Article: Twins Claim 1B CJ Cron

[PseudoSABR]

 

Austin, Kepler, Garver, Sano, Astudillo.....that's what I've said all off season. 

That's now 1B/LF/DH/3B/backup-C. That doesn't sound like any kind of upgrade.   Astudillo will be part of the team, one way or the other, but I think it's ridiculous to count on him (and Austin) as regulars.

Edited November 27, 2018 by PseudoSABR

[Winston Smith]

 

Or, they could spend $5MM more on their preferred SP.......

Mike the money isn't spent until the season starts. They can have Cron in training camp and owe him very little if they let him go part way thru camp. The $5MM is not spent money.

[PseudoSABR]

 

If he's so easy to cut, and offers so little, I don't see the point in adding him.  

 

I don't see how someone can know that roster spots are limited and budgets are finite and make this point?

 

He DOES have real costs.  And 5M is NOT marginal for many of the needs on this roster

That wasn't my point.  My point is that he's a low risk, and I don't believe his addition is at all preventive to any other signings, because of the flexibility with cutting him (like Grossman).  Keep the players until you have to cut them.  

 

How would you have felt about the Darnold signing?  If you're this irrate over non-guaranteed 5MM, how about guaranteed 23MM?

Edited November 27, 2018 by PseudoSABR

[Mike Sixel]

 

Option A DH only. 140 games.

Option B split DH/1B. 140 games. Average defense.

Option C split DH/1B. 140 games. Below average defense.

 

Depends.....if I think I can spend the money better on adding RP and SP, I probably roll the dice and play Austin, Kepler, Sano, Astudillo, Garver at 1B/DH when they aren't playing other positions.......it isn't as easy as choosing between those players, you also have to consider that there are only 25 roster spots, some players have options, and there are budget constraints.

 

Would you rather have Eovaldi or Corbin, or the next best pitcher that you can get for $5MM less than one of those two?

[TheLeviathan]

 

Mike the money isn't spent until the season starts. They can have Cron in training camp and owe him very little if they let him go part way thru camp. The $5MM is not spent money.

 

You must be new around here.  Sit down, grab something with some kick in it, make yourself a drink, and let me regal you with stories of the Pohlads.....

[Mike Sixel]

 

Mike the money isn't spent until the season starts. They can have Cron in training camp and owe him very little if they let him go part way thru camp. The $5MM is not spent money.

 

they have an off season budget, are they going over it, and keeping Cron around until they cut him later? That seems unlikely to me. Not how I imagine anyone running a business.

[PseudoSABR]

 

they have an off season budget, are they going over it, and keeping Cron around until they cut him later? That seems unlikely to me. Not how I imagine anyone running a business.

Or they decide Cron is worth the over-budget cost in Spring Training.  It seems smart to me.  I mean you're plan is to bring in no one to compete for 1b/DH...

[Mike Sixel]

 

Or they decide Cron is worth the over-budget cost in Spring Training.  It seems smart to me.  I mean you're plan is to bring in no one to compete for 1b/DH...

 

My plan was to add an OF that can also DH. Which I meant to add above, but I thought it was implied from my previous posts in this thread....

 

And, Garver is my nearly full time 1B, and Astudillo is my backup catcher. mostly. Some flexibility there. 

 

And, if Sano isn't great, all this is moot anyway, so he's DH some to rest him. 

 

 

Edited November 27, 2018 by Mike Sixel

[MABB1959]

Dumpster diving 101 again.  You can sugar coat it however you want but they get a player that an average to below average team doesn't want. How pathetic after getting rid of so much salary.

[snepp]

 

We Unix computer geeks will call it a Cron Job and get nothing but crickets and weird stares for our effort.

 

I laughed.

[MABB1959]

 

Boy, I'm surprised to see how much debate there's been over this move. It just makes too much sense to me to claim this guy for nothing and pay him $5M. The only thing the Twins have at 1B/DH is a post-hype prospect who's out of options... they can rotate at 1B and DH, there's plenty of room for the two of them. They don't have a DH option at the moment and I doubt they're signing Cruz. I think it's smart to have two guys with decently-high upsides.

 

I thought Twins Daily's thoughts on Tyler Austin were that he wasn't ready for a starting job and he strikes out too much... but it seems he has a lot more supporters than I thought. 2019 is going to be a big season for him. 

This is our debate every off-season while we watch other teams signing the good players and we have to debate over another "what if" player.  That is all we ever get and it doesn't look like it will change.  Imagine this headline and how awesome it would feel.  Twins sign Bryce Harper!

 

[jorgenswest]

You're paying 5M over 500k for an increase in OPS of .044.  You keep making his .800 OPS out to be significantly more than Austin.  Austin put up a .782 OPS.  I don't consider it worth 5M and a roster spot to up that to .816.  Especially since the two players play the same position.  

 

The majority of Cron's career has not been a .816 OPS player.  He was just DFA'd by the Rays.  I think counting on him to be a 30 HR, .800 OPS guy is fool's gold.  

 

The roster spot just used on Cron should've been used on a right-handed outfielder.  Not a limited corner infielder.  We have those.

It should be noted that Austin’s data is skewed up due to usage. Cron had a more typical usage with 30% of his plate appearances against lefties. Austin was at 38% in his role. When balanced the difference swings much more in favor of Cron.

 

The Twins really need a Matt Adams type to go with Cron.

[d-mac]

This is ok. Just not sure if there is space for both Cron and Austin on the roster.

[Riverbrian]

Cron does not have options remaining. Austin does not have options remaining. Neither can be stashed. 

 

Cron will cost 5M. Austin will Cost the minimum. 

 

Cron will cost 10M in 2020. Austin will cost the minimum. 

 

Cron has 1862 AB's. 96 Home Runs (1 per 19,39) with a .772 OPS - Austin has 367 AB's 24 HR's (1 per 15.29) with a .758 OPS.  

 

This isn't just a 5M who cares deal... They gave up two years of control between the two and we don't have clear separation in production between them. This is a gamble that Austin will not pan out over the next two major league minimum years... or at least a gamble that Cron is significantly better than Austin. Signing Cron was not gamble... DFA'ing Austin is the gamble. 

 

If it's not the gambles listed above because the Twins will use the DH to roster both. Then it becomes a different gamble that Sano will be everything we dreamed at 3B.  

 

I wouldn't take any of those gambles but I'll support the right of the front office to make the gambles they choose to make. All in all... I want them to improve the roster... roster spot by roster spot. 

[Riverbrian]

All in All... I don't think they were planning on Cron but Tampa Bay screwed up those plans. 

 

 

[Danchat]

 

Dumpster diving 101 again.  You can sugar coat it however you want but they get a player that an average to below average team doesn't want. How pathetic after getting rid of so much salary.

The Rays won 90 games... just because nobody goes to their games and they play a sort of moneyball doesn't mean they are "average to below average". That's actually a great description for what the Twins are.

 

What makes this dumpster diving? They're claiming a 2.0 WAR player off of waivers. Is any waiver claim a dumpster dive then? I guess the Dodgers were simply dumpster diving when they found Max Muncy on waivers, the Pirates dove for Corey Dickerson last year on the DFA market, and so on. You don't even have to keep the guy once Spring Training is over, so what's the big deal? Should they just not ever claim anybody on waivers? 

[cmoss84]

 

Depends.....if I think I can spend the money better on adding RP and SP, I probably roll the dice and play Austin, Kepler, Sano, Astudillo, Garver at 1B/DH when they aren't playing other positions.......it isn't as easy as choosing between those players, you also have to consider that there are only 25 roster spots, some players have options, and there are budget constraints.

 

Would you rather have Eovaldi or Corbin, or the next best pitcher that you can get for $5MM less than one of those two?

I don't like either one of those guys for the money they are going to make. I would rather:

1) Sell the farm for 3 cheap years of Noah

2) Sign Garrett Richards to a Pineda-like deal

3) Sign Bucholz to a cheap 1 or 2 year deal

4) Sign Britton

 

 

[Don't Feed the Greed Guy]

 

Rocco's guy. I'm willing to put some trust in The Baldelli Era. This is a cost-controlled move. That means there's more of the salary pie for a potential ace, middle infielder, and bullpen depth. The Cron move gives the front office more room to fill other needs.

 

Rocco's guy. I'm willing to put some trust in The Baldelli Era. This is a cost-controlled move. That means there's more of the salary pie for a potential ace, middle infielder, and bullpen depth. The Cron move gives the front office more room to fill other needs.

My wife asked last night, "what do you think of this CJ Cron guy?" So I laid out my knowledge, like above. To which she replies, "but he looks like a doofus." So there. 

[Riverbrian]

 

My wife asked last night, "what do you think of this CJ Cron guy?" So I laid out my knowledge, like above. To which she replies, "but he looks like a doofus." So there. 

 

Methodology that can't be dismissed. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

I'd wager a lot of money on Cruz out hitting Cron in 2019.

 

Possibly. The gap between those two for 2018 wasn't that much (roughly 50 points in OPS)… and Cruz is a DH only, 38, requires a multi-year commitment, and trending in the wrong direction. Cron is 28, plays 1B with slightly above average defense, requires no commitment if he's cut and is year to year if not, and is trending in the right direction. I don't think the odds of this happening are as high as one might think. If a move like this frees up some cash to be spent elsewhere, without costing a prospect, then I think this was a really smart move.

 

I was a Cruz guy, but I also would have traded a guy like Slegers or Stewart to get someone like Cron. I said as much in several threads. The league undervalues those guys right now, and as it happens, we need a couple. We needed a 1B and a DH. I agree with Brian that Austin should get the shot (he looked the part), but that still leaves an opening and Cron can fit that nicely.

 

Only real thing I hope to see is some sort of move that brings in a decent LH bat that can play some 1B along with other positions. Cron hits righties OK, but both Cron and Austin are far superior against lefties. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

You don't think that $5MM is now spent, and coming off what they would spend on other FAs or trades? I do. so, it's not just not signing another 1bDH, it's not spending that $5MM someplace else too.

 

The problem with this argument is that there was no way money wasn't going to be spent on 1B/DH this offseason. We have one guy on the 25 man that can fill one of those roles, and it's pretty obvious from this thread that not everyone is confident he can fill one of them well. 

 

Money was going to be spent at 1B/DH. I'm guessing they were planning on spending a lot more until Cron fell into their lap. As I said, this is a great pickup (assuming of course those funds saved are allocated elsewhere). 

[USAFChief]

 

We Unix computer geeks will call it a Cron Job and get nothing but crickets and weird stares for our effort.

Surely this can't come as any kind of surprise anymore, can it?

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Austin, Kepler, Garver, Sano, Astudillo.....that's what I've said all off season. 

 

Cron out performed every single one of these guys last year... and it wasn't close. 

[Platoon]

Let's hope this works out better than the last Tampa 1B coming off a career year.

A great mind once said: "Deja Vu all over again"

[ashbury]

If we wind up paying Cron $5M it's because our farm system isn't yet churning out the bat-only guys that other teams seem to be able to. That's why Cron wasn't worth literally anything on the trade market and he was simply DFAed - most teams looked at him and said "we have someone just as good". Tyler Austin for that matter is probably worth nothing on the trade market either - we accepted him as a fig leaf (along with a lottery-ticket young arm) in order to get a little salary relief from the rest of Lynn's contract, helping that signing look better. There's always guys Cron's age at AAA who OPS .800 or .900, about .100 higher than they will in the majors, and they can be obtained nearly anytime you want one.

 

"Trader Frank" Lane and Bill Veeck used to joke about their "cat and dog trades" in the 1950s. When the hot stove wasn't to their liking, they would trade a CJ Cron type for an Aaron Slegers type, just to have something in the newspapers for fans to talk about. Your cat, for my dog. It was good marketing in its time; it had little to no bearing on team performance.

 

Teams that are firing on all cylinders have a Brent Rooker type of player ready and developed when needed. (Tampa has theirs, Jake Bauers, making Cron expendable.) I am willing to give our FO some more time to get the pipeline going like it should. For now, we're still in bottom-feeder mode, watching the waiver wire each day, making claims on players that no one else wanted to trade for.

 

On a related note, I'm not entirely sure why arbitrators are expected to award someone like Cron $5M when such a player has no trade value and would surely obtain much less on the free agent market.

[Squirrel]

 

All in All... I don't think they were planning on Cron but Tampa Bay screwed up those plans. 

Just like they weren't counting on winning the bid for Park ... hope their 'we weren't counting on this and now have to make room' doesn't screw us up.

[ahart10]

Corn Job, lol.

Good pickup, better than what we have, albeit marginally, relatively cheap, non guaranteed roster spot. Twins have nothing to lose by picking him up.

[IndianaTwin]

What do you call a CJ Cron HR?

Cron Bomb? Cron Dong?

“Cron Bomb” when he jacks one in the second inning. “Cron Dong” when he pops another in the fourth. Repeat as necessary.

[mikelink45]

 

There is no downside to this. Good move. I can't believe the Rays are this cheap. They should be kicked out of the league. 

I believe that the Rays won 90 games last year.  How many did the Twins win?

[Riverbrian]

Just like they weren't counting on winning the bid for Park ... hope their 'we weren't counting on this and now have to make room' doesn't screw us up.

Exactly... I’m ok with the signing. I want assets acquired. I want improvements regardless of the increment. My concern at the moment is Austin. If this causes Austin to be cut. I may have an issue.

 

If signing Cron makes them think we don’t have room for further upgrades then I will have an issue.

 

Ultimately... I want upgrades and assets acquired and will wait to see the finished product.