Twins place Gibson on 10-day IL

[Doomtints]

 

Oversimplification in my opinion. Not every team is in position to buy. Not every team has the same issues with rotation. Not every team has the prospect capital the Twins have. In terms of what we saw go down, it does not appear that asking prices were too high. It appears that demand was low. Theoretically this should lower asking prices. Except the Twins were rightfully trying to acquire pitchers with controllable years. We were fixated on the current market while sellers were comparing to a future market.

 

If you look at runs allowed, there are 4 teams better than the Twins in the AL and 5 in the NL.

 

One of those AL teams won't make the playoffs, and one of the other three will drop in the wild card game.

 

In the NL, the only team the Twins could face with worse pitching is the Braves, but there's some DH run deflation going on the NL.

 

I'm not saying the Twins did enough to bring in more pitching -- almost all of us agree they didn't -- but I can understand why the team may have been looking at spreadsheets and decided they didn't have to do more than they did. They looked at "being better than most of the league" instead of "being the best." If they believe the future Twins offense will be even better than this year's record-setting offense is, their decision makes sense. However, I think most of us realize this is unlikely.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

If you look at runs allowed, there are 4 teams better than the Twins in the AL and 5 in the NL.

 

One of those AL teams won't make the playoffs, and one of the other three will drop in the wild card game.

 

In the NL, the only team the Twins could face with worse pitching is the Braves, but there's some DH run deflation going on the NL.

 

I'm not saying the Twins did enough to bring in more pitching -- almost all of us agree they didn't -- but I can understand why the team may have been looking at spreadsheets and decided they didn't have to do more than they did. They looked at "being better than most of the league" instead of "being the best." If they believe the future Twins offense will be even better than this year's record-setting offense is, their decision makes sense. However, I think most of us realize this is unlikely.

This only reinforces the point that "if a starter wasn't traded, it wasn't due to the Twins refusing to pay market value".

 

In the 11 games leading up to the deadline, the Yankees gave up 84 (!!!!!!!!!!) runs. Yet despite having one of the better farm systems in baseball, they did not acquire a starter.

 

Teams need starters every deadline. The only contending team that landed a good one is Houston, who took on massive salary to do it (and good for them).

 

So at what point do we stop looking at one corner of the world, basing an opinion on it, and start looking at the entirety of the picture, where only one contending team landed a starter worth mentioning?

 

Call it "oversimplification" if you want but I call it a pretty obvious example of teams asking too much and getting burned for it because no one actually moved.

[Doomtints]

I agree, there are many plausible reasons the Twins didn't do more than they did.

 

Most of us disagree, but we are biased as we have been wanting more pitching for a very long time. And if the Twins don't come home with rings this fall, we can all predict the conversation.

[Linus]

It seems to me that Gibson was throwing more 4 seamers up in the zone when he was successful. His last few starts seem to be all sinkers down

[Crackedfungo]

 

This only reinforces the point that "if a starter wasn't traded, it wasn't due to the Twins refusing to pay market value".

 

In the 11 games leading up to the deadline, the Yankees gave up 84 (!!!!!!!!!!) runs. Yet despite having one of the better farm systems in baseball, they did not acquire a starter.

 

Teams need starters every deadline. The only contending team that landed a good one is Houston, who took on massive salary to do it (and good for them).

 

So at what point do we stop looking at one corner of the world, basing an opinion on it, and start looking at the entirety of the picture, where only one contending team landed a starter worth mentioning?

 

Call it "oversimplification" if you want but I call it a pretty obvious example of teams asking too much and getting burned for it because no one actually moved.

This point is 'spot on'.  If we overpaid for a starter, and had the same results as the winter teams that acquired the best relief pitchers (whom were almost a universal mess), this site would be out with their pitchforks.  There were not good/great deals to be had, as proven by all teams seeking SP depth.  I am comfortable that Falvine knew what the 'ask price' was for some of our targets, and it was too much.  I am fine not losing a Graterol, Duran, Balazovic, plus an AK, Lewis, or Larnach for hope that they will perform better than what we have.  Minor was not better, nor was Stroman, and Thor would likely have cost 3 of the above.  Greinke was simply too expensive at his age (and I believe we needed his consent).  

[beckmt]

 

This is very interesting situation. The player wants to perform, especially since he is a free agent after this year. I would speculate that he has either minimized or withheld his discomfort to the staff and as Brock noted his performance has been league-average despite his illness. 

 

During today's game broadcast, Bremer said that Gibson is hoping to miss only one start. I suppose he has been hoping the symptoms would diminish, perhaps after his child arrived. But if he's feeling worse and worse, maybe he'll need more than one missed start.

 

A lot of guys are playing with nagging injuries. When do you say "enough" and when do you just keep playing through it?

This is not a disease you can play through.  It is incurable, and can only be controlled by various drugs (most of the very expensive).  You hope Gibson is one of the lucky ones, whose disease can be controlled and be able to live and compete normally with drugs.  A lot of factors in play here, but this could be career ending depending on if it is controllable or not.  If Gibson has one of the not easily controlled forms and if some of the issues with competing complicate things, this could be the end of his pitching career.  Did not like him as a pitcher, but this is something you do not wish on anyone. 

[Twodogs]

This only reinforces the point that "if a starter wasn't traded, it wasn't due to the Twins refusing to pay market value".

 

In the 11 games leading up to the deadline, the Yankees gave up 84 (!!!!!!!!!!) runs. Yet despite having one of the better farm systems in baseball, they did not acquire a starter.

 

Teams need starters every deadline. The only contending team that landed a good one is Houston, who took on massive salary to do it (and good for them).

 

So at what point do we stop looking at one corner of the world, basing an opinion on it, and start looking at the entirety of the picture, where only one contending team landed a starter worth mentioning?

 

Call it "oversimplification" if you want but I call it a pretty obvious example of teams asking too much and getting burned for it because no one actually moved.

Yeah there was little movement at the deadline by all teams including the Yankees. I'll get back to them in a second. I wonder if MLB thought getting rid of the Aug 31 waiver deadline was going to stimulate the actual July 31 deadline?? I think it actually slowed down all trades in my opinion because no one really knew if they were a player or not on July 31st. Just my thoughts. Yes the Yankees did not make any moves for a starter on July 31st, but they also have a guy like Severino, sitting on the IL that was projected and maybe still could come back and end up in the rotation. Not real likely right now but on July 31st it was a real possibility. Also with their bullpen they are still in way better shape than the Twins on paper because their bulpen is less in flux and on paper is better. So yeah many of the teams weren't sure where they sat in July and some of those teams even then knew they probably had some other options on the way, a la Severino.

[howeda7]

 

Ouch.

 

My wife, her sister, and her mom all have this. Her mom had her colon removed in the 90s, the others struggled with it until they went to a gluten-free diet.

 

Now, if they accidentally have gluten (typically from a restaurant), it comes back with a vengeance but at least it passes after a day or so.

 

There are drugs that can help this, like Humira, though Humira is very expensive. Humira essentally keeps the lights on at Abbvie, a company that employs over 20,000 people!

Taking a drug originally meant as a cancer treatment can't be fun though.

[Mike Sixel]

We should all remember this next year.... You can't just trade for guys at the deadline, they might not be available.

[IndianaTwin]

 

Incredibly mean spirited posts about a sick person. Wow.

 

 

Yeah, no kidding. A lot of tasteless posts in this thread.

 

I understand being frustrated with Gibson but after the way he pitched in 2017-2018, maybe starting the season with an E.Coli recovery, followed by this might explain some of his (relative) struggles.

 

And despite those struggles, he's pitching somewhere around league average overall.

 

Besides, basically saying "I'm GLAD Player X is sick" is pretty awful all around.

 

Thanks, Mike and Brock, for redeeming this thread and steering it back to helpful discussion. 

 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

This is very likely related to the E. Coli, but it could have taken time to manifest, That said, training staff can’t diagnose this. This is an issue for a GE doctor and a series of tests. It probably reached a point where he finally went to a doctor. You aren’t diagnosed with this and then live with it for the season. I’m giving him the benefit of a doubt.

or it could be something he has been able to keep under control for many years and the E. coli caused enough of a change that he has to make some new adjustments or need a different treatment.

[bdodge22]

I've had Ulcerative Colitis (diagnosed) since about 2008, but had mild symptoms for a couple of years before that. I never got the help I needed until it got really really bad. I even had a bad bout of travellers flu like him in 2009. I cringed when I read about Kyle's diagnosis because it sounds like he's trying to work through it now then test more after the season. There is no quick recovery to this, its years of not feeling great. I have tried 3 different medication regiments over the last 11 years and only recently feel like i've found remission. I just hope he sees a specialist and starts a round of treatment ASAP.