Front Page: A Message To The Front Office

[nicksaviking]

 

Yes, if there was a salary cap then problem solved. Wasn't the revenue sharing put in place by big market clubs to avoid a cap? Speaking of revenue sharing, how much do the Twins get, and how much of that actually goes into player acquisition? 

 

It's expected that the revenue sharing goes into payrolls, which is why Pittsburgh and Miami have drawn the ire of other clubs.

 

But there should be a salary cap and a salary floor like every other sport with revenue sharing to balance the equation. Last I checked the YES Network features two baseball teams each game, though I doubt the Yankees revenue share cut from the broadcasts are 50%.

[rdehring]

 

Of Fangraphs top 23 starting pitchers, 18 are off the board. So, yes, they have missed on others..... Now, whether that is good or bad I don't know, but it isn't true only the undoable are gone.

Valid comment, Mike.  We just don't know how much the FO liked any of those 14 not named Cole, Strasburg, Wheeler or Bumgarner. 

 

Wouldn't be surprised if they made an initial inquiry on a couple, but didn't engage.  We just don't have enough inside information to know how they view them.  Heck, they may really believe that they will get equal or better performance out of one or two of the four kids who all had rather impressive debuts last fall.

 

I expect we are going to see either a signing or trade in the four or five weeks.  Come July we will know whether or not their decision was correct. 

[nicksaviking]

 

Of Fangraphs top 23 starting pitchers, 18 are off the board. So, yes, they have missed on others..... Now, whether that is good or bad I don't know, but it isn't true only the undoable are gone.

 

Sure, but of those 18, Cole, Strasbugh and Wheeler were the only ones that I would have cared about. I think the reaction by the fans would have been exactly the same had the Twins signed Tanner Roarke or Kyle Gibson. It might have been worse actually.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Sure, but of those 18, Cole, Strasbugh and Wheeler were the only ones that I would have cared about. I think the reaction by the fans would have been exactly the same had the Twins signed Tanner Roarke or Kyle Gibson. It might have been worse actually.

 

That's not what your post said........and, I acknowledged that it might be good. But it is not true that only the best players are off the board.

 

As for who you want.....you literally only wanted a team that has 2.25 open starting pitching spots to sign one of three starting pitchers? That seems like a bad plan to me.

 

I don't really care about the reaction of fans, frankly. The Twins should, but I don't.

[Tomj14]

 

You are correct, until baseball implements a salary cap, the big boys - the Yankees, Dodgers, Red Sox, etc. are always going to have an advantage, a very big advantage.  If the Twins blow it on a free agent, pick the wrong one, he gets hurt, etc, the Twins are hamstrung for years. The big boys just go sign another one.
 

A salary cap is going to solve this? How has that worked out in other sports? I mean have the Timberwolves ever got a free agent to come to MN? Besides Sutter have the Wild ever gotten a free agent to come here that wasn't some how directly related to something in MN?

 

I am pretty sure the Twins have never spent up to what a salary cap would be.

Quit making excuses for the Twins!

[Mike Sixel]

I'm not sure how a salary cap helps with the "no one wants to come to MN" problem.

 

Do the Twins have a disadvantage compared to higher revenue teams? Yes....yes they do. But they've chosen to be in this business, and it is their job to overcome those disadvantages. Or not. They can choose to ride that space of spending just enough to be just good enough, and hope to get lucky occasionally. Also their choice how they invest.

[drivlikejehu]

 

I'm not sure how a salary cap helps with the "no one wants to come to MN" problem.

 

Do the Twins have a disadvantage compared to higher revenue teams? Yes....yes they do. But they've chosen to be in this business, and it is their job to overcome those disadvantages. Or not. They can choose to ride that space of spending just enough to be just good enough, and hope to get lucky occasionally. Also their choice how they invest.

 

I don't think Falvey really needs your pep talk. He got an extension, higher title, and undoubtedly a raise, and is on the radar of the largest organizations. Seems like people in the business think he knows his stuff, and his club just won 101 games. So I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that he'll stick with his philosophies.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I don't think Falvey really needs your pep talk. He got an extension, higher title, and undoubtedly a raise, and is on the radar of the largest organizations. Seems like people in the business think he knows his stuff, and his club just won 101 games. So I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that he'll stick with his philosophies.

 

I literally have no idea what this post means.

[nicksaviking]

 

That's not what your post said........and, I acknowledged that it might be good. But it is not true that only the best players are off the board.

 

As for who you want.....you literally only wanted a team that has 2.25 open starting pitching spots to sign one of three starting pitchers? That seems like a bad plan to me.

 

I don't really care about the reaction of fans, frankly. The Twins should, but I don't.

 

No, I would have liked Wheeler, or I'd take Ryu. Those 2.25 starter spots are not interchangeable. They need at least 1.0 of those spots for a front line arm. Wheeler was the only possible free agent pitcher I saw go off the board that could fill that spot. If this route is not possible or not going to happen, I don't want those 2.25 rotation spots filled with free agents that I don't like. Which is most of them.

 

As for the guys who will fill the 1.25 spots at the back of the rotation, sure I'll have some opinions, but if they miss out on Tanner Roarke I could care less because view him any better than Gio Gonzalez, Homer Bailey, Drew Smyly, Tyson Ross or whomever will be sitting there begging for a job next month.

 

 

[LemonUpgrade]

 

The Twins are a lot more fun to follow when the are competitive, have a >.500 record, than when they are 23 games out of first place. I'd rather see them be competitive 8 out of 10 years vs pushing all their chips in, signing 1-2 big buck free agents or making big trades, maybe making the World Series -- and then having a string of 5-6 sub .500 years.  

 

If they keep a young competitive core, sign an occasional free agent (can you say Nelson Cruz!!!), stay above .500, they'll keep me happy.

 

This is one way of thinking of professional sports. Just having a good time and cheering on a competitive team knowing full well winning a division is the ceiling. That's completely fine. However there is a market of fans that want the team to win in the playoffs and not just be competitive. I asked a Royal fan if the WS win made up for the misery he'd been through over the decades. He answered with a resounding yes!

 

Being competitive is a nice thing, something to talk about during the year, but Championships are forever. Does anyone talk about the competitive 2006 team? No. Do we still celebrate 1987 and 1991? Absolutely!

[TouchEmAllGuy]

Paying up is an option, just not for this franchise/ownership. The Vikings had a need for a QB, paid the big bucks to get Kirk Cousins. I'd say the majority are now happy with the Cousins signing.

 

Edit: Tried to quote Tomj14's post.

[In My La Z boy]

 

Paying up is an option, just not for this franchise/ownership. The Vikings had a need for a QB, paid the big bucks to get Kirk Cousins. I'd say the majority are now happy with the Cousins signing.

 

Edit: Tried to quote Tomj14's post.

Bad example. Cousins broke our bank and he isn't clutch in any way. We won't win the big games with him sorry to say. 

[Bomba2026]

Speaking of the comment about Cousins and fans are happy with him. Uh, no one I know is.

[Danchat]

 

Paying up is an option, just not for this franchise/ownership. The Vikings had a need for a QB, paid the big bucks to get Kirk Cousins. I'd say the majority are now happy with the Cousins signing.

 

Edit: Tried to quote Tomj14's post.

Yeah... over on Purple Pain, there's a lot of people calling for Spielman's head for making such a "terrible" signing. I've actually seen people wishing the Vikings FO was not so aggressive and would make cheap signings instead of spending "everything" on Cousins.

 

We've seen it with the Mauer deal too, Minnesota fans will turn on players who are making the big bucks.

[Seth Stohs]

 

 

Saying that the front office should "act like a fan" is just about the worst suggestion possible in sports. 

 

This is 100% true...

[USAFChief]

 

Speaking of the comment about Cousins and fans are happy with him. Uh, no one I know is.

Pray tell, why? He's been fantastic this year. 

[Bomba2026]

Pray tell, why? He's been fantastic this year.

 

I will retract my statement when he wins a really big game and takes us to the Superbowl. It's still the "deer in the headlights" looks he has flashed too many times on National TV. Hope I'm wrong....

[tarheeltwinsfan]

We need a top 5 free agent pitcher, who loves ice fishing, moose hunting, snow sledding, whose mother-in-law lives in St Paul. and who attended University of Minnesota. I'm sure we can find someone who fits this description. Now let me see....

[DocBauer]

Been thinking a lot about this OP during the day since I read it. While this letter will obviously not be hand delivered to the FO...though I'm willing to be some people in the FO actually read TD...i feel Matt is simply being cathartic in his piece. And I endorse that and get that. I'm even hoping against hope it will have even a little affect on some of the vitriol that bas been spewing out on many recent posts.

 

To no-one in particular, I get it. I really do. After a few very bad and disappointing years, this team seems right on the cusp. And everyone, me included, wants a WOW factor to give hope that tomorrow is NOW! That the window is not only open, but stuck open and even your construction/farmhand uncle with the barrell chest, massive arms and powerful hands can't close the damn thing!

 

But can we also just take a couple of deep breaths and step back for a moment?

 

I could tell you all I've been a fanatic since the Calvin days and remind you what cheap really was. I could remind you all that despite angst and "reputation" the Twins have won 2 WS titles and had numerous winning seasons and playoff appearances over that time, including a record setting season last year. And we could bicker and argue about the previous FO, and ownership, during that time.

 

Except, in the hear and now, while maybe relative to some degree, it doesn't matter in the NOW.

 

I will state, with conviction, as Matt alluded to, comparing the previous administration to now is just borderline ridiculous. Different time and place, and different schools of thought. No offense to the previous FO as they did some very good things in their day. But they also didn't make trades to acquire talent for veterans in a losing season. They didn't eat contract $ to make a deal work. They didn't embrace analytics and new ways of doing things the way thjs new regime has been.

 

Remember last off season when we were all screaming to add FA BP help, me included, and all we got was Parker and Harper? Considering how the season went, and then went even better, don't knkw about you but I feel a little silly now. Even the tragic mid-season BP trade scenario turned out half right didn't it? Remember when the Odorizzi trade was almost a footnote? Or the 2yr Pineda deal was a hope flier?

 

My point is I think we are a pretty damn smart collective of baseball, Twins fanatics, from owners to staff to bloggers. (I both include and dismiss myself compared to some). But we are also very uninformed at times as to what is really going on in the market world of MLB.

 

For months I have been torn about Wheeler and Bumgarner. And then both were gone. And through various reports it appears we never had a shot, for whatever reason, for either one. And as a fanatical fan, my reactions is simple: DAMNIT!

 

I'm not sold on Ryu or Keuchel, though I "like" both. And I would celebrate the signing of either with HOPE. But I also like so much of what I have seen this FO do so far that I have a feeling of trust in them. I don't believe they will shell out money "just to make a move". We can argue back and forth all day about that. But until they just prove me and everyone wrong, I'm siding with them at this point.

 

Is it accident or co-incidence that the young "core" players have begun to arrive under their administration? Is it the same we have built one of the best farm systems since they've been in charge?

 

Despite $ available, maybe this FA class just isn't right. Maybe they will sign Ryu and Donaldson both tomorrow and we all be left drooling like Pavlov's dogs. And maybe they will sign a so-so arm they like, bring back Cron or sign Shaw, and make a trade for a Thor, or someone lesser they really like. And we will sit here come June 1st, or so, wondering what on earth we were thinking.

 

I am NOT a prospect horder. I believe in making trades. I would like a major move FA wise to move the needle and keep available talent on hand for tomorrow and future moves with said window wide open.

 

But while I can't wait for spring, and ST, as I ramble on December 20th, I can't but believe there are going to be some very interesting moves to yet take place.

[beterday]

I came here this morning to read that the Twins had signed Donaldson, so I am still engaged and still have hope.  On the other hand, I fully expect to come here and read Donaldson signed with the Braves or someone else.  Can't explain it, only know I have more trust and hope than when Gardy and Ryan were in charge.

 

I would like someone to write an article about when some of the redundancies in prospects start to fall off the team due to their time being up.  Seems to me the Twins will have to trade some of these guys within a year or two or lose them anyway.

[Blackjack]

 

I disagree with the "be competitive 8 of 10 years vs pushing all their chips in" theory, but I can understand the theory.

 

My problem with it is more along the lines of, what makes you think the Twins will be competitive for 8 of the next 10 years? Shouldn't they need to actually do that first, before you give them credit for such a conservative strategy? 

 

They've managed 4 seasons above .500 since moving into TF, and two of those were 83 and 85 win seasons that didn't even result in ALC championships. They haven't won a post season game, much less series, in forever. 

 

I realize there's a new FO in place, but you're asking for exactly the same strategy that got us nowhere under Ryan. 

 

No thanks. Push some chips in once in a while for a change. Let's try that for a few decades, and then compare. 

You make a good point, they have yet to prove that they can stay competitive for the next 8 years but so far I really like what Falvine has done, upgrading the farm system, coaches, showing us a 100 win season, etc.  We'll have to revisit this issue in eight years.  

 

I will also say that getting one big buck pitcher doesn't guarantee that the Twins would be in the world series, which is what a lot of the posters here on TD think. 

 

The older I get the more I realize that slow and steady will win a lot of races.  Stay competitive, make the playoffs, excite and draw lots of fans, generating lots of revenue, helping you stay competitive, and hope that you catch that lighting in a bottle and win a few playoff series --- works for me.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

You make a good point, they have yet to prove that they can stay competitive for the next 8 years but so far I really like what Falvine has done, upgrading the farm system, coaches, showing us a 100 win season, etc. We'll have to revisit this issue in eight years.

 

I will also say that getting one big buck pitcher doesn't guarantee that the Twins would be in the world series, which is what a lot of the posters here on TD think.

 

The older I get the more I realize that slow and steady will win a lot of races. Stay competitive, make the playoffs, excite and draw lots of fans, generating lots of revenue, helping you stay competitive, and hope that you catch that lighting in a bottle and win a few playoff series --- works for me.

I’m totally with you on trades (and apparently the FO) if you can make occasional free agent moves to push you up a notch on competitiveness and hang on to prospects.

 

With the rotation as it is, adding one big-pitcher to an already good rotation increases odds a lot.

[rdehring]

 

Been thinking a lot about this OP during the day since I read it. While this letter will obviously not be hand delivered to the FO...though I'm willing to be some people in the FO actually read TD...i feel Matt is simply being cathartic in his piece. And I endorse that and get that. I'm even hoping against hope it will have even a little affect on some of the vitriol that bas been spewing out on many recent posts.

To no-one in particular, I get it. I really do. After a few very bad and disappointing years, this team seems right on the cusp. And everyone, me included, wants a WOW factor to give hope that tomorrow is NOW! That the window is not only open, but stuck open and even your construction/farmhand uncle with the barrell chest, massive arms and powerful hands can't close the damn thing!

But can we also just take a couple of deep breaths and step back for a moment?

I could tell you all I've been a fanatic since the Calvin days and remind you what cheap really was. I could remind you all that despite angst and "reputation" the Twins have won 2 WS titles and had numerous winning seasons and playoff appearances over that time, including a record setting season last year. And we could bicker and argue about the previous FO, and ownership, during that time.

Except, in the hear and now, while maybe relative to some degree, it doesn't matter in the NOW.

I will state, with conviction, as Matt alluded to, comparing the previous administration to now is just borderline ridiculous. Different time and place, and different schools of thought. No offense to the previous FO as they did some very good things in their day. But they also didn't make trades to acquire talent for veterans in a losing season. They didn't eat contract $ to make a deal work. They didn't embrace analytics and new ways of doing things the way thjs new regime has been.

Remember last off season when we were all screaming to add FA BP help, me included, and all we got was Parker and Harper? Considering how the season went, and then went even better, don't knkw about you but I feel a little silly now. Even the tragic mid-season BP trade scenario turned out half right didn't it? Remember when the Odorizzi trade was almost a footnote? Or the 2yr Pineda deal was a hope flier?

My point is I think we are a pretty damn smart collective of baseball, Twins fanatics, from owners to staff to bloggers. (I both include and dismiss myself compared to some). But we are also very uninformed at times as to what is really going on in the market world of MLB.

For months I have been torn about Wheeler and Bumgarner. And then both were gone. And through various reports it appears we never had a shot, for whatever reason, for either one. And as a fanatical fan, my reactions is simple: DAMNIT!

I'm not sold on Ryu or Keuchel, though I "like" both. And I would celebrate the signing of either with HOPE. But I also like so much of what I have seen this FO do so far that I have a feeling of trust in them. I don't believe they will shell out money "just to make a move". We can argue back and forth all day about that. But until they just prove me and everyone wrong, I'm siding with them at this point.

Is it accident or co-incidence that the young "core" players have begun to arrive under their administration? Is it the same we have built one of the best farm systems since they've been in charge?

Despite $ available, maybe this FA class just isn't right. Maybe they will sign Ryu and Donaldson both tomorrow and we all be left drooling like Pavlov's dogs. And maybe they will sign a so-so arm they like, bring back Cron or sign Shaw, and make a trade for a Thor, or someone lesser they really like. And we will sit here come June 1st, or so, wondering what on earth we were thinking.

I am NOT a prospect horder. I believe in making trades. I would like a major move FA wise to move the needle and keep available talent on hand for tomorrow and future moves with said window wide open.

But while I can't wait for spring, and ST, as I ramble on December 20th, I can't but believe there are going to be some very interesting moves to yet take place.

I debated whether or not to click the "like" button.  You see the problem I had was that I "loved" your comment, Doc.  

 

Don't know what the tech guys can do, but how about adding two more buttons..."loved it" and "hated it".  Adding the later would eliminate some/many nagging responses.

[USAFChief]

You make a good point, they have yet to prove that they can stay competitive for the next 8 years but so far I really like what Falvine has done, upgrading the farm system, coaches, showing us a 100 win season, etc. We'll have to revisit this issue in eight years.

 

I will also say that getting one big buck pitcher doesn't guarantee that the Twins would be in the world series, which is what a lot of the posters here on TD think.

 

The older I get the more I realize that slow and steady will win a lot of races. Stay competitive, make the playoffs, excite and draw lots of fans, generating lots of revenue, helping you stay competitive, and hope that you catch that lighting in a bottle and win a few playoff series --- works for me.

I dont think "a lot" of posters think getting one "big buck pitcher" guarantees the Twins will be in the WS. In fact...can you point me to a single such post?

 

I do think adding a pitcher to the top of the rotation makes the Twins a much better bet to make the post season, and to have a better chance of advancing once there.

 

I also think the Twins currently have ample resources--financial and prospect--to add such a pitcher. They can do both...AND add a large contract such as Donaldson. And do so without much threat to any long term "competitiveness."

 

I'd even go so far as to say the FO has said the same.

 

And I'd even go further and say if they dont find a way to add to THIS team, they're probably not cut out for the job.

 

As for slow and steady...I'm reasonably "experienced" as well, and what I've learned is that the race isnt always won by the fastest, but that's surely the way to bet.

[ewen21]

 

But criticizing criticism of the front office isn't a waste of time? What about my post criticizing the criticizing of the front office criticism?

You may consider the article regurgitation of other complaints, I saw it as a summary. Reasonable, direct, and apropos given the end of winter meetings.

A lot of talk is a waste of time unless there is some kind of action behind it.  The resounding message being delivered now is "spend money now!"

 

That is all very nice, but what exactly should they have done?  Outbid the Yankees to get Cole?  That is impossible.  Sign Wheeler for more than what Philly offered?  And on and on and on.

 

More than anything this is about a resentment toward the Twins for not spending enough.  As if spending will be some magical bullet.  

[drivlikejehu]

 

I dont think "a lot" of posters think getting one "big buck pitcher" guarantees the Twins will be in the WS. In fact...can you point me to a single such post?

I do think adding a pitcher to the top of the rotation makes the Twins a much better bet to make the post season, and to have a better chance of advancing once there.

I also think the Twins currently have ample resources--financial and prospect--to add such a pitcher. They can do both...AND add a large contract such as Donaldson. And do so without much threat to any long term "competitiveness."

I'd even go so far as to say the FO has said the same.

And I'd even go further and say if they dont find a way to add to THIS team, they're probably not cut out for the job.

As for slow and steady...I'm reasonably "experienced" as well, and what I've learned is that the race isnt always won by the fastest, but that's surely the way to bet.

 

 

Numerous posters have expressed the view that, without a big bucks pitcher, the Twins have no hope of advancing in the playoffs. Which is obviously false. 

 

Adding good players at any position increases the chances of a team making the playoffs and advancing in the playoffs. I've not seen any poster disagree with that.

 

The problem is that spending lots of money does not ensure that a player is actually "good." Bumgarner is a prime candidate to demonstrate that reality for the thousandth time. 

 

The Twins can't afford to pay $20 million a year for an older version of Lewis Thorpe. They can afford to pay $20 million+ if the player is an actual difference-maker.

 

This free agent class did not really include that many guys in that category. Cole and Strasburg were not possibilities (ownership wouldn't allow it even if Falvey wanted to pay Cole $50 million per year and dump salary elsewhere). The next tier really was Wheeler and Ryu, with Bumgarner a step behind.

 

Ryu is unsigned and the Twins faced major challenges with respect to the other two, as reported by national media (i.e., not spin by local MN media). Blaming the Twins for missing basically requires you to either (1) say the media reports are false or (2) say that the Twins should have paid Wheeler $30 million+ per year. 

 

Neither of those is really a credible position to take. So again, we have a situation where the front office is being criticized on an irrational basis and with disregard for the fact that the off-season isn't over.

[Channing1964]

for me to elaborate would be redundant. i agree 1001%. I am tired of listening to the hypocratic metaphors. I wish the Falvines would back up what they spout.

[USAFChief]

Numerous posters have expressed the view that, without a big bucks pitcher, the Twins have no hope of advancing in the playoffs. Which is obviously false.

 

Adding good players at any position increases the chances of a team making the playoffs and advancing in the playoffs. I've not seen any poster disagree with that.

 

The problem is that spending lots of money does not ensure that a player is actually "good." Bumgarner is a prime candidate to demonstrate that reality for the thousandth time.

 

The Twins can't afford to pay $20 million a year for an older version of Lewis Thorpe. They can afford to pay $20 million+ if the player is an actual difference-maker.

 

This free agent class did not really include that many guys in that category. Cole and Strasburg were not possibilities (ownership wouldn't allow it even if Falvey wanted to pay Cole $50 million per year and dump salary elsewhere). The next tier really was Wheeler and Ryu, with Bumgarner a step behind.

 

Ryu is unsigned and the Twins faced major challenges with respect to the other two, as reported by national media (i.e., not spin by local MN media). Blaming the Twins for missing basically requires you to either (1) say the media reports are false or (2) say that the Twins should have paid Wheeler $30 million+ per year.

 

Neither of those is really a credible position to take. So again, we have a situation where the front office is being criticized on an irrational basis and with disregard for the fact that the off-season isn't over.

So you agree with me.

[FargoFanMan]

This! The window can’t get much wider.

That whole side of the house is missing!!! Seems to be working the opposite way haha

[Jham]

A lot of talk is a waste of time unless there is some kind of action behind it. The resounding message being delivered now is "spend money now!"

 

That is all very nice, but what exactly should they have done? Outbid the Yankees to get Cole? That is impossible. Sign Wheeler for more than what Philly offered? And on and on and on.

 

More than anything this is about a resentment toward the Twins for not spending enough. As if spending will be some magical bullet.

Disagree. Many saw this coming last season. We had an opportunity to add pitchers via trade and didn't. Baumgardner signed a very beatable offer. Gleeman and the Geek were guaranteeing 100 mil for him. Stroman was traded for an offer we apparently intended to beat.

 

We bemoan the fact that no one wants to play here, but ignore the fact that one of the main reasons they don't is because we won't commit to winning. You've been posting for like 1 season. The cultural image regarding the front office's commitment to winning is going on 2 decades and 3 gms. To some extent, perception is reality because it effects whether players want to come here and whether players want to stay here. For instance, I doubt players are as in love with Kepler's and Polanco's as this fan base seems to be. Maybe it was fair. I dunno. Wouldn't doubt if it costs us other extensions going forward.