Who Are the 5 Best Hitters in Minnesota Twins History?

[Nash Walker]

Any G.O.A.T discussion is difficult when comparing across eras. The ball, game and strategies vary from decade to decade, and even year to year. With this in mind, who are the five best Twins hitters of all time?

 

*All-time Twins rankings are with a minimum of 3,000 plate appearances for the club*

 

My rankings:5. Joe Mauer

Seasons with Minnesota: 15

Batting line: .306/.388/.439

 

Drafted first overall in 2001, Mauer, the hometown kid, had high expectations entering the big leagues. He certainly delivered. From 2004 to 2010, Mauer hit a ridiculous .327/.407/.481 with 81 home runs in 836 games. He won the MVP Award in 2009 after leading baseball in batting average (.365), on-base percentage (.444), slugging percentage (.587), and OPS (1.031). His OPS+ of 171 ranks fourth all-time in Twins history and is tied with Buster Posey for the fourth best season ever by a catcher.

 

Mauer’s patience and hit tool were nearly unforeseen, and especially for a catcher. He finished his career with less than 100 more strikeouts (1,034) than walks (939), and his .388 on-base percentage ranks third behind Rod Carew and Chuck Knoblauch. His final five years are exaggerated because of the massive contract and switch to first base, but Mauer still hit .278/.359/.388 and was an above-average hitter with an OPS+ of 105. Mauer didn’t really get the supporting cast to bring a World Series to Minnesota, but Phil Cuzzi didn’t help either.

 

 

 

4. Tony Oliva

Seasons with Minnesota: 15 (1962-1976)

Batting line: .304/.353/.476

 

“Tony O” spent his entire career with the Twins. Oliva won Rookie of the Year in the Twins’ inaugural season after hitting .323/.359/.557 with 32 homers. Oliva led the league in batting average, hits, runs, doubles, and total bases. He wouldn’t surpass the 30 homer threshold for the rest of his career, but still ranks fourth in Twins history in home runs (220). Oliva won the batting title again in 1964, 1965, and 1971.

 

In his eight year stretch of consecutive All-Star appearances from 1964-1971, Oliva hit .313/.360/.507 with an average OPS+ of 140. He received MVP votes in all eight seasons and ranks just behind Killebrew in offensive WAR among Twins during that span (37.4). A contact king, Oliva walked at just a 6.5% rate and struck out in 9.9% of his plate appearances in his heyday. In 13 postseason games, Oliva hit .314/.340/.588 with 3 homers.

 

 

 

 

 

3. Kirby Puckett

Seasons with Minnesota: 12

Batting line: .318/.360/.477

 

Puck entered the league in 1984 and displayed little to no power. He hit .292/.325/.363 with just four home runs in his first 289 games. In 1986, Kirby burst out with 31 homers and a .903 OPS and was voted into his first of 10 consecutive All-Star Games. From 1987 to 1991, Puckett hit .330/.368/.492 with 88 home runs in 772 games. He was far-and-away the Twins’ leader in offensive WAR (26.1) and RBI (474) during that span.

 

Puckett, while a consistently great hitter, is best known for his postseason heroics. In over 100 playoff plate appearances, Puckett hit .309/.361/.536 with 10 extra-base hits and 16 RBI. Kirby hit .357 to help the Twins secure their first World Series in 1987. On October 6, 1991, Puckett went 3-for-4 in an elimination Game 6 against Atlanta in the World Series. Oh, and he also hit the biggest home run in franchise history in that same game.

 

 

 

 

 

2. Harmon Killebrew

Seasons with Minnesota: 14 (1961-1974)

Batting line: .260/.383/.518

 

Killer’s power was video-game like. He hit over 40 home runs in seven seasons and ranks 12th all-time with 573 in his career. In his first season after the Washington Senators became the Minnesota Twins in 1961, Killebrew hit .288/.405/.606 with 46 home runs. No one in baseball hit more homers during the 1960s than Killer (393).

 

Killebrew owns the 4th highest on-base percentage in Twins history (.383) because of his immense hitting ability and strong 16% walk rate. Killer led the league in walks four times and was intentionally walked more than any Twin ever (152). Killebrew leads Twins history in slugging percentage (.518), OPS (.901), homers (475), and RBI (1,325).

 

In 1969, Killer appeared in all 162 games and hit .276/.427/.584 with 49 home runs. He won the MVP award and barely saw any strikes in an ALCS sweep at the hands of Baltimore. Here are the highest OPS+ seasons in Twins history:

 

1. Rod Carew - 1977 (178)

2. Harmon Killebrew - 1969 (177)

3. Harmon Killebrew - 1967 (173)

4. Joe Mauer - 2009 (171)

5. Nelson Cruz - 2019 (166)

6. Bob Allison - 1964 (163)

7. Harmon Killebrew - 1961 (162)

8. Harmon Killebrew - 1970 (159)

T-9. Harmon Killebrew - 1966 (157)

T-9. Rod Carew - 1975 (157)

 

 

 

1. Rod Carew

Seasons with Minnesota: 12 (1967-1978)

Batting line: .334/.393/.448

 

Rodney Cline won the batting title seven times and hit over .300 in 15 of his 19 seasons. Carew is the Twins’ all-time leader in average (.334), on-base percentage (.393), and offensive WAR (63.8). In his prime from 1972 to 1978, Carew dominated baseball with a .350 average. The 38 point difference between Carew and the second-placed Pete Rose was more than that of Rose and the 20th-ranked Reggie Jackson.

 

Carew’s banner season was his MVP campaign in 1977. In his age-31 and second to last season in Minnesota, Carew hit .388/.449/.570 and led the league in hits, runs, batting average, on-base percentage, triples, OPS and WAR. Carew finished his career with 3,053 hits, including 445 doubles, 112 triples and 92 home runs. Unfortunately, he never appeared in a World Series and hit just .220/.291/.300 in 14 career postseason games. Carew was inducted into the Hall of Fame in 1991 after receiving 401 of 443 votes on the first ballot. Here are the top 10 offensive WAR seasons in Twins history:

 

1. Carew - 1977 (8.9)

2. Carew - 1974 (8.3)

3. Killebrew - 1969 (7.9)

4. Mauer - 2009 (7.7)

T-5. Carew - 1975 (7.5)

T-5. Knoblauch - 1996 (7.5)

7. Killebrew - 1967 (7.3)

T-8. Puckett - 1988 (7.1)

T-8. Killebrew - 1966 (7.1)

10. Carew - 1979 (7.0)

 

 

 

What do you think? Who are the the five best Twins hitters ever? Comment below!

 

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[Dantes929]

I'm all right with that list.   Morneau probably 6th.   Would have been nice to see what Morneau, Mauer and Oliva would have done without injuries.

 

[rghrbek]

I think this list is probably correct.  I would like to see the next 5.  Guessing Morneau, Hrbek, Knobby, then I guess it gets muddled as you have to weigh in years of service (Torii) vs. very good short runs (like Bostock, Mack, Hisel).  Probably a good debate.

[theBOMisthebomb]

Any list where Puckett isn't #1 has me at least a bit skeptical. I can't quibble with Killebrew and Carew over Puckett for best hitter, though. How about Kent Hrbek instead of Mauer.

[big dog]

Today's fun fact: Harmon won that episode of Home Run Derby, earning $2,000.

 

His salary for that year, 1959, was $9,000.

[Seth Stohs]

These are definitely the Top 5. I would say Hrbek 6 and Morneau 7... 

 

I think Killebrew and Carew are the top two, and then there is a space...

 

Then there could be arguments for how to rank Puckett, Mauer and Oliva (that's the order I would go) depending on how much you value certain aspects of hitting. 

[Mr. Brooks]

These are definitely the Top 5. I would say Hrbek 6 and Morneau 7...

 

I think Killebrew and Carew are the top two, and then there is a space...

 

Then there could be arguments for how to rank Puckett, Mauer and Oliva (that's the order I would go) depending on how much you value certain aspects of hitting.

If it's truly only measuring hitting, with zero positional adjustment, I think a pretty strong case can be made for Hrbek over Mauer.

[prouster]

I agree with the five players listed. Maybe a small quibble or two with the order. Basically I think there’s a case for putting Puckett at 5 and Mauer at 3 or 4. A fun thing to think about in this extended offseason.

[Halsey Hall]

Having watched them all many times, I'd agree with your order.

[Twodogs]

If it's truly only measuring hitting, with zero positional adjustment, I think a pretty strong case can be made for Hrbek over Mauer.

IDK, I don't see it, Mauer won 3 batting titles. Hard to say Hrbek was a better hitter than Joe, I mean more power obviously, but a lot of people had more power than Joe. About the only thing I could say about Herbie vs Joe is that Hrbek was probably more of a team player and maybe did more (little things) to help his team win than Joe did. But I think overall Joe was a better hitter than Hrbek. Maybe you can make those other cases as Hrbek is a 2 time world champion and Joe is not, but 3 batting titles kind of speak for themselves.

[IndianaTwin]

 

IDK, I don't see it, Mauer won 3 batting titles. Hard to say Hrbek was a better hitter than Joe, I mean more power obviously, but a lot of people had more power than Joe. About the only thing I could say about Herbie vs Joe is that Hrbek was probably more of a team player and maybe did more (little things) to help his team win than Joe did. But I think overall Joe was a better hitter than Hrbek. Maybe you can make those other cases as Hrbek is a 2 time world champion and Joe is not, but 3 batting titles kind of speak for themselves.

 

My gut reaction was to easily agree with you, but then I discovered that Hrbek had an OPS+ of 128 in 1747 games and Mauer 124 in 1858 games.

 

In fact, in OPS plus, Hrbek's 128 is even above Puckett's 124. Looking at OPS+ in Twins years only gives us Killebrew (148), Carew (137), Oliva (131), Hrbek (128), Mauer and Puckett (124).

[Cornholio]

I think this list is probably correct. I would like to see the next 5. Guessing Morneau, Hrbek, Knobby, then I guess it gets muddled as you have to weigh in years of service (Torii) vs. very good short runs (like Bostock, Mack, Hisel). Probably a good debate.

I would add Bob Allison to the list to consider. OPS- .827, OPS+127. Plus, a long run with the Twins.

[IndianaTwin]

 

I would add Bob Allison to the list to consider. OPS- .827, OPS+127. Plus, a long run with the Twins.

 

I'm 53 and just missed Allison. I get the sense that folks my age and younger dramatically underrate Allison. If you use just the Twins years as was done for Killebrew and others above, his OPS+ is actually 131 over 10 seasons. 

[DocBauer]

I was confused at first as I took the lead too seriously and literally thought best HITTER. And then I saw Killibrew instead of Knoblauch and realised the direction we were headed.

 

This is like a 5 headed Twins Mt Rushmore, and I know I'm quibbling here, but any sort of order is hard to argue with when you have the likes of Carew and Killibrew on the list. One can't match the other for their hitting and the other can't match power and production.

 

Second 10 would have to include Hrbek, Morneau, Allison and Knoblauch. Not sure who my 5th would be.

 

Interesting, no matter how deep, talented and relatively young our current Twins are, 10+yrs from now, is Sano the only one who gets mentioned in an article like this?

[Rigby]

Agree with order but on any given day I would flip Rod and Harmon. 10th spot? Would have loved to see Lyman's career play out in Minnesota. Smalley would merit some consideration.

[Nine of twelve]

I agree with the OP (and apparently most posters) that the top 5 are the correct top five. I will note that the title of the thread does not require the top 5 to be ranked. And I don't think I could do that.

[Twodogs]

My gut reaction was to easily agree with you, but then I discovered that Hrbek had an OPS+ of 128 in 1747 games and Mauer 124 in 1858 games.

 

In fact, in OPS plus, Hrbek's 128 is even above Puckett's 124. Looking at OPS+ in Twins years only gives us Killebrew (148), Carew (137), Oliva (131), Hrbek (128), Mauer and Puckett (124).

Right, but the question was who were the best hitters, period. OPS+ factors in power, that is why Killebrew is much higher than Carew, but the yearly batting title award isn't named after Harmon Killebrew, it's named after Rod Carew. So Carew could flirt with .400 but be considered a worse hitter than Killebrew? I mean that is comparing apples and oranges. Mauer was not a power hitter, just a pure hitter, and year Hrbek was also very good, but I don't even think the people of Hrbek's era would have rated him all that high in his era, he was very good. But Mauer in his era was one of the best in the league for a handful of years. But not much power so OPS+ would maybe not be that high. I know that OPS+ is highly factored for building lineups for today's teams, but not all teams in different eras worried about OPS+, and had they, I'm sure Puckett and Carew would have done something about those numbers if people were using them to judge how good of a hitter they were, but they didn't, so hard to use that stat as a be all end all argument against these hitters. Pete Rose has an OPS+ of 118? He wouldn't be one of the top 5 hitters in Twins history had he played for the Twins? But yeah, Hrbek definitely did some things better than Mauer, and Hrbek found ways to win. But in my opinion, just pure hitter it should go to Mauer.

[ewen21]

 

I was confused at first as I took the lead too seriously and literally thought best HITTER. And then I saw Killibrew instead of Knoblauch and realised the direction we were headed.

This is like a 5 headed Twins Mt Rushmore, and I know I'm quibbling here, but any sort of order is hard to argue with when you have the likes of Carew and Killibrew on the list. One can't match the other for their hitting and the other can't match power and production.

Second 10 would have to include Hrbek, Morneau, Allison and Knoblauch. Not sure who my 5th would be.

Interesting, no matter how deep, talented and relatively young our current Twins are, 10+yrs from now, is Sano the only one who gets mentioned in an article like this?

While Knoblauch was a great hitter for average and stole a lot of bases he should never be compared to Killebrew even in a "best hitter' category.  I respect your knowledge and your considerate demeanor, but what criteria are you using if you feel Knoblauch warrants a comparison to Harmon?

 

It honestly doesn't even matter what aspects of their offensive game you want to emphasize.  

[ewen21]

Better to me means most impactful hitters.  Matty Alou hit over .330 in four consecutive seasons and hardly anyone mentions it.  Why?  Because as extraordinarily impressive as that was he was basically a singles hitter.

 

As dated as the quote may be, I think Ralph Kiner may have said it best:

"Singles hitters drive Fords, home run hitters drive Cadillacs"

[IndianaTwin]

 

....

1. Rod Carew
Seasons with Minnesota: 12 (1967-1978)
Batting line: .334/.393/.448

....
1. Carew - 1977 (8.9)
2. Carew - 1974 (8.3)
3. Killebrew - 1969 (7.9)
4. Mauer - 2009 (7.7)
T-5. Carew - 1975 (7.5)
T-5. Knoblauch - 1996 (7.5)
7. Killebrew - 1967 (7.3)
T-8. Puckett - 1988 (7.1)
T-8. Killebrew - 1966 (7.1)
10. Carew - 1979 (7.0)

....

 

There's at least two issues with using Offensive War in comparing Carew with Killebrew, however. First is that Offensive WAR includes baserunning, where Carew is going to gain significantly on Killebrew. Second is that there is a position adjustment. Two of Carew's four years on this list had the advantage of being at 2B, whereas Killebrew was playing a lot of 1B in his best years. 

[IndianaTwin]

 

Right, but the question was who were the best hitters, period. OPS+ factors in power, that is why Killebrew is much higher than Carew, but the yearly batting title award isn't named after Harmon Killebrew, it's named after Rod Carew. So Carew could flirt with .400 but be considered a worse hitter than Killebrew? I mean that is comparing apples and oranges. Mauer was not a power hitter, just a pure hitter, and year Hrbek was also very good, but I don't even think the people of Hrbek's era would have rated him all that high in his era, he was very good. But Mauer in his era was one of the best in the league for a handful of years. But not much power so OPS+ would maybe not be that high. I know that OPS+ is highly factored for building lineups for today's teams, but not all teams in different eras worried about OPS+, and had they, I'm sure Puckett and Carew would have done something about those numbers if people were using them to judge how good of a hitter they were, but they didn't, so hard to use that stat as a be all end all argument against these hitters. Pete Rose has an OPS+ of 118? He wouldn't be one of the top 5 hitters in Twins history had he played for the Twins? But yeah, Hrbek definitely did some things better than Mauer, and Hrbek found ways to win. But in my opinion, just pure hitter it should go to Mauer.

 

To play devil's advocate, Killebrew flirted with 50 homers on multiple occasions at a time when there had been roughly the same number of 50 homer season as there had been .400 seasons, and isn't power a part of being a good hitter? Wouldn't someone who hits .300 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 100 walks be considered a better hitter than a .300 hitter with 5 homers, 20 doubles, 50 walks? If so, then the next question might be, which is better -- .280 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 70 walks vs. .310 with 10 homers, 30 doubles, and 70 walks. And so on. 

 

I think the definition of "best hitter" does take power into play, as well as the good eye that generates walks. That's where OPS is helpful. It blends the combination of getting on base and demonstrating power in a way that values both. 

 

Similarly, isn't someone who hits .300 in 1968 in the American League, when .301 led the league, better than someone who hits .300 in the 1930 National League, when the league average was .303. Context matters. 

 

That's the advantage of an indexed number like OPS+. It allows comparing across eras. It says that when you take the season, the league, and the ballpark into effect, Killebrew was on average 48 percent better than the average hitter in the league. Great as he was, Carew was "only" 37 percent better than the average player. Because of his power, Killebrew was being more effective with his hits, and he was doing it in a slightly harder context.

 

Don't get me wrong -- I'll take a lineup of nine Rod Carews any day of the week! I just think I'll score more runs with nine Harmon Killebrews. 

 

[Twodogs]

To play devil's advocate, Killebrew flirted with 50 homers on multiple occasions at a time when there had been roughly the same number of 50 homer season as there had been .400 seasons, and isn't power a part of being a good hitter? Wouldn't someone who hits .300 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 100 walks be considered a better hitter than a .300 hitter with 5 homers, 20 doubles, 50 walks? If so, then the next question might be, which is better -- .280 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 70 walks vs. .310 with 10 homers, 30 doubles, and 70 walks. And so on.

 

I think the definition of "best hitter" does take power into play, as well as the good eye that generates walks. That's where OPS is helpful. It blends the combination of getting on base and demonstrating power in a way that values both.

 

Similarly, isn't someone who hits .300 in 1968 in the American League, when .301 led the league, better than someone who hits .300 in the 1930 National League, when the league average was .303. Context matters.

 

That's the advantage of an indexed number like OPS+. It allows comparing across eras. It says that when you take the season, the league, and the ballpark into effect, Killebrew was on average 48 percent better than the average hitter in the league. Great as he was, Carew was "only" 37 percent better than the average player. Because of his power, Killebrew was being more effective with his hits, and he was doing it in a slightly harder context.

 

Don't get me wrong -- I'll take a lineup of nine Rod Carews any day of the week! I just think I'll score more runs with nine Harmon Killebrews.

I get what you are saying, but we weren't really talking about Harmon and Rod we were talking about Hrbek and Mauer. But I think Carew in his prime was a better hitter than Harmon, but that doesn't mean that Harmon wasn't great. But when we are talking about Hrbek and Mauer, I mean I really like Hrbek and I don't really care for Mauer that much, but I think when you look at batting titles Mauer wins it. I mean what was Mauer's OPS+ when he played in the Dome??? Because Hrbek's whole career was in the Dome. I mean who was the better hitter? Who would you rather have 9 of? Pete Rose? 118 OPS+ career or Mike Greenwell? 121 OPS+ I mean I know OPS+ tries to factor in where things are being played, but seriously, how much did Target field affect Mauer. I mean does Mike Greenwell have a 121 OPS+ had he played in Cincinnati during the 70's??

 

I mean where do you think these guys contemporaries rank these guys? Take all of the ball players who played with and against Hrbek and where do you think Hrbek ranks in their minds as far as being a great hitter? I mean if you could ask the guys back from the 80's? You know Ripken, Boggs, Mattingly, Gwynn, etc... I mean if you could I'm sure they'd all say that Hrbek was a really good player in his prime. But now ask Joe Mauer's contemporaries and what do you think those guys would say about Joe?? They'd probably tell you that he was one of the best pure hitters that they played against. I get that Hrbek was good and I actually like him more. But I can't overlook 3 batting titles.

[Dantes929]

 

 

My gut reaction was to easily agree with you, but then I discovered that Hrbek had an OPS+ of 128 in 1747 games and Mauer 124 in 1858 games.

 

In fact, in OPS plus, Hrbek's 128 is even above Puckett's 124. Looking at OPS+ in Twins years only gives us Killebrew (148), Carew (137), Oliva (131), Hrbek (128), Mauer and Puckett (124).

If you want to just go by OPS+ then Shane Mack beats Hrbek, Puckett and Mauer (though he doesn't quite have enough at bats to get to 3,000 but not really his fault).   I am certain no one thinks Mauer post bi lateral and definitely post concussion was one of the Twins best.   Same with Oliva's injuries.   Carew only played 8 seasons with the Twins so how about ranking them by OPS+ for each players best 8 seasons.    OPS+ does adjust for park played.     Then you have Killebrew at 159, Carew at 150.  Oliva at 140.6.   Mauer at 138.  Hrbek at 136.4.   Puckett at 134.6 and Allison at 132.5.  Knoblach way back there    Now almost no one would put Puckett ahead of Hrbek on the all time list but I wonder how much a Leibrandt hanging curveball and a great series against the Jay has to do with that perception.   Should it?   No shame in being the Twins 6th best hitter of all time.  I was a big fan of all of them though Hrbek annoyed me a little.   Always felt like baseball ranked behind wrestling, eating hunting and fishing with him. He was changing batting stances all the time and was always trying to pull the ball and hit moon shots.   Those were fun to watch but leading the league in distance past the fence doesn't mean any more than the guys that barely cleared it.    I seriously thought he had the talent to add 20 points to his average while still hitting more homers.   He had the talent to be in the HOF.    I'm not saying he squandered the talent because he was definitely one of the all time Twins greats but I am saying he might have got more out of it.

[Dantes929]

 

To play devil's advocate, Killebrew flirted with 50 homers on multiple occasions at a time when there had been roughly the same number of 50 homer season as there had been .400 seasons, and isn't power a part of being a good hitter? Wouldn't someone who hits .300 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 100 walks be considered a better hitter than a .300 hitter with 5 homers, 20 doubles, 50 walks? If so, then the next question might be, which is better -- .280 with 30 homers, 40 doubles and 70 walks vs. .310 with 10 homers, 30 doubles, and 70 walks. And so on. 

 

I think the definition of "best hitter" does take power into play, as well as the good eye that generates walks. That's where OPS is helpful. It blends the combination of getting on base and demonstrating power in a way that values both. 

 

Similarly, isn't someone who hits .300 in 1968 in the American League, when .301 led the league, better than someone who hits .300 in the 1930 National League, when the league average was .303. Context matters. 

 

That's the advantage of an indexed number like OPS+. It allows comparing across eras. It says that when you take the season, the league, and the ballpark into effect, Killebrew was on average 48 percent better than the average hitter in the league. Great as he was, Carew was "only" 37 percent better than the average player. Because of his power, Killebrew was being more effective with his hits, and he was doing it in a slightly harder context.

 

Don't get me wrong -- I'll take a lineup of nine Rod Carews any day of the week! I just think I'll score more runs with nine Harmon Killebrews. 

I am thinking 5 Carews and 4 Killebrews might be the best mix.   

[jkcarew]

Killebrew 1, Carew 2. And if you throw out Killebrew’s last couple of decline years (Carew’s were spent in California)...it’s not that close.

[DocBauer]

While Knoblauch was a great hitter for average and stole a lot of bases he should never be compared to Killebrew even in a "best hitter' category.  I respect your knowledge and your considerate demeanor, but what criteria are you using if you feel Knoblauch warrants a comparison to Harmon?

 

It honestly doesn't even matter what aspects of their offensive game you want to emphasize.

 

Great question. I will attempt to answer. First of all, while I enjoy the discussion, we have a very open-ended discussion here, IMO. There are countless ways to grade and measure in the game of baseball, including WAR, fWAR, OPS, OPS+, etc. I don't pretend to understand them all, and I know here at TD and in the baseball community debates range as best ways to measure/rank.

 

That being said, with all due respect to HOF greats like Carew and Killibrew, trying to compare them as "hitters" is very vague and open as they are completely different types of hitters/ballplayers. Both great, but very, very different types of players.

 

Now, I wouldn't put Knoblauch in the first 5 but I'd have to consider him strongly for my second 5 based on 7yr with the Twins in which his quad slash line was: .304/ .390/ .418/ .808. Those are outstanding numbers, even though his total OPS is dragged down a bit by having pop but not great power. He also had 276SB in his 7yrs, scored 100+ R 4 times, 80+ twice and 78 his rookie season. (4uns, like RBI, can be somewhat subjective in value, but they still have value and the player still performed at such a level to allow those numbers to happen).

 

So to me, when I look at those numbers, that production, over 7yrs I've got him as a pretty special player for an extended period of time.

[dex8425]

You've got three hall of famers, one future hall of famer, and possibly the best hitter to not be in the hall of fame. Can't argue with the top 5. 

[ewen21]

 

Great question. I will attempt to answer. First of all, while I enjoy the discussion, we have a very open-ended discussion here, IMO. There are countless ways to grade and measure in the game of baseball, including WAR, fWAR, OPS, OPS+, etc. I don't pretend to understand them all, and I know here at TD and in the baseball community debates range as best ways to measure/rank.

That being said, with all due respect to HOF greats like Carew and Killibrew, trying to compare them as "hitters" is very vague and open as they are completely different types of hitters/ballplayers. Both great, but very, very different types of players.

Now, I wouldn't put Knoblauch in the first 5 but I'd have to consider him strongly for my second 5 based on 7yr with the Twins in which his quad slash line was: .304/ .390/ .418/ .808. Those are outstanding numbers, even though his total OPS is dragged down a bit by having pop but not great power. He also had 276SB in his 7yrs, scored 100+ R 4 times, 80+ twice and 78 his rookie season. (4uns, like RBI, can be somewhat subjective in value, but they still have value and the player still performed at such a level to allow those numbers to happen).

So to me, when I look at those numbers, that production, over 7yrs I've got him as a pretty special player for an extended period of time.

I understand they are different players with different skill sets, but it isn't very hard (in my opinion) to make a holistic judgment without much introspection in this case.  When making this comparison, I view it this way.  If I had to draft one or the other in my first pick to start a team I am picking Harmon over Knoblauch without hesitation (and that is no slight on Knobby).

[DocBauer]

I understand they are different players with different skill sets, but it isn't very hard (in my opinion) to make a holistic judgment without much introspection in this case. When making this comparison, I view it this way. If I had to draft one or the other in my first pick to start a team I am picking Harmon over Knoblauch without hesitation (and that is no slight on Knobby).

Knoblauch sprang to my mind originally because of the word/term "hitter". Not OPS leader, power hitter, most dangerous bat, etc. But Knoblauch would be in my 2nd 5.

[stringer bell]

Oliva and Mauer declined while members of the Twins. In Tony-O's case, there were several years in which he kept playing and was a shadow of his former self. Between '64 and '71 his lowest OPS+ was 129 and won three batting championships. Because his career was shortened and it was a pitching-friendly era, the counting stats aren't that impressive. I was still in school when he played, and was probably impressionable, but I think he belongs in the MLB Hall of Fame.