Vikings Off-Season Thread

[Badsmerf]

Right. The good Cousins is pretty damn good. The bad Cousins is just meh, not throw beer bottles on the field. If a so-so year from Cousins (which I think this year was) is still a top 10 qb in the NFL, that is pretty valuable. He doesn't change games like Wilson, or throw people open, but the Vikings could do worse... like draft another Ponder, T Jack, Bridgewater. Or even, just let Spielman try to draft another qb.

[Vanimal46]

Priefer is not returning as special teams coach. Good riddance.

[diehardtwinsfan]

Priefer is gone

[diehardtwinsfan]

my offseason plan

 

http://purplepainforums.com/thread/1700/diehards-offseason-plan

[TheLeviathan]

Good, glad Priefer is out.

[TheLeviathan]

 

my offseason plan

 

http://purplepainforums.com/thread/1700/diehards-offseason-plan

 

It's good, I think Rudolph is free to cut this year.  Am I wrong about that?

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

It's good, I think Rudolph is free to cut this year.  Am I wrong about that?

I might try and restructure him, but he's a lousy blocker and falls as soon as he's touched. Flip side is that the guy seems to be able to catch passes which strangely enough seems to be pretty difficult to find TEs outside of Gronk that can do it.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I might try and restructure him, but he's a lousy blocker and falls as soon as he's touched. Flip side is that the guy seems to be able to catch passes which strangely enough seems to be pretty difficult to find TEs outside of Gronk that can do it.

 

Except we didn't throw to him much at all.  I'd rather spend a 2nd or 3rd round pick on an athlete.  

 

There is no dead cap to cut him, the Vikes have all the leverage.  

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Except we didn't throw to him much at all.  I'd rather spend a 2nd or 3rd round pick on an athlete.  

 

There is no dead cap to cut him, the Vikes have all the leverage.  

 

I'm not against that, but I'm not sure we have the bullets to replace everyone either. To me, the big question will be what you can get by trading a CB, which I think they should do. If you can get an OG in a similar situation to Rhodes, I probably do it and then you can get that TE. The way I see it though, they need 2 new starting guards, and I'd prefer to have an OT in there was well. By my math, at least 2 of their first four picks need to go to the line, and preferably 3. It's a DT heavy draft. That's a need as well, so I suspect they will take a DT high... I certainly would. Bottom line is you're running out of places to grab said TE.

 

Perhaps they can get a 2nd and 4th for Rhodes... if that's the case, they can grab a DT in round one (which I'm not a fan of, but we all know it will happen) and two OGs in round 2. They can get the T/TE in rounds 3 and 4. I'd be happy there as well. 

 

The real question not answered is whether or not Conklin can be the guy... he looked pretty good against Miami (then again, the whole team did for once)… but was pretty much non-existent otherwise. Is that b/c Rudy was noticeably better or b/c we went with the guy we paid? I don't know that answer. 

[TheLeviathan]

 

I'm not against that, but I'm not sure we have the bullets to replace everyone either. To me, the big question will be what you can get by trading a CB, which I think they should do. If you can get an OG in a similar situation to Rhodes, I probably do it and then you can get that TE. The way I see it though, they need 2 new starting guards, and I'd prefer to have an OT in there was well. By my math, at least 2 of their first four picks need to go to the line, and preferably 3. It's a DT heavy draft. That's a need as well, so I suspect they will take a DT high... I certainly would. Bottom line is you're running out of places to grab said TE.

 

Perhaps they can get a 2nd and 4th for Rhodes... if that's the case, they can grab a DT in round one (which I'm not a fan of, but we all know it will happen) and two OGs in round 2. They can get the T/TE in rounds 3 and 4. I'd be happy there as well. 

 

The real question not answered is whether or not Conklin can be the guy... he looked pretty good against Miami (then again, the whole team did for once)… but was pretty much non-existent otherwise. Is that b/c Rudy was noticeably better or b/c we went with the guy we paid? I don't know that answer. 

 

Well, I guess it depends on how much we want to use our TE.  With the volume we feed Theilen and Diggs, overpaying at TE may not be a wise allocation of resources.  Morgan is a good blocker and Conklin was supposed to have receiving chops.  I'd consider taking a good athlete in the third round and calling that position set.  If Rudolph wants to cut his salary in half to stay?  Sure, for one year that's fine.  

 

I'd like Cody Ford at 18.  He's not Quentin Nelson (let's face it, no one will be for another 20 years), but he's a big mauler.  After I watched the OK-AL game I went and looked up all of those linemen from OK.  I thought they did really well against the Alabama front.  He's handled the pass protection at tackle and he swallows people alive.  He has some serious nasty to him.  Check this and this out.  (The guy next to him - Samia -  in that one clip is also available!)

 

Ford is the guy.  In the second round I'd like a lineman as well, but after last year's run it is really hard to even try to predict who might still be there.  3/4 round is when I'd like to take a stab at DT, TE, and maybe another RB.  (Here's an early in the process RB I like a lot: David Montgomery from Iowa State.)

[Vanimal46]

It wouldn't be the worst thing to restructure Rudolph, but he may be insulted with my walk away price. He'd need to be $3 million or less for me to be interested. Otherwise I'm letting Conklin take the role, or pursue another bounce back cheap FA like Tyler Eifert.

[Vanimal46]

And yes, if Cody Ford is there at 18 he's the pick, no doubt. We desperately need a Mauler like him to create running lanes for Cook.

[Badsmerf]

I like Montgomery a bunch too, watched him a lot this year. I also really like Purdy... Iowa State is going to be pretty good in the coming years.

 

Levi hit the nail on the head about TE. You don't need to pay a lot for that position when you have Diggs, Thielen and Cook that should be getting 75% of the touches. The other players are there to keep the defense honest and exploit holes created by those guys. Rudolph had more targets at the end of the year, but the dude is so slow his use is limited.

 

I like the idea of trading a CB. Waynes isn't going to get as much as you think, and I'm hesitant to trade Rhodes because he can go man to man against all WR in the league and provide good coverage. He isn't perfect, but does a solid job. If the return is good, you make the trade since it is a strength.

 

The biggest needs to me are o line, lb, d line.

[TheLeviathan]

Rams gave up a 2 and a 4 for Peters, is that good with you guys? It might be for me.

[Mike Sixel]

Rams gave up a 2 and a 4 for Peters, is that good with you guys? It might be for me.

For Waynes or Rhodes? Probably. If you believe in Hill and Hughes, yes. Get more DL and OL.

[Badsmerf]

For Waynes or Rhodes? Probably. If you believe in Hill and Hughes, yes. Get more DL and OL.

I think so too. Rhodes might only have 2-3 more good years before he begins to decline. Or maybe he is able to play later because speed isn't what his game depends on. Either way, trade from a position of strength to improve areas that are causing the team to lose.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I think so too. Rhodes might only have 2-3 more good years before he begins to decline. Or maybe he is able to play later because speed isn't what his game depends on. Either way, trade from a position of strength to improve areas that are causing the team to lose.

 

I guess it depends if you can get someone to part with their 2nd round pick this year.  I think if it's like the Peters trade and it's a 4 now and a future 2, I ask to flip that or I don't part with one of those guys.

 

But I think this team can go with Waynes/Rhodes, Hughes, Alexander, and Hill is fine.  Go ahead and snag another corner in the 5th/6th round too.  

 

That extra pick helps us address what we need at LB, OL, DT, or TE.  You can get a starter in the second or third round at those positions.

[gunnarthor]

Looking at some of the offenses out there and it might be that we need to just start having more DB hybrids than linebackers and defenses playing more dime coverages. Whatever you say about Zimmer, the guy can coach and find DBs. 

 

I still don't think the Vikes are that far away. They need an O-line and I think they need some help on the D-line, too, but they are close.

[Mr. Brooks]

The four best offenses in the NFL are the four remaining teams. Defense doesn't get it done anymore. Just another reason I think they should have moved on from Zimmer.

[Vanimal46]

I thought Brady was having a down year? Should have known NE is sneaky good at offense again this year.

 

There's certainly a blueprint the NFL is following to win a Super Bowl...

 

- Have a QB on a rookie contract or severely depressed contract value (Brady and Brees)

 

- Surround them with multiple playmakers.

 

- Create a defense good enough to generate lots of turnovers.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Well, I guess it depends on how much we want to use our TE.  With the volume we feed Theilen and Diggs, overpaying at TE may not be a wise allocation of resources.  Morgan is a good blocker and Conklin was supposed to have receiving chops.  I'd consider taking a good athlete in the third round and calling that position set.  If Rudolph wants to cut his salary in half to stay?  Sure, for one year that's fine.  

 

I'd like Cody Ford at 18.  He's not Quentin Nelson (let's face it, no one will be for another 20 years), but he's a big mauler.  After I watched the OK-AL game I went and looked up all of those linemen from OK.  I thought they did really well against the Alabama front.  He's handled the pass protection at tackle and he swallows people alive.  He has some serious nasty to him.  Check this and this out.  (The guy next to him - Samia -  in that one clip is also available!)

 

Ford is the guy.  In the second round I'd like a lineman as well, but after last year's run it is really hard to even try to predict who might still be there.  3/4 round is when I'd like to take a stab at DT, TE, and maybe another RB.  (Here's an early in the process RB I like a lot: David Montgomery from Iowa State.)

I'd love Ford at 18... Not sure he falls that far... we might have to swap some picks and get ahead of a team or two to get him...

 

Morgan can catch passes. Is it just that he doesn't run routes b/c of Rudolf or that he's generally not good at it and isn't sent out much?

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

And yes, if Cody Ford is there at 18 he's the pick, no doubt. We desperately need a Mauler like him to create running lanes for Cook.

 

Only real nock against Ford is that he isn't out of the big 10. Seems like they tend to produce the best linemen. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

I think so too. Rhodes might only have 2-3 more good years before he begins to decline. Or maybe he is able to play later because speed isn't what his game depends on. Either way, trade from a position of strength to improve areas that are causing the team to lose.

 

I would argue that decline phase has already begun. He wasn't nearly as good this year as before and the convenient injuries seem to be getting worse. I don't see them getting a boatload of picks for Rhodes, but I'd take a guard or tackle straight up  or a 2nd/4th as suggested, knowing we could pull off another starting lineman in the 2nd.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I'd love Ford at 18... Not sure he falls that far... we might have to swap some picks and get ahead of a team or two to get him...

 

Morgan can catch passes. Is it just that he doesn't run routes b/c of Rudolf or that he's generally not good at it and isn't sent out much?

 

Steam is only starting to build on him.  Last I checked most scouting services clock him as an early second rounder.  Now, they said that about the kid Cincy picked last year too and he went about 10 picks higher than projected.  

 

I think once teams see Ford he'll start to rise up draft boards.  But higher than 18 might be a stretch.  A lot of front seven players are going to go early this year with what teams have seen in the value of pass rushers, DTs that can play the pass and the run, and what Roquan Smith brought to the Bears.    I think he's there at 18 and if we pick him, it could be a game changer for this team.

 

As for Morgan....I have no idea.  But I'm confident with him, Conklin, and a rookie next year.  After the line, our next biggest priority is a back IMO.  I don't feel Cook is a workhorse, 16 game back.

[Vanimal46]

Does Gary Kubiak do anything for you? Evidently he was in town interviewing with the Vikes. I wouldn't be opposed to him being the RB coach since Denver creates 1,000 yard rushers from nothing.

[diehardtwinsfan]

he got the job... along with his son and his old OL coach...

 

I like that Stefanski is getting another OC to be his right hand man... I think that's smart.

[TheLeviathan]

Bringing in a strong offensive mind to push back on Zimmer is a good thing IMO.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Bringing in a strong offensive mind to push back on Zimmer is a good thing IMO.

 

He's been a bit hands off. I think this allows him to continue to be hands off when it comes to offense.

 

I'm fine with that to an extent. I'm not sure he should be calling plays, though I'd love to know if the O and D minds sit down and talk about how they'd counter each other..

 

Bottom line is that the O needs to score more points. I really don't care if they run it or pass it. I do care when they sell out on just one of those as one dimensional offenses will have trouble scoring points over the course of a season. I also care when guys try and implement a philosophy that doesn't fit with the talents of the guys on the roster. I don't know at this point if Kubiak can be the guy to do that, but I think the best way to counter that is to ensure that you have a few talented offensive people around.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Does Gary Kubiak do anything for you? Evidently he was in town interviewing with the Vikes. I wouldn't be opposed to him being the RB coach since Denver creates 1,000 yard rushers from nothing.

 

Denver is one of those teams that has always had a good line. I'm convinced that they could plug just about any RB behind their line most years and get a decent performance... so yeah, bringing in someone who has worked in that system should help. They know how to build a line, and presumably, they know how to coach them too. 

 

Our line play was pretty bad last season. Some of that was talent. Some of that was coaching. It looks like they are working on the coaching piece, and hopefully we see some changes on the talent side through drafting, trades, and FA.

[TheLeviathan]

Denver has always used the zone blocking scheme like we switched to a few years ago.  Kubiak is something of a guru on that.

 

So it could be a boost to the o-line too.