Endgame. Beware, here be spoilers.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Mike, in the movie one of his lead combatants said it would destroy his own troops.  Why would that be his first option?

 

It's cool not to like that fight, I'm just struggling with your reasons.

 

Fire before his troops land. Just kill the super heroes from space....Start shooting before they rush each other, you know, like the catapults should have done in that other show.....His combatant said that after they engaged.....why not soften up the other side before engaging?

 

And the good guys seemed to have no plan, which I guess makes some sense, since they didn't see this all coming. (somehow they all live thru a spaceship obliterating the building they were in. The Hulk, was he even in the fight? 

 

Nothing about that fight made sense, in the context of the universe it takes place in. 

[Mike Sixel]

Not sure this is clear, but that whole battle really took that movie from very good to good/ok for me.

 

I loved the setup, that you can't change time. I loved that Thanos found out, and was going to really change the universe this time. I was mostly good with the flashback scenes. I liked that Tony sacrificed himself, and Cap went back to live the life he wanted. But man, I really did not like that battle scene. It's probably my big issue with super hero stories......

[TheLeviathan]

 

Fire before his troops land. Just kill the super heroes from space....Start shooting before they rush each other, you know, like the catapults should have done in that other show.....His combatant said that after they engaged.....why not soften up the other side before engaging?

 

And the good guys seemed to have no plan, which I guess makes some sense, since they didn't see this all coming. (somehow they all live thru a spaceship obliterating the building they were in. The Hulk, was he even in the fight? 

 

Nothing about that fight made sense, in the context of the universe it takes place in. 

 

His troops were on the ground before the other side showed up.  Thanos showed up in force and the good guy reinforcement showed up on the battlefield second via basically teleportation.

 

I think you may be misremembering the sequence of events.

 

Plus, part of Thanos' character is the conquerer/the cleanser.  He's demonstrated time and again that he likes the actual battle and there is an ego about his methods.

[Mike Sixel]

 

His troops were on the ground before the other side showed up.  Thanos showed up in force and the good guy reinforcement showed up on the battlefield second via basically teleportation.

 

I think you may be misremembering the sequence of events.

 

Plus, part of Thanos' character is the conquerer/the cleanser.  He's demonstrated time and again that he likes the actual battle and there is an ego about his methods.

 

I get all that. The good guy reinforcements showed up before the bad guys charged, but they were on the ground already, yes.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I get all that. The good guy reinforcements showed up before the bad guys charged, but they were on the ground already, yes.

 

I just watched the clip online again to make sure I wasn't misremembering.  Cap says "Assemble", everyone roars, and both sides charge.  They basically walked through portals and into a fight.

[Badsmerf]

After reflecting on this a bit, I think my expectations and preferences are skewed. My all time favorite movie is Fight Club, and I lean heavily toward the twisted cerebral type movies.

 

The fight scenes aren't gritty enough for me. There is too much powered and not enough puff. I like seeing the good guys fall, like vThor drinking too much beer and getting fat. I wanted to see Thanos take out some super heroes. He is a bad ass after all.... I wanted more drama, more uncertainty, more guessing, more chaos... I wanted a movie that kept me on the edge of my seat. This one didn't deliver. And its ok if my opinion isn't shared by everyone.

[Mike Sixel]

I just watched the clip online again to make sure I wasn't misremembering. Cap says "Assemble", everyone roars, and both sides charge. They basically walked through portals and into a fight.

We aren't going to agree about that battle.

[TheLeviathan]

 

We aren't going to agree about that battle.

 

That's fine, I'm just pointing out that at least some of your complaints weren't accurate to the battle's depiction.

[Mike Sixel]

That's fine, I'm just pointing out that at least some of your complaints weren't accurate to the battle's depiction.

The good guys can charge and the bag guys can open fire while they run across a field. Nothing changes about my thoughts on not using the guns. Hell, why wait for so the gates to open? Just start shooting.

[TheLeviathan]

 

The good guys can charge and the bag guys can open fire while they run across a field. Nothing changes about my thoughts on not using the guns. Hell, why wait for so the gates to open? Just start shooting.

 

The order to shoot came from one of the Black Order taking the command from Thanos and relaying it.  It's not like they stopped shooting to rush the battlefield, it wasn't part of the plan until it had to be.

 

And, again, why that's the case is because Thanos has a certain degree of arrogance having conquered "thousands" of planets.  He enjoys the combat, why would he rob himself of it?

 

It's clear you didn't like it.  That's fine, but those elements fit with the way the battle was depicted and the characters in it.  Nothing you are arguing is necessary or, at times, accurate to the battle itself.  As someone who liked it, I'm not going to agree with what I find to be unfounded or misrepresented criticisms.

 

Battle didn't do it for you.  Cool.  It did for me, we can leave it at that.

[Mike Sixel]

Which is what I said earlier. Cool.

[gunnarthor]

 

The good guys can charge and the bag guys can open fire while they run across a field. Nothing changes about my thoughts on not using the guns. Hell, why wait for so the gates to open? Just start shooting.

It's a comic book movie. Why on earth, after 20+ movies, did you think people were going to die? Why would you want that? Kids - boys and girls - watch these movies and find role models. They generally see uplifting stories and characters choosing to do good things and getting rewarded for that. They don't need an "Avengers: Rogue One."

[Mike Sixel]

It's a comic book movie. Why on earth, after 20+ movies, did you think people were going to die? Why would you want that? Kids - boys and girls - watch these movies and find role models. They generally see uplifting stories and characters choosing to do good things and getting rewarded for that. They don't need an "Avengers: Rogue One."

Some characters have died along the way. And this was end game, the ultimate battle for this group. You know, like moving in on Star Wars, which kids also watch. I don't expect you to agree,I pointed out what I didn't like.

 

I don't get the anger from you and Levi about me wanting something different in a movie.....

[TheLeviathan]

Some characters have died along the way. And this was end game, the ultimate battle for this group. You know, like moving in on Star Wars, which kids also watch. I don't expect you to agree,I pointed out what I didn't like.

I don't get the anger from you and Levi about me wanting something different in a movie.....

I'm not mad, I just don't like that you were inaccurate in your criticisms.

 

It's one thing to say "I don't like the diminished fantasy elements in GOT" it's another thing to say you didn't like the way the unicorns died at winterfell.

[Mike Sixel]

I'm not mad, I just don't like that you were inaccurate in your criticisms.

 

It's one thing to say "I don't like the diminished fantasy elements in GOT" it's another thing to say you didn't like the way the unicorns died at winterfell.

How am I wrong that the bad guys could fire from space and not land? Or wondering how no one died when a building was obliterated? Or why the bad guys didn't open fire when the gates started opening, or before charging? Or why not one good guy died in a massive battle with super powerful enemies? Or how every female character ended up in one spot in the middle of a massive, unplanned, battle?

[TheLeviathan]

 

How am I wrong that the bad guys could fire from space and not land? Or wondering how no one died when a building was obliterated? Or why the bad guys didn't open fire when the gates started opening, or before charging? Or why not one good guy died in a massive battle with super powerful enemies? Or how every female character ended up in one spot in the middle of a massive, unplanned, battle?

 

I've only called out one of these for some inaccuracies and I think I laid out my disagreements on that front.  

 

As a way to show you that I read those other criticisms and simply nodded at them respectfully (and didn't respond to them), was the all female moment.  I know a lot of people popped for it, I did not.  For me it wasn't the particular thing you pointed out (though, that's fair too), my issue was.....why the hell does Captain Marvel need help?  We literally just saw her fly through a spaceship.  She doesn't need help.  That ruined the moment for me. 

[Mike Sixel]

 

I've only called out one of these for some inaccuracies and I think I laid out my disagreements on that front.  

 

As a way to show you that I read those other criticisms and simply nodded at them respectfully (and didn't respond to them), was the all female moment.  I know a lot of people popped for it, I did not.  For me it wasn't the particular thing you pointed out (though, that's fair too), my issue was.....why the hell does Captain Marvel need help?  We literally just saw her fly through a spaceship.  She doesn't need help.  That ruined the moment for me. 

 

Ya, she's one of those all powerful ones that is hard to work around. Hell, she can fly through a ship, but not Thanos?

 

I wish the Scarlet Witch had succeeded at killing Thanos, that would have been great. There were ways for Tony and Captain America to move on even within that. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Ya, she's one of those all powerful ones that is hard to work around. Hell, she can fly through a ship, but not Thanos?

 

I wish the Scarlet Witch had succeeded at killing Thanos, that would have been great. There were ways for Tony and Captain America to move on even within that. 

Thanos being alive doesn't change the need for Tony's snap and there were a bunch of ways to still require its immediacy (eg. Thanos implementing a "scorched earth" measure upon his death).

[Mike Sixel]

Thanos being alive doesn't change the need for Tony's snap and there were a bunch of ways to still require its immediacy (eg. Thanos implementing a "scorched earth" measure upon his death).

Right. So he could die even if she won the fight. That would have been a good moment for female power, imo

[Badsmerf]

In the comics was she bad ass? Why would she be able to handle Thanos by herself?

 

I always find it strange that super heroes that can manipulate matter can ever have a close battle. Unless he is made of a antimatter...

[Brock Beauchamp]

In the comics was she bad ass? Why would she be able to handle Thanos by herself?

 

I always find it strange that super heroes that can manipulate matter can ever have a close battle. Unless he is made of a antimatter...

Thanos is incredibly powerful. Captain Marvel is incredibly powerful. It’d be an interesting fight but Thanos could take her.

 

Seriously, the films did a lackluster job of explaining how powerful Thanos is without the stones.

 

Examples:

 

- I’d put the Surfer slightly more powerful than Captain Marvel. Thanos has beat down the Surfer a few times

 

- Thanos once withstood the full power of the Phoenix Force, which is nigh unstoppable

[Mike Sixel]

Thanos is incredibly powerful. Captain Marvel is incredibly powerful. It’d be an interesting fight but Thanos could take her.

 

Seriously, the films did a lackluster job of explaining how powerful Thanos is without the stones.

 

Examples:

 

- I’d put the Surfer slightly more powerful than Captain Marvel. Thanos has beat down the Surfer a few times

 

- Thanos once withstood the full power of the Phoenix Force, which is nigh unstoppable

Ya, the movies did not make that clear.

[gunnarthor]

 

Thanos is incredibly powerful. Captain Marvel is incredibly powerful. It’d be an interesting fight but Thanos could take her.

Seriously, the films did a lackluster job of explaining how powerful Thanos is without the stones.

Examples:

- I’d put the Surfer slightly more powerful than Captain Marvel. Thanos has beat down the Surfer a few times

- Thanos once withstood the full power of the Phoenix Force, which is nigh unstoppable

But can he take squirrel girl? 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

My hope is that the next phase is Doom being Doom and the ultimate reveal is the Fantastic Four emerging from their 1960s trip to the Negative Zone at the end of phase four (is it four now, can't actually remember).

 

We need a good Fantastic Four movie. And if Marvel bows to fan pressure and casts John Krazinski as Mister Fantastic and Emily Blunt as Susan Storm, my 14 year old self might explode in pure glee.

 

As for the X-Men, I honestly don't care much. We've seen them done very well in film and very badly in film. And, more importantly, their history is so convoluted that it can't really exist in the same universe as anyone else. And the X-Men operate best in a universe that's just silly and ridiculous. 

 

Thanks, Claremont. That may come off as snark but seriously, thanks. He wrote a layered universe that was full of intrigue and complexity but basically ruined it for anyone else who wanted to play in it, much less actually merge that mini-universe into something else and keep it coherent.

 

Perhaps so, but they have to explain how Steve Rodgers and Johnny Storm are the same person.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

When the the entire plot is given away in 5 minutes, yes, it's predictable. Waving the characters in was done well. I was never into comics, so don't really care about the fanboy stuff. If that is what everyone wanted, and everyone else loved it, I digress.

 

I would argue that the plot was given away the moment Dr. Strange told Stark that giving Thanos the time stone was the only way... 

 

Sorry, but time travel was pretty obvious one it was clear they were going to lose the Infinity War.

[diehardtwinsfan]

So... I skipped the Twins game today and caught the matinee to see this for the first time (side note, haven't seen Captian Marvel quite yet, but everything else, and I've never read the comics)...

 

My 2 cents.

 

• There were two emotional scenes. The first was when my two favorite characters literally fought for the right to die to get the soul stone. I wanted those two to finish out on top, and I could less who else died, so watching Black Widow earn the right to die sucked (side note, I hope the Black Widow movie has Clint in it. I really want to know what Budapest was all about). Oh, and they played the exact same score from when Thanos killed Gamora to get the stone, overlaying the same pose, and everything... kind of annoying.  The second was watching Strange lead all the dead through the portals to make it a fair fight. 
• The beginning was dull and progressed painfully slow. The five years part was lame. I suppose it's easy to explain since it was a rat that freed antman, but these are some pretty powerful people that seemed quite content to just give up... and they spent way too much time on the giving up side of things. 
• For being super powerful, Thanos "dies" quite easily in the beginning. That could have been a better fight to fit Brock's point about his power. A better fight there followed by a lot less self pity would have been nicer.
• I'm not sure why people are making a big deal about CA going back to his old flame. That's exactly what he would have done in that scenario. I don't think there was much special about that.
• I'm still missing, however, what CA suddenly got that allowed him to use the Hammer and the Axe. In real time, I'm going, "what the eff just happened?"
• Not having yet seen Captain Marvel, I'm still impressed by her power and how little she chose to use it. The "he hasn't faced me yet" says a lot about her confidence and what not, but then she's pretty useless, until she single handedly destroys his ship and half his army. Just odd.
• Oh, and Wanda... Love me some Wanda. Probably my 3rd favorite avenger (loved her and Jeremy Renner in Indian River too). It was pretty cool watching her get the ultimate revenge on Thanos... speaking of people whose power is consistently understated.... she was one of them. Not sure how she stacked up in the comics, but her mind ability should have dwarfed most of the rest.

Overall, it was pretty good. I was expecting this to be the end of them, but it's setup so that most of them are alive and can still do something if someone came up with a good story.

[diehardtwinsfan]

side note, but watching The Lion King previews without Elton John is well...weird.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Thanos dying: yeah, should have been a better fight but they also got the drop on him and I suspect he was severely weakened from destroying the stones. Half his body was torn to shreds.

 

Rogers hinted he could use Mjolnir in Avengers 2 by making it move. What changed? Dunno, and not sure if it matters really.

 

Also, the axe (Stormbreaker) does not operate under the rules of Mjolnir.

[Craig Arko]

[Squirrel]

I have yet to see the movie ... didn't want to spend any money during the strike, and post strike have just been so, so, so busy ... but ... am going tomorrow ...