Scott Baker Signs with Chicago Cubs

[twinscowboysbulls]

Honest question, is Terry Ryan doing anything right now to improve this team? My impression is that he is just scanning the waiver wire looking for the next marque player. I get it folks, it's early in the offseason, but let's face the facts Terry Ryan, we have lost 90+ games 2 straight years now, MAKE SOME FRICKIN WAVES already.

[TheLeviathan]

Well hopefully this ends the insane speculation that you can go out and sign 3 good starters in the offseason to magically become a contender.

[ThePuck]

Well hopefully this ends the insane speculation that you can go out and sign 3 good starters in the offseason to magically become a contender.

 

while doing it on the cheap as well...

[Rick Blaine]

 

i read this as scott baker believes he has a better chance in 2013 to go to the playoffs with the cubs then with the twins, you see a patteren? nathan cuddy,kubel,thome,baker....the home town heros are bailing on this sinking ship.....

It's no surprise that you would "read" Baker not signing with the Twins as part of the narrative you continue to promote: that Twins are awful. No one's surprised or impressed with your "reading." Baker probably went after the money. If he was concerned about winning, he'd have signed somewhere other than with the Cubs. Obviously.

 

You never know---Maybe the Cubs will rise from the dust! I think Cuddyer wanted to win and left the Twins to do that. Look how well that worked out for him! It's almost always about the money.

[Kwak]

He spent a lot of money and had a great manager. Not saying he didn't do a good job, but he isn't some sort of wizard. I've held on to my doubts about him turning the Cubs around.

 

Rubbish. He competed in a division where you win 95 games and cross your fingers for a wildcard berth, and won his second World Series at age 33.

 

 

I don't care how good he is. It's still the Cubs. You pretty much have to be a wizard to make that team decent

 

Weren't the Cubs within 1 out (the famous foul popfly) of making it to the WS in 2003? A good deal closer than the Twins have been to the WS during Ryan's tenure.

[diehardtwinsfan]

This tells me that Theo is willing to gamble a million or so more for a draft pick. I'm surprised Baker got 5.5. I figured it would be closer to 3, maybe 4 + incentives. Theo has the ability to trade Baker if he's really strong come the deadline or he can give him a QO which will get turned down if Baker is anything like his old self come August/September. It isn't a bad move.

[Kwak]

I would have liked for Baker to re-sign with the Twins, but this a business for both parties--I wish him well. I am forming the opinion that the FO underestimated the difficulty/expense of three starting pitchers. The emergence of a "new" LA Dodgers only bodes to drive player salaries even higher in the near future. I fear the Twins will have to re-examine their goal of three new SPs and spend their entire (for the three) on one new SP just to ensure that somebody new (and decent) signs for 2013. Others have posted about trades, especially established ML Twins for MiL prospect(s), and Yes, I must agree with them. I fully expect 2013 season to be a rough one as the Twins will likely only be able to incrementally improve through acquisitions.

[PseudoSABR]

Well hopefully this ends the insane speculation that you can go out and sign 3 good starters in the offseason to magically become a contender.

Well, if that insanity included Baker as one of the "good" three starters....

[TheLeviathan]

Well, if that insanity included Baker as one of the "good" three starters....

 

Missed the point bud. Most of this thread is saying "I can't believe they paid him that!" Welcome to free agency. Hence why the idea of solving this team's pitching woes there was ridiculous from the start.

[glunn]

I'm optimistic for 2014, 2015 time frame with the young guys coming up...

 

I'm just not sold on the Twins (meaning ownership, the FO and so on) being interested in putting a true WS contending team together. For the last decade and change, all they've ever seemed interested in is building a team to be competitive within the division....and the couple seasons where they were truly very good (2006 and 2010) were followed up with offseasons not worked to put us over the the hump, but worked to downgrade us because, hey, we were SO good, we can afford to downgrade some while still being competitive in the division.

 

 

Didn't work either time...

 

I agree with this, except I think that it may take until 2016 for enough young pitchers to make it through the system to allow the Twins to compete. I suspect that the Twins will continue to shop the bargain bin of free agents and will need to get very lucky to contend anytime soon.

[twinsnorth49]

Well, if that insanity included Baker as one of the "good" three starters....

 

Missed the point bud. Most of this thread is saying "I can't believe they paid him that!" Welcome to free agency. Hence why the idea of solving this team's pitching woes there was ridiculous from the start.

 

I don't remember anybody saying they were going to solve the pitching woes solely through free agency. Plenty, including Ryan himself have said they will explore every option with trades obviously being their next best option.

 

I'll agree it's going to be a stretch but losing Baker is hardly cause for excessive hand wringing, not to mention the ridiculous condescation.

[gunnarthor]

 

So what you're saying is, you think we have people in our front office smarter than Epstein?

 

What I'm saying is that, given the same resources (and blind eye to PEDs), I think Ryan would have done just as well in Boston.

[twinsnorth49]

 

So what you're saying is, you think we have people in our front office smarter than Epstein?

 

What I'm saying is that, given the same resources (and blind eye to PEDs), I think Ryan would have done just as well in Boston.

..................http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/049.gif

[Mike Sixel]

Um, don't be so sanctimonious on PEDs, this organization has had guys suspended, and when TK was told about them being found in the locker room he brushed it under the table, if I recall the story correctly.

[joeboo_22]

Every organization was blind to PED's in the 90's and early 00's so I don't want to hear that argument on why A organization isn't as good as B organization.

 

Money doesn't help win championships but it sure helps with preventing prolonged bad years. If you have the budget you can have 1-2-3 bad drafts, 1-2-3 bad signings, 1-2-3 bad injuries. If you have money those hurt, if you don't they hurt more and for a longer period.

[TheLeviathan]

I don't remember anybody saying they were going to solve the pitching woes solely through free agency. Plenty, including Ryan himself have said they will explore every option with trades obviously being their next best option.

 

I'll agree it's going to be a stretch but losing Baker is hardly cause for excessive hand wringing, not to mention the ridiculous condescation.

 

This forum is littered with predictions of bringing in Marcum and Jackson. Or signing Dempster "cheap". Nothing comes cheap in FA. Baker got about what you'd expect - 20-30% more than was sane and deserved. Again, welcome to FA.

[jorgenswest]

To earn the contract, Baker needs to produce 1 WAR. In fact according to Parker's recent article, he may not even need to perform that well. I think it is reasonable to think that Baker could produce 2 WAR next season and be worth over 10 million.

 

It is quite possible the Twins will regret not picking up that option. The Twins should have expected that he would sign elsewhere if they did not pick up the option. It will be interesting to see of the 9 million we spend this winter on pitching out performs Baker.

[Guest USAFChief]

It will be interesting to see of the 9 million we spend this winter on pitching out performs Baker.

 

It will be interesting to see if the Twins actually spend 9 million on pitching this winter, period.

[twinsnorth49]

I don't remember anybody saying they were going to solve the pitching woes solely through free agency. Plenty, including Ryan himself have said they will explore every option with trades obviously being their next best option.

 

I'll agree it's going to be a stretch but losing Baker is hardly cause for excessive hand wringing, not to mention the ridiculous condescation.

 

This forum is littered with predictions of bringing in Marcum and Jackson. Or signing Dempster "cheap". Nothing comes cheap in FA. Baker got about what you'd expect - 20-30% more than was sane and deserved. Again, welcome to FA.

 

I didn't say it wasn't littered with those type of predictions and I didn't say anything came cheap. Again, it's not the only avenue any rational person expects to take to solve the pitching woes and there have been many discussions on this forum along those lines.

 

I don't expect the Twins to spend big all of a sudden either but I don't see how not paying Baker 5+ is reason to hang the closed sign on the door just yet.

[Mike Sixel]

It will be interesting to see of the 9 million we spend this winter on pitching out performs Baker.

 

It will be interesting to see if the Twins actually spend 9 million on pitching this winter, period.

 

Ouch.

[TheLeviathan]

I don't expect the Twins to spend big all of a sudden either but I don't see how not paying Baker 5+ is reason to hang the closed sign on the door just yet.

 

I never said close the door on getting anyone. I said close the door on thinking 20M was going to land you 3 pitchers. 5M for Baker isn't that awful and shouldn't have been that shocking. He's a pitcher who has been successful. Quite a bit more successful than most of this fanbase has appreciated. Injury or not that has value.

 

You don't have to take the remark personally, not sure why you feel the need to do so, but the fact is people seem to think that the payroll flexibility the Twins have (if they were to spend all that they are assumed to have) would somehow land them as many as 2 of the top 5-7 pitchers on the market. That was ridiculous then and it should be glaringly obvious how ridiculous it was now.

[Anorthagen]

Obviously theo epistein is working his magic by signing baker, but I think he that he will simply be a trade target by the end of the

trading deadline. Either that or it will be a bust sense baker is now pitching in the NL. But no matter how you look at it he is still going to be a cub for one year. Instead of a twin.

[twinsnorth49]

I don't expect the Twins to spend big all of a sudden either but I don't see how not paying Baker 5+ is reason to hang the closed sign on the door just yet.

 

I never said close the door on getting anyone. I said close the door on thinking 20M was going to land you 3 pitchers. 5M for Baker isn't that awful and shouldn't have been that shocking. He's a pitcher who has been successful. Quite a bit more successful than most of this fanbase has appreciated. Injury or not that has value.

 

You don't have to take the remark personally, not sure why you feel the need to do so, but the fact is people seem to think that the payroll flexibility the Twins have (if they were to spend all that they are assumed to have) would somehow land them as many as 2 of the top 5-7 pitchers on the market. That was ridiculous then and it should be glaringly obvious how ridiculous it was now.

 

I understand your points and I agree with you, I just think that most people here were realistic about which free agents we could afford, sure a few out there posters were claiming 2 of the top 7 was realistic but they were the minority.

 

I think the surprise with Baker is just based in his injury history , not that mediocre pitchers don't get that kind of dough.

 

I don't take anything in this board personally, sorry if I sound that way.

[Riverbrian]

I'd be happy if they got one guy that they really really like in FA. If it takes 20 million so be it... Just one guy... Make him good... Baker for 5 is not that guy in my opinion.

[DaveW]

Hey Rocketpig, pretty weak shutting down the other thread, ever since the Twinsdaily transition you seem to have become a bit of a company man. No offense, but you protecting that douche and encouraging that garbage he spews makes this forum worse.

[TheLeviathan]

I understand your points and I agree with you, I just think that most people here were realistic about which free agents we could afford, sure a few out there posters were claiming 2 of the top 7 was realistic but they were the minority.

 

I think the surprise with Baker is just based in his injury history , not that mediocre pitchers don't get that kind of dough.

 

I don't take anything in this board personally, sorry if I sound that way.

 

The rampant offseason speculation and plans indicate otherwise. I see a Shields-Johnson-Baker, Marcum-Baker-S. Drew-M.Cabrera, Haren-Marcum-Baker-Bedard, Marcum-Bedard-Baker-Youk. And I haven't even finished the first page of the blueprints. And I haven't even cited your average "Hey we should get this guy because he doesn't suck" series of threads.

 

Baker has been better than mediocre. When healthy he's been a bonafide #2 pitcher. 5M isn't a bad risk on a guy like that if giving him guaranteed cash gives your club a good chance to keep him around long-term.

[Guest USAFChief]

I understand your points and I agree with you, I just think that most people here were realistic about which free agents we could afford, sure a few out there posters were claiming 2 of the top 7 was realistic but they were the minority.

 

 

Why is it unrealistic to think the Twins could sign 2 of the top 7 FA starting pitchers on the market?

 

AFAIK, there are no rules against it.

[Dilligaf69]

$5.5M for one-year, plus incentives for a guy who had TJ in April? And no option year?

 

You're welcome to him Theo. Congrats to Scotty's agent. (My guess is you'll be hearing from Colby Lewis shortly.)

 

Agree! If you want that kind of money coming off TJ surgery then you have to give the team an option if things go well, plus I have to think the Twins offer was significantly less. Odd for a rebuilding Cubs team to pay that kind of money for maybe a half season...

[DaveW]

I don't expect the Twins to spend big all of a sudden either but I don't see how not paying Baker 5+ is reason to hang the closed sign on the door just yet.

 

I never said close the door on getting anyone. I said close the door on thinking 20M was going to land you 3 pitchers. 5M for Baker isn't that awful and shouldn't have been that shocking. He's a pitcher who has been successful. Quite a bit more successful than most of this fanbase has appreciated. Injury or not that has value.

 

You don't have to take the remark personally, not sure why you feel the need to do so, but the fact is people seem to think that the payroll flexibility the Twins have (if they were to spend all that they are assumed to have) would somehow land them as many as 2 of the top 5-7 pitchers on the market. That was ridiculous then and it should be glaringly obvious how ridiculous it was now.

 

Yeah, 5 M is not a bad contract at all for a guy like Baker.

[TheLeviathan]

Why is it unrealistic to think the Twins could sign 2 of the top 7 FA starting pitchers on the market?

 

AFAIK, there are no rules against it.

 

Because your belief in what the Twins can and should spend and what they likely and will spend is the difference between realistic and wishful thinking.