with a 3-0 count.

So there ARE reasons to keep human umpires but nobody really talks about it, people on one side simply tend to holler at "computers" and miss the actual upside of human umpiring.

[Vanimal46]

The St Paul Saints won 7-1 as well. The org is off to a strong start already. Balazovic 3 shutout innings 2 hits 3 K. 

[cHawk]

3 minutes ago, RpR said:

Human error gives the game a soul, computers have no soul.

I would rather have it where both teams have equal chances to win, rather than one team having an advantage due to the umpires being on their side. This is an issue that not only hurts baseball, but sports in general.

[LVTwinsfan]

2 minutes ago, cHawk said:

All aspects of the game are important. You need the full package to win.

The Twins did not have the full package in the 2020 postseason

Of course I know that…this place is exhausting…. I would rather have good pitching and average offense than vice versa

[RpR]

4 minutes ago, weneedneshek said:

Do the players not give the game a soul?

Umpires are a player in the game.

[LVTwinsfan]

2 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

By the way, there IS a "correct" answer why electronic strike zones can be bad. Ignoring bad, game-altering calls on a strike three or ball four, human umpires have been statistically shown to lengthen at-bats and heighten intensity. If a pitcher goes up 0-2 and throws a borderline strike, the human ump is more likely to call a ball and keep the intrigue going. The inverse is true with a 3-0 count.

So there ARE reasons to keep human umpires but nobody really talks about it, people on one side simply tend to holler at "computers" and miss the actual upside of human umpiring.

That’s the best explanation I’ve ever heard 

[wsnydes]

1 minute ago, RpR said:

Umpires are a player in the game.

They're not supposed to be though.

[RpR]

5 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I simply don't get this. Getting the call right is better, especially if the viewer can't tell that a computer is the one doing the heavy lifting.

There are multiple games a week literally lost by umpires making a handful of bad calls against one team and skewing the game's outcome by 1-2+ runs in one direction. How is that good for the sport?

No they are lost by teams that cannot overcome supposed bad calls, just like they cannot over come the other team without supposed bad calls.

[RpR]

4 minutes ago, wsnydes said:

They're not supposed to be though.

Billy Martin changed that years ago.

[LVTwinsfan]

3 minutes ago, RpR said:

No they are lost by teams that cannot overcome supposed bad calls, just like they cannot over come the other team without supposed bad calls.

Was Mauers ground rule double that was called a foul ball a “supposed” bad call? Are you opposed to making that call right or should we have just accepted that the umpire is a player in the game

[LVTwinsfan]

4 minutes ago, RpR said:

Billy Martin changed that years ago.

You can’t be serious

[RpR]

Just now, LVTwinsfan said:

Was Mauers ground rule double that was called a foul ball a “supposed” bad call? Are you opposed to making that call right or should we have just accepted that the umpire is a player in the game

Just like Harmon Killebrews 50th home run in 1969 was called ground rule double because the umpire could not belive any one could hit a line drive over the fence that low but the outfielder later said it never touched the ground.

Very annoying , but it keeps the game as challenging as life.

[RpR]

1 minute ago, LVTwinsfan said:

You can’t be serious

I am.

[LVTwinsfan]

1 minute ago, RpR said:

Just like Harmon Killebrews 50th home run in 1969 was called ground rule double because the umpire could not belive any one could hit a line drive over the fence that low but the outfielder later said it never touched the ground.

Very annoying , but it keeps the game as challenging as life.

Your challenge is going to be how to accept the changes, obviously you have so far, it’ll be alright

[PopRiveter]

15 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

By the way, there IS a "correct" answer why electronic strike zones can be bad. Ignoring bad, game-altering calls on a strike three or ball four, human umpires have been statistically shown to lengthen at-bats and heighten intensity. If a pitcher goes up 0-2 and throws a borderline strike, the human ump is more likely to call a ball and keep the intrigue going. The inverse is true with a 3-0 count.

So there ARE reasons to keep human umpires but nobody really talks about it, people on one side simply tend to holler at "computers" and miss the actual upside of human umpiring.

I appreciate the point even if it doesn't sway me to switch sides. It is insightful and needs to be weighed. 

I expect I'd be all for human umps influencing the game for drama and excitement if I were a fan of one of mlb's elite big market teams.

[SkyBlueWaters]

10 minutes ago, RpR said:

No they are lost by teams that cannot overcome supposed bad calls, just like they cannot over come the other team without supposed bad calls.

I think it was last year the Twins were cruising with a big lead at Yankee Stadium, that exorbitant shopping mall of a ballpark. Duffey throws what is on replay clearly a strike (admitted by the Yankees announcers) and the ump calls it a ball. Forced to pitch even more over the plate, Duffy coughs up a long ball, and the $%@!# Yankees come back.

Duffy is red-faced, screaming at the ump as he is taken out of the game.  The Twins lose again.

This is good entertainment for you?