Would you Trade Correa this year?

[In My La Z boy]

55 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

I know it's a one year deal. The Twins are in first place, they shouldn't trade starting players away just because they will be free agents next season. They should try to win in the only season they'll have the best SS in the history of the franchise under contract. It's a miracle they have him at all. Don't throw that away.

Exactly. This is precisely why the opening day trade of our closer was confounding - AND we paid his salary to boot.

Still don't understand this trade - and by making this trade, it tells me our front office would indeed trade Correa under certain circumstances. 

[Unwinder]

Twins fans are so used to playoff failure that they want to rebuild when they're on top of the division. You hate to see it. You don't wait until your team is completely unbeatable to make a playoff run, you roll the dice every chance you get.

[Major League Ready]

4 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Who is the specific SS you use this year (when actually leading the division) and next year? How do you get better play, when losing one of the twenty best players in the game (not possibly, but likely)? 

Losing Lewis made losing Correa this year a big problem.  I actually saw a reasonable path before Lewis was lost.  Trading Correa obviously puts a big dent in 2022.  For the next few years, there are other paths to take that would likely produce a better team.  They will have 70M to spend if Correa opts out.  Sign Willson Contreras which would be a huge upgrade at catcher.  Sign Rodon who has an opt out or Musgrove or Taillon.  Then, spend $10-15M on another BP piece to go with Duran and hopefully Canterino.  Start the year with Polacios at SS and bring in Lewis when he is ready.  Those additions plus a more experienced Ryan / Winder / Smeltzer / Duran / Jax / Kirilloff / Miranda / Larnach / Celestino and you have a considerably better team. 

[bean5302]

5 hours ago, DJL44 said:

I know it's a one year deal. The Twins are in first place, they shouldn't trade starting players away just because they will be free agents next season. They should try to win in the only season they'll have the best SS in the history of the franchise under contract. It's a miracle they have him at all. Don't throw that away.

I agree, they shouldn't (and won't) likely trade Correa if they're leading the division or even if they're in the playoffs. There are 38 games before the trade deadline.

7 games against the Guardians who are only 3.5 games back right now, and those games all come in the next two weeks.
4 games against the White Sox, who are 6.0 games back right now.
The Guardians play 8 games against the White Sox, themselves before the deadline.

The standings could look way different at the end of next month (even this month).

[USAFChief]

On 6/13/2022 at 3:53 PM, Vanimal46 said:

I’ll take this bet. Since it is impossible to have 2 AL teams in the World Series, I’ll take Zelle or Venmo for my payment. 

 

[nicksaviking]

5 hours ago, twins_89 said:

I think the Twins either need to trade Correa or trade for a top of the rotation starter. I don't see the current starter group being ready to win a playoff series, so the decision needs to be made whether to go for it this year or to build for the future. 

They already have too many young guys; there are not enough roster spots for more prospects. 
 

The chances that the prospects who come over in a trade end up better than Sawyer Gibson-Long, Alex Isola, Brent Headrick or whomever else the Twins would be forced to sacrifice is minimal. And certainly any gain would not be greater than the immediate loss of goodwill the team has bought with the players and fans by signing Correa.

[prouster]

7 hours ago, DJL44 said:

I'm going to guess this gets brought up every couple weeks until the trade deadline

Ok. Just wanted to make sure I didn’t accidentally pass through a wormhole or something. 

[wabene]

On 6/13/2022 at 3:46 PM, ashbury said:

Trading Correa could be positioned as somehow being for the longer-term health of the franchise. 

But IMO the worst disadvantage the Twins face is that their market is not as strong as it might be for a metro area of its size.  St Louis is always held up as the benchmark for franchises below the big markets, and rightly so - their metro area is smaller than the Twin Cities but according to Forbes their baseball revenue stream is larger.  The beautiful thing is that this isn't (to any important extent) a zero-sum game - the franchises compete for wins on the diamond but every franchise has the potential to increase its fan loyalty.  The Cardinals have done this through literally decades of showing their fans that they care.  The Twins have by contrast conditioned their fan base to expect the minimum, through a constant message about overspending being bad and occasional last-place finishes being not as bad.  I liked many things about Terry Ryan but in retrospect he was bad for the franchise.   It will take decades to correct this, and our FO has taken halting steps to do so, while operating within most of the long-time constraints, but I'm skeptical that those higher up than them in the corporate hierarchy will go all in to make this franchise the one that other teams speak of in the same breath as St Louis.

With that as context: trading away Correa would be a PR disaster, unless the Twins somehow tank so badly in the coming six weeks that they drop from a first-place perch to completely-and-absolutely out of contention, or unless some team offers an insane package in return for two months of our player.  It would undo a lot of the good our FO has accomplished.  The Twins invested a year of high salary* into Correa, and they need to see it through now that the season has gone well.

* The investment actually includes a guarantee of two more years if disaster strikes and Correa becomes unemployable

I never thought of their local perception and Terry Ryan's legacy that way and it does explain the extreme fan angst. Very good post. 

[twins_89]

53 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

They already have too many young guys; there are not enough roster spots for more prospects. 
 

The chances that the prospects who come over in a trade end up better than Sawyer Gibson-Long, Alex Isola, Brent Headrick or whomever else the Twins would be forced to sacrifice is minimal. And certainly any gain would not be greater than the immediate loss of goodwill the team has bought with the players and fans by signing Correa.

I think you are underestimating the trade value of Correa by quite a bit. Also, I'm skeptical that there would be any issues with players or fans since everyone knows Correa's time with the Twins was always destined to be very short.

[wabene]

18 hours ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

Precisely my point—I am betting the Twins won’t beat the Yankees in the World Series.  As the Twins will never play the Yankees in the World Series, they will therefore never beat them in the World Series.  As you took the bet (meaning you think the Twins will beat the Yankees in the World Series), is is I who is owed the payment.  Except for me, it’s gotta be straight cash homey.

Snap! 

[nicksaviking]

1 hour ago, twins_89 said:

I think you are underestimating the trade value of Correa by quite a bit. Also, I'm skeptical that there would be any issues with players or fans since everyone knows Correa's time with the Twins was always destined to be very short.

I think you are overestimating what to expect from prospects. We’ve just seen Ober, Winder and Varland become more valuable than Balazovic and Canterino, and those three are the quality type of prospects you’d be cutting in favor of the Correa return. The Twins have enough prospects.

And if you think trading Correa wouldn’t impact the fans, then you haven’t followed the threads on this site very long, because even when the team is unwatchable there’s a huge percentage of fans that fight the idea of trading bets. And this team is the most fun team I’ve watched since 2006.

[ashbury]

4 hours ago, wabene said:

Snap! 

Twins Daily: Come for the baseball news and analysis, stay for the earnest deconstruction of people's jokes.

[Nine of twelve]

I would trade any player if I thought doing so improved the team and the organization.

[Nine of twelve]

On 6/13/2022 at 5:43 PM, Cap'n Piranha said:

I will bet you a Million dollars the Twins won't beat the Yankees in the World Series.

Be careful what you bet on. 20 years ago you might have said you will bet a million dollars that Houston won't beat the Dodgers in the World Series, or that Atlanta won't beat Houston.

[Trov]

20 hours ago, bean5302 said:

I don't feel like a lot of people who want to keep Correa are being realistic in this thread. Correa was never expected to be here next year.

1 yr $35MM with an additional 1 yr $35MM player option for an age 28 All Star caliber SS. That's what Correa would have to opt into at the end of the year. The options were always a risk and always bad for the Twins. The only reason Correa opts in is because he can't get more in free agency. If he can't get more in free agency that means he's severely hurt or had a terrible season.

Signing Correa to a new contract is not an option because the Twins are not going to pony up that kind of money. This is what top SS contracts looked like last year, and this year the market is much tighter.
Marcus Semien a31 = 7yrs $175MM
Trevor Story a29 = 6yrs $140MM
Corey Seager a28 = 10yrs $325MM
Javier Baez a29 = 6yrs $140MM

Correa will get north of $150MM, probably north of $200MM though I don't think he will encroach on Seager, but let's get a little realistic.

So far none of those guys are living up those contracts.  Not sure if that helps or hurts Correa getting close to Seager or not.  He was hoping to do better than Seager this past offseason.  Story had a good stretch in May for like 2 weeks going crazy, but outside of that he has been terrible.  Since May 26th, he has 18 games, no HR, 4 RBI, and his OPS has droped 61 points.  Really he just had a crazy 2 weeks so far this year, outside of 14 game stretch he has been terrible. 

I really do not know if that means people will say, well all these guys got paid a ton and Correa is only one that played up to his contract, we should pay him more.  Will they say well these guys were all mistakes, at least so far, should we risk it on Correa will he drop off like everyone else? 

[Einheri]

Originally, I thought it was the Twins' FO plan all along to trade Correa for prospects in July---and hired him primarily to allow Lewis and Martin a chance to prove themselves in the minors and use whichever of them was ready to play in the Bigs,  Or, if the Twins completed bombed in the first half, Correa could be traded even if the rookies weren't ready.  Carlos would have done his part:  helped to sell season tickets at the start of the season and that was fine.  (Yes, I am a fan and a cynic).

Now with Lewis injured and the Twins doing okay, they need to hang onto him.  They might even push to lock up/ensure a longer deal with Correa since Lewis isn't likely to return until mid season 2023.

[SwainZag]

Unless the Twins fall heavily out of contention in the next 6 weeks, the idea of even dangling Correa to me is preposterous.  A new topic being posted seemingly every week on the same topic is just crazy to me. 

I really believe there are too many people who believe a team either need to A) Go all out to win or b) rebuild.  There can be in between.  This team is heavily talented, yet quite inexperienced.  There are glut of 1st and 2nd year players on the roster, and getting a lot of playing time.  Signing Correa doesn't mean the FO assumed they would be WS contenders from day 1, just as trading Rodgers did not signal that the same FO didn't think they could win.  

Ride it out, get into the tournament.  A healthy Twins lineup is one of the best in baseball.  There's a lot of time for the Twins to get Correa to opt in to Year 2 or re-work a contract.  If they can't or don't want to commit, oh well.  I'd rather see Correa leave after a year, rather than Twins throwing in the towel in late July when they are still in the hunt to see the postseason.  

[GeorgiaBaller]

No--I would not trade CC.

The Twins have had a problem elevating the expectations in the Clubhouse for years.  The last solid clubhouse environment was the year when Torii Hunter closed out his career.  Buck is providing spark and on field leadership---and he is complimented by CC who is vocal, confident, and a good on-field coach.  How many stories have you heard now about CC giving tips and advice that were valuable and taken to action by another player.  Hopefully some younger guys---especially Royce Lewis--will learn that from him while he is here.

Additionally, SS's are not big trade targets for a playoff run for anyone.  If they don't have a solid SS, they are not making a run, anyway.  SS's are off season acquisitions.  

Twins fan base has to settle on what they feels is important.  For years fans have complained the ORG does not sign big free agents.  Guess what?  We did!  We got rid of a self centered clubhouse drag with an albatross contract and signed an upgrade!  And now the discussion is entertained to trade him?  Geez---exhausting!

 

 

 

[TruthInDuluth]

Keep the team as it stands.  The starting pitching is returning for injury list.  Rocko is using the starters with limited innings, yes, he is burning up the bullpen, but those arms can be replaced in AAA.  Those starters will go 7 innings in crunch time if we get there.  Carlos will stick around next year(for a raise), if he thinks team can win a series. Market will be great for him in 2024

 

[specialiststeve]

On 6/13/2022 at 12:49 PM, baul0010 said:

I would trade him.  Boras isn't letting him play out this contract.  He's getting Carlos 350 mil.  If the Twins will not pony up the funds then don't take this gift signing for granted. 

As much fun as the season has been.  We aren't winning the World Series this year.  We wouldn't even be getting past the Yankee's in the playoffs.  Stock up the farm, let the kids roll next year.  

And with what ever we get in a trade we are not winning the WS next year... Play to win this year and let it play out... 

[Otaknam]

If the team has a sudden collapse then trade him. But if they are in the playoff hunt keep him. The problem is the Twins will never be a WS contender until they have a legit number one starter or 2 number twos. Since they won’t pay a top free agent pitcher the only option is to develop one. Let’s hope they do.

[RpR]

1 minute ago, Otaknam said:

If the team has a sudden collapse then trade him. But if they are in the playoff hunt keep him. The problem is the Twins will never be a WS contender until they have a legit number one starter or 2 number twos. Since they won’t pay a top free agent pitcher the only option is to develop one. Let’s hope they do.

How many years (decades) are you willing to wait?

The Twins did what they did in 2019 with imported veterans, which is what they need now again.

[insagt1]

On 6/15/2022 at 12:35 PM, GeorgiaBaller said:

No--I would not trade CC.

The Twins have had a problem elevating the expectations in the Clubhouse for years.  The last solid clubhouse environment was the year when Torii Hunter closed out his career.  Buck is providing spark and on field leadership---and he is complimented by CC who is vocal, confident, and a good on-field coach.  How many stories have you heard now about CC giving tips and advice that were valuable and taken to action by another player.  Hopefully some younger guys---especially Royce Lewis--will learn that from him while he is here.

Additionally, SS's are not big trade targets for a playoff run for anyone.  If they don't have a solid SS, they are not making a run, anyway.  SS's are off season acquisitions.  

Twins fan base has to settle on what they feels is important.  For years fans have complained the ORG does not sign big free agents.  Guess what?  We did!  We got rid of a self centered clubhouse drag with an albatross contract and signed an upgrade!  And now the discussion is entertained to trade him?  Geez---exhausting!

 

 

 

That! When you have a legit chance to win, you take it. He is a valuable addition and when he came here possibly he had no idea the team would gel like it has. So he 'might' want to stay if say the Twins win the division. Yeah they'll lose to the Yanks but this year everyone will lose to them. but a summer of fun winning games and watching real good talent wearing Twins gear is worth a lot. They were awful last year and this year so far has been a nice turnaround. Will it last? I think it might. Correa is a huge talent and he's our talent right now. We shouldn't be quick to immediately find ways to get rid of him. Prospects come and go. There will always be more. Always. Just enjoy the ride this season.

[TJ CPA]

He's gone after this season but I would keep him. We won't be winning the World Series this year but the race for the division will be entertaining for the next few months.

[Irishman]

If Twins decide to trade CC, please don’t trade CC to Yankees!

[baul0010]

2 hours ago, specialiststeve said:

And with what ever we get in a trade we are not winning the WS next year... Play to win this year and let it play out... 

I'm sorry to be the downer.... We ain't winning it this year.  Better trade Correa and shoot for 2024 then.

[nicksaviking]

On 6/14/2022 at 11:54 AM, bean5302 said:

I don't feel like a lot of people who want to keep Correa are being realistic in this thread. Correa was never expected to be here next year.

1 yr $35MM with an additional 1 yr $35MM player option for an age 28 All Star caliber SS. That's what Correa would have to opt into at the end of the year. The options were always a risk and always bad for the Twins. The only reason Correa opts in is because he can't get more in free agency. If he can't get more in free agency that means he's severely hurt or had a terrible season.

Signing Correa to a new contract is not an option because the Twins are not going to pony up that kind of money. This is what top SS contracts looked like last year, and this year the market is much tighter.
Marcus Semien a31 = 7yrs $175MM
Trevor Story a29 = 6yrs $140MM
Corey Seager a28 = 10yrs $325MM
Javier Baez a29 = 6yrs $140MM

Correa will get north of $150MM, probably north of $200MM though I don't think he will encroach on Seager, but let's get a little realistic.

The odds that Correa will be in Minnesota may be low, but they're higher odds than any of the other 29 teams. If there's a betting site showing the odds, the Twins would be the hands-down favorite for him next year.

The Twins are going to be starting young, affordable players all over the diamond the next several years. Not because the club is being cheap, but because those young guys look really good and are the best options. We can pretty definitively say that the team will NOT spend big on pitchers, but they will for offensive players. The Twins will have more money to spend than they have reasonable free agents to sign, and if they are coming off of a strong year, they are not only going to feel compelled to use that money to win, but to use that money to show the fans and players they want to win. Shortstop is the one clear hole.

This nonsense about Correa guaranteed to be gone next season is baffling considering we had even less reason to believe he'd be here this season, yet here he is.

[tony&rodney]

Boston won a World Series and they traded Babe Ruth.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

18 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

The odds that Correa will be in Minnesota may be low, but they're higher odds than any of the other 29 teams. If there's a betting site showing the odds, the Twins would be the hands-down favorite for him next year.

The Twins are going to be starting young, affordable players all over the diamond the next several years. Not because the club is being cheap, but because those young guys look really good and are the best options. We can pretty definitively say that the team will NOT spend big on pitchers, but they will for offensive players. The Twins will have more money to spend than they have reasonable free agents to sign, and if they are coming off of a strong year, they are not only going to feel compelled to use that money to win, but to use that money to show the fans and players they want to win. Shortstop is the one clear hole.

This nonsense about Correa guaranteed to be gone next season is baffling considering we had even less reason to believe he'd be here this season, yet here he is.

Adding to that, the Free Agent market next offseason is supposed to be a buyers market for SS again. Lots of free agents, fewer buyers.

I think the odds of CC playing on his current contract in ‘23 are low, but not bad odds that it’s for the Twins.

agree with you, I think the Twins would be the odds-on favorite too.

[prouster]

2 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Boston won a World Series and they traded Babe Ruth.

Haha. Well, the Yankees won a couple, too. There was also that whole course thing, if I recall.