Twins Acquire RHP Sonny Gray from Reds for Chase Petty

[a-wan]

3 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I never said that. Not once. Nor implied it. 

Sorry, it is exhausting keeping track of what has annoyed you. 

[Brandon]

Just now, PseudoSABR said:

What? Bundy? They bought low on Bundy, I'm sure they view him less as a placeholder, and more of a cheap gamble.  

But the logic of signing free agents to promote minor league development is creative, if baffling. 

Exactly not exactly a win now move.  

[twins_89]

I think the value is really good for the Twins, but I'm now very confused on the team's direction. Every move (or more accurately lack of moves) up to this point has been in the direction of the team not competing this year, so this is out of step with the rest of the off-season. By itself this doesn't get the starting rotation up to playoff caliber, so I'll be curious if there is a follow-up move to add another good starter.

[Sielk]

3 minutes ago, Sielk said:

I am honestly surprised to see so many negative reactions to this trade. Everyone wanted pitching, after all.

Yes, Petty is a very good prospect but he is also not even 19 years old and this farm system has a TON of RHPs. Anytime you trade away a prospect there is a chance that he could become something. There is also a decent chance Petty is a bust and the Twins get Sonny Gray for free.

You gotta give up something in a trade and I would rather give up Petty than someone like Winder who will probably help the Twins a lot in the near future. 

I like this one much better than the Garver trade!

Also, to give up just one single prospect when the Twins have 7-8 other SP prospects that are roughly the same tier as Petty? That's dealing from a position of strength and I would do that anytime. 

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, twins_89 said:

I think the value is really good for the Twins, but I'm now very confused on the team's direction. Every move (or more accurately lack of moves) up to this point has been in the direction of the team not competing this season, so this is out of step with the rest of the off-season. By itself this doesn't get the starting rotation up to playoff caliber, so I'll be curious if there is a follow-up move to add another good starter.

Agreed . If they are serious about this year, they need more. 

[jmlease1]

2 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

This makes the trade yesterday make more sense. Apparently they are trying to win? The Bundy signing makes less and less sense though. 

Twins clearly think he's capable/ready to have a bounceback year, and at the very least hold down the fort until some of the younger guys are ready. (Or maybe he's a "get by" kind of guy until Maeda is ready to be back and the option is just hedging their bets in case he really jumps back into form?)

Gray is a good fit for this team, though. He's used to pitching at the front of a rotation and you have to like how his K's have sat for the last three years. The only question I have about him is how deep in games he can still get and whether we're at risk of overtaxing our bullpen. But he's certainly a quality pitcher who improves the rotation greatly. Hope we hear about adding back Big Mike next!

[Brandon]

1 minute ago, twins_89 said:

I think the value is really good for the Twins, but I'm now very confused on the team's direction. Every move (or more accurately lack of moves) up to this point has been in the direction of the team not competing this season, so this is out of step with the rest of the off-season. By itself this doesn't get the starting rotation up to playoff caliber, so I'll be curious if there is a follow-up move to add another good starter.

The Twins were rumored to be in on Jonny Cueto

[Linus]

Don’t get it. Could have addressed this for money in free agency. Plus this still doesn’t make them a contender. 

[Mike Sixel]

2 minutes ago, a-wan said:

Sorry, it is exhausting keeping track of what has annoyed you. 

In not sure what this means? I said not doing anything in free agency indicated to me they weren't going for it this year. That they were playing for the future. Lots of other here have said the same thing. No one said they saved money for future years. 

[Doc Munson]

This is a heart vs mind trade... my heart HATES IT!!!  my mind can justify it.

Prospects are suspects until proven otherwise., especially HS pitchers, but still... DANG!!!

I would be more of a fan if this was the move that would put us over the top vs just getting a SP when we need 2-3 of them.  I would be much more in favor if this was part of a bigger trade that would also get us Luis Castillo.

[PseudoSABR]

1 minute ago, Brandon said:

The Twins were rumored to be in on Jonny Cueto

Cueto AND Pineda, and we've got a semblance of a staff.

[Don't Feed the Greed Guy]

I saw Chase Petty pitch in a scrimmage at Hammond Stadium on Thursday. He was impressive, especially his secondary stuff. Petty is known for his big 100mph fastball, but he was striking out guys (Severino & Tatum) and drawing weak contact on sliders andchange-ups. I was looking forward to watching him blossom into a top-of-the-rotation starter. This one could haunt.

[Minderbinder]

Twins FO can't win.  Yesterday, they traded the present for the future.  Bad.  Today, they traded the future for the present.  Bad.

Standing pat after -16 last year is literally a non-starter.  Let's have a chuckle, look in the mirror and move on.

[Karbo]

16 minutes ago, Doctor Gast said:

Probably my 6th choice, we should have done much better. A good deal but at this point I wouldn't think about extending Gray, where my other choices I would.

Too early to talk about extension. Good start IMHO

[a-wan]

2 minutes ago, PseudoSABR said:

Cueto AND Pineda, and we've got a semblance of a staff.

But think of the children and how long the games will be!?

[Johnny Ringo]

It feels like two guys are in the cockpit and they keep wrestling the controls away from one another. 

If I could say only one thing to Falvey it would be "with 12 team playoffs and residing in the worst division in baseball, there is no reason not to try to compete in 2022." 

[Vanimal46]

My immediate reaction is I love it. Much, much better than the trade yesterday. Keep it up!

[TopGunn#22]

Baseball Trade values has Gray listed at a value of 28.3.  Peguero, the other pitcher acquired is only .10.  Petty on the other hand has a listed value of 4.80.  The Twins CRUSHED this trade.  Look, I hate to see Petty go.  He was an intriguing prospect.  But he's YEARS away.  For this season and next at a minimum Sonny Gray is a GREAT addition.  I agree with those who are disappointed we didn't add someone like Bassitt.  But when you STEAL Gray away from the Reds like the Twins did here, you can package something to Oakland for Montas.  Players in play for that type of move would include:  Arraez, Larnach, Lewis, Martin, some of our young pitchers.  The point is, we have the firepower, should we choose to use it, to acquire a SP like Montas to pair with Gray at the top of our rotation and certainly compete for a playoff spot.  Let's hope there is more to come.  

[tony&rodney]

12 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

Add Story for SS, 3 or 4 good relievers, and we're on to something here.

Sort of funny in light of adding IK-F yesterday, but I was a big fan of adding Story and Starling Marte back in November.

Now it is time to see the positive in the recent moves and there has just got to be one more big addition to the rotation and perhaps just one relief pitcher. I have thought since last November that the actual budget would be below $120 million, but if it goes higher a left fielder would be nice too.

[Brandon]

I forget we are probably competing for that 12th playoff seat. Anything can happen in the playoffs.  You just gotta believe.

[whosafraidofluigirussolo]

29 minutes ago, Brandon said:

This move is a head scratcher in that this is the first win now move they made all offseason.  All of the other moves  said this is a transition year.  We could have had Bassit for so much ch less

Even having said that the Twins easily could've afforded the kind of value the Mets gave in the Bassitt trade, I don't think they really gave up more here.

Getting Gray and IKF in two days without giving up any high-minors pitching seems to indicate that they're trying to be relevant for 2022 but also ramping up for the next few seasons.

[jmlease1]

11 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

This gives the Twins one quality MLB starter. Four to go.

 

Add Story for SS, 3 or 4 good relievers, and we're on to something here.

Ober & Ryan aren't quality? Guess we should never bother developing prospects.

and the bullpen needs maybe 1-2 guys, not 3-4. Rogers, Alcala, Duffey, and Thielbar are quality by any reasonable standard and Cotton & Garza Jr are decent veteran options to start a season. Add 1 RHP option and let guys compete for the last spot and you're there.

But this is about Gray, who is a great fit for the Twins with a very affordable option for next season if he continues to pitch well.

[Brock Beauchamp]

28 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

Very interesting. While I liked Petty as a prospect, he was 3 years away, minimum...and high school pitchers have a rough track record.

Exactly. Let's put this into context a little... Petty's 50th percentile outcome is a decent reliever and he has a near-zero chance of seeing a Twins uniform before the 2025 season.

So yeah, I'll trade that for two years of Sonny Gray all day, every day.

Now go get Pineda.

[gunnarthor]

Wow, two days in a row of me defending this FO. I really liked this move. Obviously, Petty could turn into a HOF and burn us for generations but that's probably unlikely. But the FO is playing to win and not for the future. Good for them.

The Twins have a strong offense. Adding IKF improved our up the middle defense. And as soon as that's done, the FO goes out and gets a solid starter who is also a ground ball pitcher. Makes sense. They aren't done but they are obviously not throwing in the towel on this year which makes me very happy. The staff still needs upgrades but they are making the right moves, IMO. 

[Chachi]

I get that there is a bit of flotsam on the 40 man roster - but +3 and -1 over the weekend means two spots needed?  Does a pause on the rule 5 draft work in the Twins favor in this case?

[se7799]

28 minutes ago, Sielk said:

I am honestly surprised to see so many negative reactions to this trade. Everyone wanted pitching, after all.

Yes, Petty is a very good prospect but he is also not even 19 years old and this farm system has a TON of RHPs. Anytime you trade away a prospect there is a chance that he could become something. There is also a decent chance Petty is a bust and the Twins get Sonny Gray for free.

You gotta give up something in a trade and I would rather give up Petty than someone like Winder who will probably help the Twins a lot in the near future. 

I like this one much better than the Garver trade!

I agree, I don't understand the angst of training a #26 overall pick years away from a mlb shot for an established controlled top 30 pitcher in baseball.  I feel Jay's gave up much more for Berrios.  Well done.

[twinsfaninsaudi]

I don’t like the move. Good for 2022 sure and might not be bad in the long run. But the problem is the Twins should be going into full on rebuild mode. This is the move of a FO that is insecure it won’t be around in two years or even one. Falvey and Levine don’t have the equity with the organization and fan base to go into a rebuild mode because their failings are the reason it’s needed. Thus a move like this done in desperation to “compete” this year. A competitive pitching staff is not going to be built here in 3 weeks, and the FO is making moves in hopes of saving their own jobs in the short term. These things never end well and are part of the cycles of organizations that spend full generations in the league’s doldrums 

[DJL44]

26 minutes ago, Sielk said:

Also, to give up just one single prospect when the Twins have 7-8 other SP prospects that are roughly the same tier as Petty? That's dealing from a position of strength and I would do that anytime. 

There is a non-zero chance Peguero has a better career than Petty.

[Bradfoot]

If the Twins are not in the playoff chase this year, will Sonny Gray survive the trade deadline?  With that option year they can abort this deal pretty easily and still get a good return.

 

That seems to be the Twins mentality this offseason, make a soft run at a turnaround with an ability to do another small-scale selloff at the deadline if it fails.

[gunnarthor]

Just now, twinsfaninsaudi said:

I don’t like the move. Good for 2022 sure and might not be bad in the long run. But the problem is the Twins should be going into full on rebuild mode. This is the move of a FO that is insecure it won’t be around in two years or even one. Falvey and Levine don’t have the equity with the organization and fan base to go into a rebuild mode because their failings are the reason it’s needed. Thus a move like this done in desperation to “compete” this year. A competitive pitching staff is not going to be built here in 3 weeks, and the FO is making moves in hopes of saving their own jobs in the short term. These things never end well and are part of the cycles of organizations that spend full generations in the league’s doldrums 

I disagree. Our core - Buxton, Kepler, Polanco, Sano, Donaldson, even Larnich, Arreaz and Jeffers are 25 or older. They are in "win-now" territory. It's the FO's job to keep this window open and add to it. They are doing that. I'm still worried about the pitching but a staff of Gray, Ryan, Bundy is a start. I'm sure they'll add more.