Article: Oswaldo Arcia To Be Called Up On Monday

[Reginald Maudling's Shin]

Even so, there may be other aspects of his game that some refining could help with. At this point, why have him up unless he is ready. I have a problem with bringing up an elite prospect this early to a bad team unless he's basically demanding to be called up. I don't think we're quite there with him yet personally. His time is coming and I'm excited, but I hope this is just a brief taste.

 

Let's go snag Bourjos for Slama (Duensing? Not to mock the rule) or something and reboot this thing in the outfield. Hicks and Arcia should get nice and comfy playing with each other in AAA and be ready for later in the season.

I like Bourjos but why not just let Mastroianni play there. Why give up any assets to win 71 games instead of 68?

[TheLeviathan]

I like Bourjos but why not just let Mastroianni play there. Why give up any assets to win 71 games instead of 68?

 

Blind love for Bourjos' game defensively. Nothing more. It wouldn't be a great move, but I'd love it as a buy-low. Let him re-coop some value by playing every day and flashing that range with our statue in LF and a spacious CF. It'll probably cost a bullpen piece at most, so maybe we can turn that into a buy-low, sell-high situation.

[snepp]

My only worry is he goes 4-4 and 3-4 and they feel a need to keep him and send someone else out.

 

Yeah, it would suck if he were actually good enough to keep around.

[Thrylos]

Arcia can play CF as good as Cuddyer; this did not stop Gardenhire of playing the latter there...

 

I just hope that he makes it difficult to send him down and eventually becomes the Twins' every day LF pushing Willingham to the position he needs to be defensively (DH).

 

Really last time he played CF (other than a few games out of need at AA) was last decade in various Rookie leagues. He since beefed up considerably. He is like (pre-injury) Kubel at the OF (a tad better than Parmelee who is considerably improved this season.)

[Reginald Maudling's Shin]

I'd love it but I don't think the Angels would.

[TheLeviathan]

I'd love it but I don't think the Angels would.

Agreed, I'm well aware of what an irrational pipe-dream it is. But I wish nonetheless!

[mudcat14]

You are wrong. MLB service time only keeps ticking if he happens to go on the DL before he is sent down.

 

So to qualify as a 'Super 2' or whatever the term is, he would have to stay up the rest of the this season plus the next two to qualify for arbitration?

[Danchat]

Hey. Doumit and Hicks combined are batting .218. How can it hurt to have Arcia fill in for either one of them?

Wait a second.... Doumit would have to be batting .400 if their AVGs were combined.

[Reginald Maudling's Shin]

Arcia can play CF as good as Cuddyer; this did not stop Gardenhire of playing the latter there...

 

I just hope that he makes it difficult to send him down and eventually becomes the Twins' every day LF pushing Willingham to the position he needs to be defensively (DH).

 

Really last time he played CF (other than a few games out of need at AA) was last decade in various Rookie leagues. He since beefed up considerably. He is like (pre-injury) Kubel at the OF (a tad better than Parmelee who is considerably improved this season.)

 

IMO Willingham should have been in right field starting last year, he's got a good enough arm that he provides value out there. Parmelee has looked adequate enough though that he's not hurting you. At this point they're not moving Willingham from left though.

 

If they are planning on keeping Arcia around and sending down Hicks I'd play Mastroianni in center 50% of the time and have Arcia in the lineup full time either in center or right. I don't care what they do with Doumit quite frankly. Parmelee needs ABs more.

[spideyo]

I don't think we should read too much into this. Basically, they are saying Ramirez is going to out a few days, and we don't want to play with a short bench. Their options on the 40 are Butera (who is hurt), Herrmann, Pinto, Santana, Benson, and Arcia. Haven't looked at the numbers, but I'm guessing Arcia is hitting best out of that group.

 

He almost certainly will get sent down when Ramirez comes back. Of Course, we thought the same thing of Pedro, and that didn't turn out as expected.

 

I think there is definitely a willingness to give new faces a real shot and let them earn a spot, that really wasn't there the last few years. If I was Hicks though, I wouldn't be too worried.

[Oxtung]

I don't think we should read too much into this. Basically, they are saying Ramirez is going to out a few days, and we don't want to play with a short bench. Their options on the 40 are Butera (who is hurt), Herrmann, Pinto, Santana, Benson, and Arcia. Haven't looked at the numbers, but I'm guessing Arcia is hitting best out of that group.

 

He almost certainly will get sent down when Ramirez comes back. Of Course, we thought the same thing of Pedro, and that didn't turn out as expected.

 

I think there is definitely a willingness to give new faces a real shot and let them earn a spot, that really wasn't there the last few years. If I was Hicks though, I wouldn't be too worried.

 

If the Twins are only looking for 3 days of bench duty then why bring up Arcia? Herrmann and Benson seem like the obvious choices. Both have already started their service clocks. Herrmann is already riding the pine at Rochester. What is the benefit to bringing Arcia up for only 3 days?

[gunnarthor]

If the Twins are only looking for 3 days of bench duty then why bring up Arcia? Herrmann and Benson seem like the obvious choices. Both have already started their service clocks. Herrmann is already riding the pine at Rochester. What is the benefit to bringing Arcia up for only 3 days?

 

Neither is playing well. Why should they promote them for 3 days? Arcia is going to be promoted at some point this year - after they trade Willingham or in Sept - so 3 days here isn't a big deal.

 

Complaining about this move seems to me just an example of complaining just to be contradictory.

[ashbury]

If the Twins are only looking for 3 days of bench duty then why bring up Arcia? Herrmann and Benson seem like the obvious choices. Both have already started their service clocks. Herrmann is already riding the pine at Rochester. What is the benefit to bringing Arcia up for only 3 days?

 

Conversely what is the harm? Once he's on the 40-man, you have to burn an option each year to keep him off the major league roster, so bringing him up and sending him down doesn't affect that. And his actual major league service time only accrues while he is up. Unless the plan was to not bring him up at all this season, or only for September, the arbitration clock should not be affected very much.

[Oxtung]

Neither is playing well. Why should they promote them for 3 days? Arcia is going to be promoted at some point this year - after they trade Willingham or in Sept - so 3 days here isn't a big deal.

 

Complaining about this move seems to me just an example of complaining just to be contradictory.

 

Conversely what is the harm? Once he's on the 40-man, you have to burn an option each year to keep him off the major league roster, so bringing him up and sending him down doesn't affect that. And his actual major league service time only accrues while he is up. Unless the plan was to not bring him up at all this season, or only for September, the arbitration clock should not be affected very much.

 

 

You both are arguing the same point essentially so I'll reply to both of you.

 

There is potentially a big drawback to bringing him up and that is you start his service clock. Injury is a very real and present part of baseball. Kubel, Joe Benson, Mauer, Span, Morneau, etc.. have all lost major playing time because of injuries. If Arcia comes up for this 3 days then goes back down then gets hurt (or just goes into a slump) and doesn't make it back to the Twins this year you're still using a year of service time. That is a very real possiblity.

 

So what do you gain for that risk? 3 days of what will essentially be bench duty. There is no need to start him, all 3 starting OF's are healthy and you even have Mastroianni available.

 

To me that risk-reward tradoff isn't worth it. Not when there are other options available that don't carry any of the risk. Assuming this is only a 3 day stretch until Ramirez gets back I see nothing good that can come out of this move.

 

Now, if this is a legitimate look to replace Hicks, Parmelee or Willingham and Arcia is going to get an extended chance to show what he can do I have no problems with it. But for 3 days it seems to add little value for a substantial risk.

[Brock Beauchamp]

If the Twins are only looking for 3 days of bench duty then why bring up Arcia?

 

And that's why I don't think the Twins are looking for three days of bench duty. It doesn't make sense to put Oswaldo in the mix in such a useless gesture.

 

I think there's a good chance we see Arcia stay up and Hicks go down.

[Seth Stohs]

I think that's the most probable scenario. Also, I wouldn't blame them for not wanting him to be learning a new position when he's trying to adjust to big league pitching.

 

But I still hope they think out of the box a little on this one. If he can play center field - and that's a fairly easy thing to find out - then I'd love to give him a trial there at this level. Otherwise, his path is blocked barring trade or injury.

 

CF isn't really learning a new position. He's played CF. He knows how to play the position. CF is the easiest of the three positions. The only reason he hasn't played there a lot in pro ball isn't because he can't, it's because he doesn't have the speed/range that guys like Hicks, Benson, Mastroianni, Morales, etc., have.

 

If they're will to have him play CF in between Willingham and Parmelee for the short-term, he'll make the plays he gets to. No worries about that.

[Mike Sixel]

I fail to see how bringing up some hope is bad for the team. If he is ready, great. If not, he goes back down.

[cmathewson]

CF isn't really learning a new position. He's played CF. He knows how to play the position. CF is the easiest of the three positions. The only reason he hasn't played there a lot in pro ball isn't because he can't, it's because he doesn't have the speed/range that guys like Hicks, Benson, Mastroianni, Morales, etc., have.

 

If they're will to have him play CF in between Willingham and Parmelee for the short-term, he'll make the plays he gets to. No worries about that.

 

He'll produce more runs than he'll give up relative to Hicks if they just put him in CF. At this point, the production would not be that hard. I'd like to see him play out there at least one game during the next series, just to see what kind of jumps he gets on balls before I say he's better, all things considered.

[Rick Blaine]

Maybe he plays left field and Willingham becomes full time DH with Doumit provides the pop off the bench?

[mudcat14]

Bottom line. With a five game skid and almost zero offensive production from CF or the entire line-up in general, something's gotta happen to shake things up. Ozzie is absolutely raking, and is only two weeks removed from the watchful eyes of our entire evaluation staff. Granted he was in the minor league camp, but they still were watching him daily and have a very good idea how he's swinging it. I'll be shocked if he's only around for three days. I'm convinced the idea is to give him AB's and let him run with them.

[snepp]

There is potentially a big drawback to bringing him up and that is you start his service clock. Injury is a very real and present part of baseball. Kubel, Joe Benson, Mauer, Span, Morneau, etc.. have all lost major playing time because of injuries. If Arcia comes up for this 3 days then goes back down then gets hurt (or just goes into a slump) and doesn't make it back to the Twins this year you're still using a year of service time. That is a very real possiblity

 

Injury is only a concern if he gets seriously injured while in the majors. Once he's back in the minors, any injuries from that point forward will use the minor league DL and no additional service time would be accrued.

 

I don't understand what you're saying about "not making it back and still using a year of service time." It's been pointed out that it doesn't work that way. The clock doesn't simply start and then just keep running, it stops the instant the player goes back to the minors.

[h2oface]

I hope they give him starts in center and Hicks a rest. It would be even good to see Hicks pinch run....... and see some stolen bases. Something. Anything, but what we are seeing now.

[Thrylos]

There is another twist on this:

 

Bringing up Arcia instead of Benson or anyone else on the current 40-man roster, will bring some rear ends on Target Field seats. I would not doubt that people who were not planning on going to the games against the Angels (the only team with worse record than the Twins in the AL, btw) will go. Maybe up to 1000 a day; that's 3000 people for the 3 days, which translates to about 150K for the Twins (tickets, concessions etc.) Not bad.

[Kwak]

Is there anyone who doesn't believe this team needs good hitters? Or, that the Twins are rebuilding for the future? Or, that there isn't oodles of $$ available in the payroll now and in the future? It should be abundantly clear that the Twins find out who can produce and secure regular playing time for them. Service time is only relevant for armchair GMs. There are more spots available than there are people who can/should fill them. If Arcia belongs--play him.

I also recall several years back that the Twins liked to promote deserving minor leaguers "a taste" not just as a reward but for the experience so when said player truly is promoted (and expected to stay) that he "has some experience" and is less likely to be awed/overwhelmed. Maybe that's the case with Arcia--and maybe they are hoping he can stick and become a regular. In either case, let's hope he knocks the cover off of the ball, stays around for oh 10 years or so, and discussion of service time can be completely forgotten (as it should!).

[IdahoPilgrim]

IMO Willingham should have been in right field starting last year' date=' he's got a good enough arm that he provides value out there. Parmelee has looked adequate enough though that he's not hurting you. At this point they're not moving Willingham from left though.

 

[/quote']

 

They signed him to be their right fielder. Apparently, though, Willingham indicated that he wasn't comfortable with the position and wanted to stay in left. That's why the Twins had to scramble to put someone in RF last year.

[ashbury]

Hey. Doumit and Hicks combined are batting .218. How can it hurt to have Arcia fill in for either one of them?

 

Add in Dozier's .161 and you have a very respectable .379.

[LaBombo]

Service time is only relevant for armchair GMs... ...service time can be completely forgotten (as it should!)

Thank goodness you're right, or we may have been deprived of Hicksie's 3rd-worst 30 at bat MLB-debut batting average since 1900 (tip o' the cap to oxtung).

 

Now you just need to convince the GMs, players, owners and agents who clearly disagree. Maybe you could call them armchair GMs too; that's what really got me on board.

[clutterheart]

Thanks for the memories Justin

[diehardtwinsfan]

So to qualify as a 'Super 2' or whatever the term is, he would have to stay up the rest of the this season plus the next two to qualify for arbitration?

 

Yes. He would be just shy of 3 seasons and would subsequently be a super 2. If they wanted to play the arb game, he'd get called up a bit closer to June. At that point, they'd get approximately 3.5 arb free seasons out of him with 3 arb seasons.

[jorgenswest]

I think that's the most probable scenario. Also, I wouldn't blame them for not wanting him to be learning a new position when he's trying to adjust to big league pitching.

 

But I still hope they think out of the box a little on this one. If he can play center field - and that's a fairly easy thing to find out - then I'd love to give him a trial there at this level. Otherwise, his path is blocked barring trade or injury.

 

Find out?

 

They should already know. Like most good prospects, the Twins started him in the most demanding defensive position possible in the low minors. He started as a CF and was moved to a corner. They found out.