Simmons has visa issues

[Squirrel]

i fail to see why we shouldn't expect a player who is making 10.5 million dollars a year to show up on time and be mentally and physically ready to train and perform at their highest possible level.

Because it is the EMPLOYER who is responsible for the paperwork, not the player.

 

Please reread this response.

This is a total misconception. 1) A work Visa is requested by the employer. The employee only shows up at the consulate to be interviewed and get the papers signed by the consul. 2) The decision to authorize the Visa is up to the Consul. You could have everything right but the Consul may decide to take his time and you can't do anything about it. I know this things because I am an immigrant, so they are part of my living experience.

[Channing1964]

Because it is the EMPLOYER who is responsible for the paperwork, not the player.

Please reread this response.

AWESOME! So since we cant blame Falvey or Levine for any of this or Simmons obviously, who should we blame? Dustin Morse? Pohlad? Pohlad's secretary? Somebody should be held accountable. It's pretty sad that even Sano could be on time and Simmons couldn't.

[Squirrel]

 

AWESOME! So since we cant blame Falvey or Levine for any of this or Simmons obviously, who should we blame? Dustin Morse? Pohlad? Pohlad's secretary? Somebody should be held accountable. It's pretty sad that even Sano could be on time and Simmons couldn't.

How about it's no one's fault? That this is just how it goes with getting paperwork in and having consuls approve it. In the case of the former, late signings have an impact on visa paperwork, and the latter is just out of everyone's control. Please reread some of the posts above and try to comprehend instead of instantly trying to blame anyone. Sometimes this is just how it works and every year, every team has something like this happen for a number of reasons that isn't a player being willfully unprofessional toward their work. The comparison to Sano ... there just isn't a comparison ... Sano has a contract with the Twins, he knew before last season ended where he was going to be come February. Simmons wasn't even signed until Jan. 31. Work visa paperwork needs to get processed, the team does that, then it goes through an approval process with the consul in whatever country. This is just business as usual and isn't anyone's fault.

[Channing1964]

How about it's no one's fault? That this is just how it goes with getting paperwork in and having consuls approve it. In the case of the former, late signings have an impact on visa paperwork, and the latter is just out of everyone's control. Please reread some of the posts above and try to comprehend instead of instantly trying to blame anyone. Sometimes this is just how it works and every year, every team has something like this happen for a number of reasons that isn't a player being willfully unprofessional toward their work. The comparison to Sano ... there just isn't a comparison ... Sano has a contract with the Twins, he knew before last season ended where he was going to be come February. Simmons wasn't even signed until Jan. 31. Work visa paperwork needs to get processed, the team does that, then it goes through an approval process with the consul in whatever country. This is just business as usual and isn't anyone's fault.

how is it any different? Both of them are starting position players on a contending Manor League Baseball team. They are both from foreign countries. Is one more of a team leader than another one? I highly doubt it. Why shouldn't we expect both of them to show up on time ready to Rock it? I do not see the logic.

[davesaxton]

 

how is it any different? Both of them are starting position players on a contending Manor League Baseball team. They are both from foreign countries. Is one more of a team leader than another one? I highly doubt it. Why shouldn't we expect both of them to show up on time ready to Rock it? I do not see the logic.

Because Sano's visa was done long before camp started because he HAD a contract. therefore, the process can be started earlier to ensure that there are no issues. In the case of Simmons, he didn't have a contract and therefore no employer until Jan 31. which means that the paperwork couldn't be started until Feb 1. You forget that the visa process is still a bureaucratic mess and multiple people and agencies have to touch it before it gets approved. MLB players don't get special treatment. they are thrown in the stack with everyone else. first come first serve. 

 

To insinuate that a visa issue says anything about a players willingness or devotion to the team that they are playing for is nonsense. Especially with zero proof that it is anything more than a typical delay due to timelines and process. 

[Squirrel]

how is it any different? Both of them are starting position players on a contending Manor League Baseball team. They are both from foreign countries. Is one more of a team leader than another one? I highly doubt it. Why shouldn't we expect both of them to show up on time ready to Rock it? I do not see the logic.

Because Sano was already on the team and Simmons wasn’t signed until Jan. 31. Applying for a work visa is a process and the Twins couldn’t start that with Simmons until his signing was official. Having worked in a foreign country, I know this process. My employer did all the filing. In Simmons’ case he was given a couple of weeks. It just doesn’t go faster because you need it done quickly. There is no one to blame here and you seem to be trying hard to knock Simmons for something that is not his fault. If you want to blame anyone, blame the process.

[terrydactyls]

Maybe capital letters will help some people understand.

 

YOU CAN'T APPLY FOR A WORK VISA IF YOU DO NOT HAVE AN EMPLOYER!!!

 

Does everyone understand?

[IndianaTwin]

To clarify:

1. Applying for a Visa is something that INDIVIDUALS do in order to by things on credit, much like as with a MasterCard, and it can typically be done very quickly. 

2. Applying for a visa is something that EMPLOYERS do to enable people from other countries to work in the United States, and can vary greatly in the amount of time it takes. 

 

So, here’s a story idea for a TD writer, though perhaps at a slower time of year in their work activities. I’m assuming that someone in the Twins organization carries responsibilities for the process. How about an interview with that person? How does the process work? How soon are they typically working at it after one season ends and the next season starts? Do they have to restart the process if a player is waived by one team and picked up by another? Can the visa applied for by one team be transferred to another team? What happens with mid-season trades? Common obstacles they run into? “Visa issues” is a common enough, and apparently misunderstood, issue, and it could be helpful for many of us to get a primer.

 

Call me a geek (actually, please don’t — people around me do it enough), but I’d find this interesting. I’d also find it interesting to hear about some of the other uniquenesses of the employer/employee relationship as it applies to a baseball player. For example, it’s tax season. Are they filing a dozen different state tax returns to cover the different states they’ve worked in? Are minor leaguers having to deal with the same issue, which would seem like a real pain given the amounts they get paid? 

 

 

[davesaxton]

 

I can answer the tax question. The answer is yes, professional athletes file multiple state tax returns. The players salary is typically considered to be 162 “game checks“, each of which is earned in the city in which the game occurs. For example, when a team comes to California and plays three games in LA and three and Oakland, they have now earned six game checks in the state of California and pay California state income tax on those earnings. That’s basically true of every stateIn which they play. Same for professional entertainers like touring musicians. It is not at all unusual for a professional athlete to file 20 or 30 state tax returns each year. They also file a city tax return in New York because New York has a city income tax for amounts are in within the city..

This is why places that have no state income tax are always attractive to athletes. Even if the team they are playing for is not always the best. playing 81 games a year in a tax free state means there is a lot of extra money in a contract. 2/20 in Minnesota doesn't pay as well as a 2/20 in Florida.

[Squirrel]

Okay ... now we’ve taken a right turn away from the topic. If you want to get into the details of taxes, that would be a good topic for another thread.

[Danchat]

 

 

Jurickson Profar reported to the Padres spring training facility on Saturday.

The Curacao native was among a substantial group of international players experiencing similar delays reporting to spring training facilities as global travel remains complicated due to the ongoing pandemic.

Simmons should be getting here pretty soon.

[ashbury]

Simmons should be getting here pretty soon.

He signed 4 days after Profar, so that sets my expectation.

 

[sampleSizeOfOne]

 

He signed 4 days after Profar, so that sets my expectation.
 

If Profar arrived today... We can expect Simmons round about Tuesday?

[biggentleben]

 

The other thing is he is going to Florida this year. Other years he has entered in to Arizona. Maybe it took him a while to redo his paperwork.

Braves trained in Florida all the years he was a Brave.

[ashbury]

If Profar arrived today... We can expect Simmons round about Tuesday?

I don't know how weekends factor into the calculation, but... yes? Maybe?

 

[biggentleben]

Also, Simmons was one of my favorite players to cover as a Brave. Not just is he easily the best shortstop defender I've seen play the game (and that's not hyperbole), he has more fun playing the game and more passion for the game than 90% or better of players that play the game for a living. If he could be in Florida playing, he would be.

[theJemmer]

I used to have exactly your opinion on this - but mine has evolved over time to "I would need more information in order to pass judgement". The reason for this is simply that each country has their own set of protocols and government agencies (could be > 1) involved in these processes that can greatly impact the situation. The variability between countries and agencies within countries likely varies immensely.

 

I'm guessing that the efficiency of certain government agencies in the small Caribean nations isn't always best in class. Don't forget that someone may need to "grease the wheels" as well with the right people...

 

My daughter got a job working in an advanced European country working as a teacher. The school told her not to worry about getting a work visa - just come on over and we'll get it when you are here - no big deal. She was there 2 years and never got it. And believe me, it was not for lack of trying. 

 

"We need your college transcript" - ok - got it - emailed it over.  

   "No, we need a stamped, certified one from the college" - ok - got one, took several weeks

   "Well, now we need a letter signed by the head of the  college department"  - ok - more weeks

We relied on people that knew the process - and it was one headache and delay after another.

 

Moral of my story is - if a government agency is involved - it may be far from straightforward.  

 

But these situations are always SO frustrating.

   

 

Are these "Visa issues" in pro sports more about the maturity and accountability of the players?

It's not like the actual dates of Spring Training were just established and finalized.

It's not like the fact that  a Visa is required to enter the USA was just invented out of thin air.

The players have a signed contract to perform their jobs and getting in to the USA is a part of that contract.

If nothing else, the player's agent should be "babysitting" the players to ensure that all necessary paperwork to secure a Visa has been submitted and processed in a timely manner that allows the player to report to Spring Training when it is to begin.  In fact, a player who is joining a new team should have extra desire to arrive at Spring Training EARLY to: forge a comradery with their new teammates, establish relationships with a new coaching staff, and to get situated and familiar with a new Spring Training site.

This continual, annual "Visa Issue" situation speaks to the lack of a player's maturity, motivation, desire and commitment.  Each and every time this delay takes place should give organizations pause out of concern for the player's motivation..  

 

[ashbury]

Yeah, I'm definitely regretting my initial snark about veteran ballplayers arriving late to camp. I forgot how the visa process works when changing teams.

[sampleSizeOfOne]

Thanks theJemmer for your insight into the Visa process.

 

The closest i've come to this i think is hearing complaints from a friend running a small start up i worked for a while back complaining that they couldn't hire who they wanted because they couldn't get the work visa approved (it might have even been re-hire who they wanted)

[raindog]

I suppose athletes shouldn’t get preferential treatment when it comes to visas, but it’s surprising they don’t. Especially established ones. 

[bighat]

 

Correct. Got caught with weed at customs and basically got blackballed from entering the country after that. This has been reported by reliable sources, not just amjgt on Twins Daily

Wow. Dude could have just waited until they visited Chicago to play the White Sox and enjoyed a legal toke in the Windy City. That was really, really unwise.

[flpmagikat]

 

how is it any different? Both of them are starting position players on a contending Manor League Baseball team. They are both from foreign countries. Is one more of a team leader than another one? I highly doubt it. Why shouldn't we expect both of them to show up on time ready to Rock it? I do not see the logic.

 

You do realize people can't just come to the us and work whenever they feel like it(legally), just as you or I couldn't just hop on a flight and start working in curacao if some baseball team signed us to play ss for them tomorrow.

[Jacksson]

Thanks all for the education on obtaining a visa to the USA.

Somebody in the EMPLOYERS office needs to become aware

Of how the application when submitted with some extra financial lubrication

Can be made to swiftly slide through the approval process.

[Squirrel]

Thanks all for the education on obtaining a visa to the USA.

Somebody in the EMPLOYERS office needs to become aware

Of how the application when submitted with some extra financial lubrication

Can be made to swiftly slide through the approval process.

Are you suggesting the Twins bribe a customs/immigration official?

[woolywoolhouse]

 

Are you suggesting the Twins bribe a customs/immigration official?

 

Don't give the "Pohlads are so cheap" crowd any more ammunition. "If the Pohalds actually loosened the purse strings and slipped a couple K to Immigration, we'd have the World Series wrapped up by the All-Star Game!"

[Channing1964]

You do realize people can't just come to the us and work whenever they feel like it(legally), just as you or I couldn't just hop on a flight and start working in curacao if some baseball team signed us to play ss for them tomorrow.

No I don't. I have never tried to do that. The point of the issue is why shouldn't we expect all our players to show up for work on time. In Simmons case, this is his what, 7th or 8th major league spring training? He has played for Atlanta, the Angels, and now us. You would think he could foresee any visa problems by now. Are we supposed to just say "Oh my God Simba we are so glad you finally made it?" I dont know what happened, nor do i care. He is now what, a week late? Try that at your job and see what happens.

[Squirrel]

 

No I don't. I have never tried to do that. The point of the issue is why shouldn't we expect all our players to show up for work on time. In Simmons case, this is his what, 7th or 8th major league spring training? He has played for Atlanta, the Angels, and now us. You would think he could foresee any visa problems by now. Are we supposed to just say "Oh my God Simba we are so glad you finally made it?" I dont know what happened, nor do i care. He is now what, a week late? Try that at your job and see what happens.

 

Once again ... this is NOT his fault. He doesn't apply for the visa, the employer does. There is nothing he can do to change the process or speed up the process, because the employer cannot file the necessary paperwork until the signing is official. And he was signed late ... that has a great effect on the timing of getting this done on time. It's obvious you really don't get it and continue to want to blame Simmons who is blameless. Just stop now.
 

[Channing1964]

Once again ... this is NOT his fault. He doesn't apply for the visa, the employer does. There is nothing he can do to change the process or speed up the process, because the employer cannot file the necessary paperwork until the signing is official. And he was signed late ... that has a great effect on the timing of getting this done on time. It's obvious you really don't get it and continue to want to blame Simmons who is blameless. Just stop now.

 

how do we even know who's fault it is?

[flpmagikat]

 

No I don't. I have never tried to do that. The point of the issue is why shouldn't we expect all our players to show up for work on time. In Simmons case, this is his what, 7th or 8th major league spring training? He has played for Atlanta, the Angels, and now us. You would think he could foresee any visa problems by now. Are we supposed to just say "Oh my God Simba we are so glad you finally made it?" I dont know what happened, nor do i care. He is now what, a week late? Try that at your job and see what happens.

 

The problem is its not as simple as just booking a flight and showing up. He literally can't leave his country until his government approves his visa and lets him go. And as others have mentioned, that is something that is almost entirely handled by his employer(the twins) and his government. 

 

Something I did not at all realize until I started moving around and met a number of friends from different countries...its really f-ing hard for people to travel in most of the world. We are crazy fortunate that(until covid at least), our passports can get us in almost anywhere and in a lot of cases make it easier to get a work visa. I have a number of friends from Argentina and some of the balkan states, and they were able to get visas that allowed them to work for a certain period of time in the us. When I asked why their family doesn't visit, they explained that basically, those countries don't want their citizens leaving, and traveling to the United States is something they consider to be very risky. So, maybe cut the guys from out of country a little slack. They really don't have any control over it. If they got the visa and just didn't show on time, that would be considerably worse for them, as most likely they would have those visa privileges permanently revoked. 

 

I agree with someone earlier in the thread who said that to us, it seems like ball players should be able to expedite the process and not deal with the issues us regular people do. But that isn't the case.

[flpmagikat]

 

how do we even know who's fault it is?

 

It's not any persons fault I don't believe. It's bureaucracy's fault, if you need to blame something.