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ashbury

By ashbury
in Other Baseball

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nicksaviking All-Star

nicksaviking

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Posted
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He was the best pitcher this year. Lots of years, this type will be the best. It's why you can't wait all the time, because there often won't be the exact one you want in the future.

 

I thought he was really good last year, if I was buying his production the last two years I'd be fine spending the money. 

 

My problem has been the alarming spike in his slider usage. His starting contemporaries in slider usage over 40% is basically pre-injury Tyson Ross, pre-injury Michael Pineda and Chris Archer.

 

I could certainly be talked off the ledge with convincing statistics or studies, but without additional info, it's hard to shake off the traditional belief that over-use of the slider will lead to injury.

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ashbury Cooperstown

ashbury

Old-Timey Member
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Theo is not looking real smart right now. I found myself on the Cubbie board recently and they are hoping he retires and goes back to Japan to pitch.

He was a decent player at Brookline High School but would get chewed up by the pros in Japan.

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TheLeviathan All-Star

TheLeviathan

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He was the best pitcher this year. Lots of years, this type will be the best. It's why you can't wait all the time, because there often won't be the exact one you want in the future.

 

I'm not ruling out acquiring an expensive starter.  I feel like I've been pretty loudly in favor of Grienke.  And was loudly in favor of Darvish last year.

 

Just not Corbin.  

 

I don't think we want to turn this thread into forcing everyone to want to buy in on every expensive FA right?  I'd hope we'd be able to agree that money should be spent, without being forced to believe who it should be spent on.

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Mike Sixel Cooperstown

Mike Sixel

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I'm not ruling out acquiring an expensive starter.  I feel like I've been pretty loudly in favor of Grienke.  And was loudly in favor of Darvish last year.

 

Just not Corbin.  

 

I don't think we want to turn this thread into forcing everyone to want to buy in on every expensive FA right?  I'd hope we'd be able to agree that money should be spent, without being forced to believe who it should be spent on.

 

got it. I misunderstood your stance. You just don't trust Corbin. 

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SF Twins Fan Draft Eligible

SF Twins Fan

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That's a solid trade for both teams IMO.  D-backs got more than I expected and the Cardinals didn't give up anything too special for a rental.

 

The Twins equivalent to this is what? Garver, Mejia and maybe Gordon? I'd be willing to give that up if the Twins could sign him to an extension as well.

 

Edit: That actually might be a bit high. Garver has a much better career compared to Kelly, Mejia and Weaver are probably about the same and Gordon is probably a better prospect Young. So the Twins probably could have given up less than that.

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SomeGuy Draft Eligible

SomeGuy

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The Twins equivalent to this is what? Garver, Mejia and maybe Gordon? I'd be willing to give that up if the Twins could sign him to an extension as well.

 

Edit: That actually might be a bit high. Garver has a much better career compared to Kelly, Mejia and Weaver are probably about the same and Gordon is probably a better prospect Young. So the Twins probably could have given up less than that.

It would be in his best interest to test free agency, signing him to an extension would be very hard. 

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Otto von Ballpark All-Star

Otto von Ballpark

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The Twins equivalent to this is what? Garver, Mejia and maybe Gordon? I'd be willing to give that up if the Twins could sign him to an extension as well.

 

Edit: That actually might be a bit high. Garver has a much better career compared to Kelly, Mejia and Weaver are probably about the same and Gordon is probably a better prospect Young. So the Twins probably could have given up less than that.

Weaver and Kelly were very recent top 50 prospects. Gordon is the only one in your hypothetical package with a comparable pedigree, and Arizona is apparently set at the moment for middle infielders.

 

Nothing against Garver and Mejia, but they have to be viewed as having lower ceilings than Kelly and Weaver right now. (Not to mention, Mejia's season ended early due to elbow issues.) And ceiling is generally what teams are targeting in these kinds of trades for prospects/young players.

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beckmt GCL Twins

beckmt

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Lots of prospects hit the top 50 and then burn out.  However this is for a one year rental, so hard to see Twins giving up a lot to get him.  Price was reasonable and Twins could have done it, but a little more understandable if you are talking about sustainable.

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biggentleben GCL Twins

biggentleben

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They didn't offer Cron arbitration. They agreed to a $4.8 million deal to avoid arbitration. Now it's guaranteed and on the payroll.

 

This came up recently in a discussion. Those deals to avoid arbitration are only guaranteed if the player makes the team. Cron right now is not guaranteed anything.

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Mike Sixel Cooperstown

Mike Sixel

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This came up recently in a discussion. Those deals to avoid arbitration are only guaranteed if the player makes the team. Cron right now is not guaranteed anything.

 

Do you really think they'll cut him? I mean, they claimed him and signed him for a reason, are they really going to change their mind? And if so, what does that say about their decision in the first place?

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Mike Sixel Cooperstown

Mike Sixel

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August of 14 through the end of May in 16. doesn't count as an injury?

 

That's over 2 years ago, but sure, if we want to go back that far, I assume we are giving up on Buxton too. Or Sano. Since they've been hurt in multiple years. 

 

It's too early to say signing Darvish was stupid. It's also mind boggling that the some of the same people saying it was stupid praised the Twins for being the 2nd highest biddder.....in that it showed they would try to sign great players. Which, I have my doubts.

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biggentleben GCL Twins

biggentleben

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Do you really think they'll cut him? I mean, they claimed him and signed him for a reason, are they really going to change their mind? And if so, what does that say about their decision in the first place?

 

It's happened around the league before and sure could happen again. Wouldn't be horrible on the Twins to do it, especially if someone like Rooker/Austin/etc. force the move.

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Mike Sixel Cooperstown

Mike Sixel

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It's happened around the league before and sure could happen again. Wouldn't be horrible on the Twins to do it, especially if someone like Rooker/Austin/etc. force the move.

 

Force it how? You want them to decide based on spring training? I hope they aren't making these decisions based on spring training results. 

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old nurse GCL Twins

old nurse

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That's over 2 years ago, but sure, if we want to go back that far, I assume we are giving up on Buxton too. Or Sano. Since they've been hurt in multiple years. 

 

It's too early to say signing Darvish was stupid. It's also mind boggling that the some of the same people saying it was stupid praised the Twins for being the 2nd highest biddder.....in that it showed they would try to sign great players. Which, I have my doubts.

I did not know that 129+ million contracts or releasing them was even a remotely reasonable option for Buxton or Sano . no matter how you try to spin it that sort of argument is not the same. 

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Vanimal46 MVP

Vanimal46

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This came up recently in a discussion. Those deals to avoid arbitration are only guaranteed if the player makes the team. Cron right now is not guaranteed anything.

My apologies then, I misunderstood. And now I'm wondering what the point is to announce these kind of agreements if it's not guaranteed.

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