C.J. Cron

[Doomtints]

1) Why the heck did the Rays waive C.J. Cron?

2) Looks like the Twins have their first baseman ... and gave up nothing to get him.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/25385230/minnesota-twins-claim-slugger-cj-cron-waivers-tampa-rays

 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Do you think this ex-ray first base/DH will be better than the last to don a Twins uni?

[amjgt]

Projected $5.2M Salary

[Doomtints]

Baseball-Reference says the most similar player to C.J. Cron is .... Kennys Vargas.

 

Undervaluing home grown players is fun.

[Danchat]

Looks like a solid move to me, though it’s incredibly similar to signing Morrison. They get 2 years of control with his 2019 season costing around $5M. Seems like a smart move to me, and if he’s just a part time player, it’s still a fair price to pay.

[notoriousgod71]

Yuck.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Does this mean the end of Robbie Grossman for the Twins? I don't see how you can keep Austin, Cron, and Grossman on the same roster.

[Vanimal46]

Does this mean the end of Robbie Grossman for the Twins? I don't see how you can keep Austin, Cron, and Grossman on the same roster.

Maybe Austin gets the boot. I don't see the point in having 2 RH 1B players who are both out of options... Especially if flexibility is important to the roster.

[Doomtints]

He looks like a very good pick up.

 

1) Over his career he has been good v. both lefties and righties, but in 2018 he started to dominate lefties.

 

2) He plays very well in Target Field.

 

3) He massacres average and below pitchers, and can hold his own v. the power pitchers.

 

Three teams in one year for him, though ... how is his personality?

[darin617]

 

Does this mean the end of Robbie Grossman for the Twins? I don't see how you can keep Austin, Cron, and Grossman on the same roster.

We can only hope this means the end of Grossman.

[DocBauer]

Maybe Austin gets the boot. I don't see the point in having 2 RH 1B players who are both out of options... Especially if flexibility is important to the roster.

A valid point to be sure. But unless I'm mistaken, Austin initially played much more OF before transitioning to 1B. Between 1B/DH and a spare OF, there could be room for both.

 

Honestly, could Austin be worse defensively than Grossman?

[Brandon]

Maybe Austin gets the boot. I don't see the point in having 2 RH 1B players who are both out of options... Especially if flexibility is important to the roster.

I think this will get figured out in spring training. So no one will be released before then. Cron has decent power but poor OBP skills. Same with Austin but Austin has more power and less OBP skills.

[DocBauer]

He looks like a very good pick up.

 

1) Over his career he has been good v. both lefties and righties, but in 2018 he started to dominate lefties.

 

2) He plays very well in Target Field.

 

3) He massacres average and below pitchers, and can hold his own v. the power pitchers.

 

Three teams in one year for him, though ... how is his personality?

As I pointed out in another thread, his offensive numbers are solid but not great. However, his best season was last year when he got over 400AB for the first time. There could be something here.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

 

Maybe Austin gets the boot. I don't see the point in having 2 RH 1B players who are both out of options... Especially if flexibility is important to the roster.

or Maybe Austin gets some additional gloves - he played 3B and OF in the minor leagues and OF for the Yankees

[Vanimal46]

A valid point to be sure. But unless I'm mistaken, Austin initially played much more OF before transitioning to 1B. Between 1B/DH and a spare OF, there could be room for both.

 

Honestly, could Austin be worse defensively than Grossman?

He's played less than 20 games in the OF since 2016 so it sounds like Austin playing in the OF is wishful thinking. He only played 1B/DH during his time with the Twins.

[bird]

Not exactly on point, but I thought it was interesting when I delved into this:

 

Cron was the 17th selection in that notoriously shallow 2011 draft class. You know, the one where te Twins stupidly chose Levi Michael with the 30th pick, something an astute, analytics-savvy, forward-thinking organization like the Rays would never do, right?

 

So then, I see that the Rays had 10 out of the first 60 picks in that draft. Nine out of the ten were complete flops. The exception was Blake Snell at #24. In the Ray's defense, all of those were later selections like Levi was, so...

 

Sonny Gray was the next selection after Cron.

[SomeGuy]

There are a ton of cheap options when it comes to players like this.  Even our own Tyler Austin was one example, 2 months of a poorly performing pitcher netted us years of control over a decent 1B/DH.

 

I like how Fangraphs puts it.

His just isn’t a highly-valued skillset. That’s ultimately what this comes down to. A team could go out and get C.J. Cron pretty cheap. It could go out and get, say, Wilmer Flores pretty cheap. It could probably get Eric Thames pretty cheap. Justin Bour was reportedly waived by the Phillies. Teams are looking for well-rounded players. Cron isn’t a well-rounded player. He’s good enough to have in the lineup, but he’s no one’s Plan A, and he’s not a player for teams to build around.

 

[Doomtints]

 

There are a ton of cheap options when it comes to players like this.  Even our own Tyler Austin was one example, 2 months of a poorly performing pitcher netted us years of control over a decent 1B/DH.

 

I like how Fangraphs puts it.

His just isn’t a highly-valued skillset. That’s ultimately what this comes down to. A team could go out and get C.J. Cron pretty cheap. It could go out and get, say, Wilmer Flores pretty cheap. It could probably get Eric Thames pretty cheap. Justin Bour was reportedly waived by the Phillies. Teams are looking for well-rounded players. Cron isn’t a well-rounded player. He’s good enough to have in the lineup, but he’s no one’s Plan A, and he’s not a player for teams to build around.

 

I don't like how fangraphs puts it. Who is the actual author of that bizarre opinion?

[SomeGuy]

 

I don't like how fangraphs puts it. Who is the actual author of that bizarre opinion?

Jeff Sullivan.  He basically says the Rays tried to trade him and couldn't.  They were confident that the other options they had made him expendable.  They had a roster crunch and thought he was the most replaceable.  They have Ji-Man Choi who is very similar statistically and still at league minimum.

[Mike Sixel]

Put up double Mauer's WAR for 1/10th the cost last year. I don't know how the roster crunch works, and he'll double his pay to around 5-6MM I'd guess, but why not? 

[mike8791]

Can hardly fault the FO for this move.  Looks like good value but not a game changer(and maybe not much better than Austin).

 

Of more interest is what this first move of the offseason might indicate.  If you can believe MLBTR, the Twins have also shown some interest in Sonny Gray and JA Happ.  If accurate, going after another #4 0r #5 starter gives little indication the Twins are going big this offseason.  Coupled with the Cron signing and Donaldson going to Atlanta this "news" shows bargain basement thinking.  Is the ghost of TR still there?

 

Many on TD will applaud this strategy but I, for one, question whether kicking the ball down the road is the right way.  I don't want to jump to early conclusions, as the hot stove league will heat up much more over the next 2-3 weeks, but reading the tea leaves so far, including Pohlad's comment about not spending the money freed up this offseason, one has to question the FO's willingness to challenge for the playoffs in 2019.  Let's hope they can at least exceed last offseason's efforts!

[Doomtints]

 

Jeff Sullivan.  He basically says the Rays tried to trade him and couldn't.  They were confident that the other options they had made him expendable.  They had a roster crunch and thought he was the most replaceable.  They have Ji-Man Choi who is very similar statistically and still at league minimum.

 

That sounds like the Rays being the Rays and not a knock on Cron.

[SomeGuy]

 

That sounds like the Rays being the Rays and not a knock on Cron.

Its not meant to be a knock on Cron or the Rays.  Its just that there are plenty of players just like Cron.  This is evident by no one trading anything for him.  How many teams decided not to claim him before he fell to us?

[Doomtints]

 

Its not meant to be a knock on Cron or the Rays.  Its just that there are plenty of players just like Cron.  This is evident by no one trading anything for him.  How many teams decided not to claim him before he fell to us?

 

That's a red herring. He is an upgrade for the Twins and we have no idea what the Rays were asking for in return!

 

Sure, he might not hit 30 home runs again. If the Rays were trying to trade him as if he would, yeah, I wouldn't make that trade either.

 

But pick him up for nothing? Sign me up!

[SomeGuy]

 

That's a red herring. He is an upgrade for the Twins and we have no idea what the Rays were asking for in return!

 

Sure, he might not hit 30 home runs again. If the Rays were trying to trade him as if he would, yeah, I wouldn't make that trade either.

Why would the Rays demand anything substantial in a trade or try to sell him as a 30 HR player if they were going to let him go on waivers for nothing?  They would have taken any minor leaguer in our system.

 

It is an upgrade over Robbie Grossman but the downside is we are using two roster spots for two very similar players.  Maybe signing an additional Relief pitcher instead would have moved the needle further.  As it stands we are at 39 players, 38 if Grossman is non tendered.  At minimum, we still need a 2B and a couple relievers IMO.  We might be in the same spot as the Rays where we are deciding which players we lose and get nothing for.

[Doomtints]

 

Why would the Rays demand anything substantial in a trade or try to sell him as a 30 HR player if they were going to let him go on waivers for nothing?  They would have taken any minor leaguer in our system.

 

Teams to to sell high all the time.The Twins were trying to shop Dozier as if he would hit 40 home runs again, and of course he didn't.

 

It's hard to make a cogent response to this question really, because we saw the Twins try to do the same thing very recently and I know you can remember it. Dozier isn't expensive and the Twins still couldn't unload him at his peak because everyone was rightfully skeptical of his 1-year jump.

[SomeGuy]

 

Teams to to sell high all the time.The Twins were trying to shop Dozier as if he would hit 40 home runs again, and of course he didn't.

 

It's hard to make a cogent response to this question really, because we saw the Twins try to do the same thing very recently and I know you can remember it. Dozier isn't expensive and the Twins still couldn't unload him at his peak because everyone was rightfully skeptical of his 1-year jump.

I don't think Dozier compares to this situation.  The Rays were in a situation where they were going to trade him, or waive him.  There wasn't a situation where he would be in the Rays lineup 2019. When Dozier didn't get the package we wanted, he was still our 2B for the next 2 years.  We didn't try to trade him because we wanted to get rid of him, we wanted to see what we could get for him.

[DocBauer]

No matter how good, or poor, this plays out, it was a good move. There is an opening at 1B and you bring in a 1B with experience, some production, at a low cost, without trading and prospects, with no long term obligation.

 

What's not to like here?

 

And his best season, this far, was last year. The first year he got more than 409AB if I recall correctly. I think he's only 28?

 

Smart and no risk.

[Vanimal46]

There's always risks with every 40 man move. The risk is not having room to add players that fill other holes on roster, or letting a Derek Rodriguez type go for nothing because we have to keep 2 1B/DH types through the off-season.