Twins option Ryan LaMarre to AAA

[lecroy24fan]

 

I believe teams get a 26th man for special regular season games in Puerto Rico, Japan, etc., and that 26th man isn't subject to the 10 day rule.

 

This is correct and to add to it the 26th man has to be a position player. But LaMarre has to go back down after the series unless someone goes on the DL.

[Oxtung]

 

You must be new here - up in arms is the unofficial motto here.

DON'T YOU TELL ME WHEN I'M UP IN ARMS!!!

[Craig Arko]

Busenitz recalled, which is consistent with the concerns about Reed being ill.

[jokin]

 

This is correct and to add to it the 26th man has to be a position player. But LaMarre has to go back down after the series unless someone goes on the DL.

 

Makes sense. My, the Twins are keeping LaMarre busy. He's in the Red Wings lineup again today in Atlanta. I wonder if the Twins charter plane is picking him up on the way to San Juan?

[jokin]

 

Busenitz recalled, which is consistent with the concerns about Reed being ill.

 

Corresponding move? Presumably for LaMarre, who is being bounced around the system like a pinball, and is evidently going to celebrate his demotion in San Juan with the big boys, before again donning the AAA uniform next Friday in Rochester.

[jokin]

 

Because that is what people do on message boards.  He has been their second best hitter by woba.

 

How many do they need? Does it compare unfavorably with other teams?

The 4th bench player has options and can be moved for a 13th pitcher. Moya and if necessary Hildenberger have options and can be flipped if the bullpen is overworked.

I think he have the necessary flexibility.

 

Yep. And that was the point. No one was "up in arms". We were just wondering why they would go the route they chose instead of these obvious alternatives.

 

Heck, they could also just get on the phone and make a deal with the Marlins so that they can ship Kinley to the minors.

[yarnivek1972]

Players need to be given the chance to take advantage of opportunities that present themselves.

 

I don't want anybody to confuse what I'm saying as a personal opinion that LaMarre will be better than Morrison going forward. I don't want anyone thinking that I'm basing long term conclusions on an 11 game stretch of April Games.

 

However... there is little doubt that LaMarre has been better than Morrison (and others) during this 11 game stretch when getting a tiny amount of chances.

 

I continue to wait for the time when playing time decisions are not based upon who the Manager thinks is better. But rather... who is actually playing better at the time. Regardless of reputation, contract size or anything that distracts from who is actually playing better RIGHT NOW!!!

 

I continue to wait for a time when a manager looks at a guy with 4 hits in 8 AB's and compares him to the guy with 3 hits in 34 AB's and says... I think I should give the guy with 4 hits in 8 AB's a few more plate appearances at the expense of the guy with 3 hits in 34 AB's. (I'm not saying Morrison should be benched but I am saying that he can yield some playing time).

 

In a nutshell... I have no problem with LaMarre getting sent down. I have a problem with LaMarre not getting a chance to show he shouldn't be sent down before he is sent down. I have a problem with a guy hitting .500 and not getting more at bats to see if he can hit .600 while the team has a guy hitting .088. playing every day at the DH position.

 

Problematically, by the time one recognizes such a hot streak it might be over or such a cold streak a player may be ready to break out of it.

 

Better off playing players based on their track record, including the match up against that day’s pitcher IMO.

[Riverbrian]

 

Problematically, by the time one recognizes such a hot streak it might be over or such a cold streak a player may be ready to break out of it.

Better off playing players based on their track record, including the match up against that day’s pitcher IMO.

 

25 players who the manager trusts is all I'm asking. Then I want a manager who   can handle a roster and base decisions on who is hot, who is cold, who matches up against the pitcher, health and other factors. 

 

Bottom line for me... LaMarre was a waste of roster space along with Moya and Kinley because the manager would rather rely on a struggling Hildenberger and Morrison trying to get them right... when LaMarre might be right... right now.  

 

Again... I'm not saying that Hildenberger or Morrison should be extensively benched or cut or anything of the sort and I'm not reacting to 11 games in April and declaring it's how it will be in July.  

 

I'm saying... LaMarre looked pretty good in his slim chances... Let him keep trying until he isn't. If LaMarre has any chance of carving a career for himself... he needs a manager who believes in him and a manager who will say... I'm putting you in the lineup again.  

 

Depth is produced this way. If Molly has 3 players on the roster that he won't turn to.

 

That means that we haven't produced depth and Molly isn't helping. 

 

 

[stringer bell]

25 players who the manager trusts is all I'm asking. Then I want a manager who can handle a roster and base decisions on who is hot, who is cold, who matches up against the pitcher, health and other factors.

 

Bottom line for me... LaMarre was a waste of roster space along with Moya and Kinley because the manager would rather rely on a struggling Hildenberger and Morrison trying to get them right... when LaMarre might be right... right now.

 

Again... I'm not saying that Hildenberger or Morrison should be extensively benched or cut or anything of the sort and I'm not reacting to 11 games in April and declaring it's how it will be in July.

 

I'm saying... LaMarre looked pretty good in his slim chances... Let him keep trying until he isn't. If LaMarre has any chance of carving a career for himself... he needs a manager who believes in him and a manager who will say... I'm putting you in the lineup again.

 

Depth is produced this way. If Molly has 3 players on the roster that he won't turn to.

 

That means that we haven't produced depth and Molly isn't helping.

I can’t agree all the way with this RB. LaMarre is a fourth/fifth OF on this team and he did start two games. With fewer days off and minor injuries, I would expect he will get relatively more ABs if he stays on the roster. I don’t think we can go off of 10 or 30 or plate appearances and rethink playing time for veteran players On the pitching side, I don’t like seeing two guys ruled out of high-leverage situations and still secure on the roster. My bigger concern is the apparent trsust shown to Hildenberger, who had a good run last year but has shown signs of slippage this year.

[Riverbrian]

 

I can’t agree all the way with this RB. LaMarre is a fourth/fifth OF on this team and he did start two games. With fewer days off and minor injuries, I would expect he will get relatively more ABs if he stays on the roster. I don’t think we can go off of 10 or 30 or plate appearances and rethink playing time for veteran players On the pitching side, I don’t like seeing two guys ruled out of high-leverage situations and still secure on the roster. My bigger concern is the apparent trsust shown to Hildenberger, who had a good run last year but has shown signs of slippage this year.

 

I know I'm walking into a wind here. 

 

If LaMarre was placed on this roster as a 4th/5th OF and it does appear you are right.

 

However, In my opinion... If he was placed on this roster as a 4th/5th OF and that is the role he occupies. He serves very little purpose other than a guy that Molly grits his teeth and has to force into the lineup on getaway days. 

 

In my opinion... Any player that Molitor has to force into the lineup on getaway days shouldn't be on the roster  

 

I believe it is the job of the front office to provide the manager with 25 players that the manager can confidently deploy and will deploy. 

 

I then believe that it is the job of the manager to choose from all 25 players. 

 

I will always struggle with the concept of a starting 9 and bit pieces.

 

I will always be against a player hitting .100 for a month and at the same time confident that he will be on the lineup card when he gets to the stadium.

 

While not suggesting that the player hitting .100 should also be banished like he will never ever figure it out. There is enough playing time. 

 

I believe that every player on the 25 man deserves the chance to prove he belongs on the 25 man.

 

LaMarre making the 25 man roster was a surprise and he made the roster because he hit .475 in spring training.

 

Congrats Ryan you made the roster because you are hot right now but I will not utilize right now while you are hot. I will cool you off on the bench and wait until both Rosario and Kepler get hurt at the same time and then put you in the lineup when you are cold and then we will cut you because you didn't take advantage of the opportunity we didn't give you and your career will be over. 

 

 

I'd trust the demotion a lot more if it was determined by LaMarre's actual play on the field and not some pre-determined opinion of someone. 

 

It took Wilfred Brimley a long time before he finally gave Roy Hobbs a chance. 

 

 

[USAFChief]

 

I know I'm walking into a wind here. 

 

If LaMarre was placed on this roster as a 4th/5th OF and it does appear you are right.

 

However, In my opinion... If he was placed on this roster as a 4th/5th OF and that is the role he occupies. He serves very little purpose other than a guy that Molly grits his teeth and has to force into the lineup on getaway days. 

 

In my opinion... Any player that Molitor has to force into the lineup on getaway days shouldn't be on the roster  

 

I believe it is the job of the front office to provide the manager with 25 players that the manager can confidently deploy and will deploy. 

 

I then believe that it is the job of the manager to choose from all 25 players. 

 

I will always struggle with the concept of a starting 9 and bit pieces.

 

I will always be against a player hitting .100 for a month and at the same time confident that he will be on the lineup card when he gets to the stadium.

 

While not suggesting that the player hitting .100 should also be banished like he will never ever figure it out. There is enough playing time. 

 

I believe that every player on the 25 man deserves the chance to prove he belongs on the 25 man.

 

LaMarre making the 25 man roster was a surprise and he made the roster because he hit .475 in spring training.

 

Congrats Ryan you made the roster because you are hot right now but I will not utilize right now while you are hot. I will cool you off on the bench and wait until both Rosario and Kepler get hurt at the same time and then put you in the lineup when you are cold and then we will cut you because you didn't take advantage of the opportunity we didn't give you and your career will be over. 

 

 

I'd trust the demotion a lot more if it was determined by LaMarre's actual play on the field and not some pre-determined opinion of someone. 

 

It took Wilfred Brimley a long time before he finally gave Roy Hobbs a chance. 

I'd agree this is on the front office...Many of us called all winter for the front office to find a RH hitting 4th OFer.

 

But I don't think Ryan LaMarre is that guy. He's never hit, anywhere. ANYwhere. Personally I'm glad the manager seems to understand a handful of ABs doesn't negate years of history. 

[Riverbrian]

I'd agree this is on the front office...Many of us called all winter for the front office to find a RH hitting 4th OFer.

 

But I don't think Ryan LaMarre is that guy. He's never hit, anywhere. ANYwhere. Personally I'm glad the manager seems to understand a handful of ABs doesn't negate years of history.

As long as the manager understands that his story is written and final. No chance of him becoming a Chris Taylor.

[USAFChief]

 

As long as the manager understands that his story is written and final. No chance of him becoming a Chris Taylor.

He can change his name legally through the court system quite easily, so there's always a chance.

[SwainZag]

 

As long as the manager understands that his story is written and final. No chance of him becoming a Chris Taylor.

 

Chris Taylor who hit .314/.400/.458 in the minors and broke out in the majors at age 26 after having success as a rookie at age 23?  Not to mention Taylor also plays 2B and SS

 

Lamarre is 29 and hit .266/.344/.376 in the minors.  What do these guys have in common?

 

 

[Riverbrian]

Chris Taylor who hit .314/.400/.458 in the minors and broke out in the majors at age 26 after having success as a rookie at age 23? Not to mention Taylor also plays 2B and SS

 

Lamarre is 29 and hit .266/.344/.376 in the minors. What do these guys have in common?

Neither of them are cow handed with the bat?

[ashbury]

He can change his name legally through the court system quite easily, so there's always a chance.

Disapproves:

http://www.themoviescene.co.uk/reviews/_img/2393-3.jpg

 

 

Neither of them are cow handed with the bat?

I learned a new baseball term today!

[ThejacKmp]

No problem with the Lamarre moves. Makes sense to get an extra pitcher for the Puerto Rico series and Lamarre is the obvious candidate to do it. That's what being the 25th guy on the roster is about.

 

It'll be interesting to see what happens with Buesnitz/Moya when Lamarre is done with his ten days and can come back. I wouldn't be surprised to see Moya head down and Buesnitz stay. The Twins could use some depth with Hildy and Duke being a little erratic. Allows Molitor to have a quick pull with them.

 

Not going to judge this till we see who's on the team in NYC.

[jud6312]

 

No problem with the Lamarre moves. Makes sense to get an extra pitcher for the Puerto Rico series and Lamarre is the obvious candidate to do it. That's what being the 25th guy on the roster is about.

 

It'll be interesting to see what happens with Buesnitz/Moya when Lamarre is done with his ten days and can come back. I wouldn't be surprised to see Moya head down and Buesnitz stay. The Twins could use some depth with Hildy and Duke being a little erratic. Allows Molitor to have a quick pull with them.

 

Not going to judge this till we see who's on the team in NYC.

 

The best part (for me) is watching people - here and on my Facebook/Twitter feeds - get all worked up about LaMarre. I get great joy out of them trying to compare him to JD Martinez, quote his spring training stats, his "new approach" at the plate, and cite his ".500 batting average," while glossing over his entire career and the fact that he's also struck out 4 times this year.

 

Good times, indeed.

 

But, yes, he is the perfect 25th man - has options and contributes very little on the field so his absence is barely noticed. Could also hold down the fort on defense for a day until Granite could get to town.

[jud6312]

 

 

Not going to judge this till we see who's on the team in NYC.

 

Well, it appears Hughes will be there, so I don't know that the judgment can be overly positive.

[Mike Sixel]

Talking about something is literally NOT equivalent to getting worked up about it, or angsting about it, or freaking out about it......

 

I'm constantly amazed on this site, when people have a conversation about something, that so many people think there are HUGE emotions tied up in something, when really, there aren't for most of us (as far as I can tell). It's just a conversation.

[USAFChief]

 

The best part (for me) is watching people - here and on my Facebook/Twitter feeds - get all worked up about LaMarre. I get great joy out of them trying to compare him to JD Martinez, quote his spring training stats, his "new approach" at the plate, and cite his ".500 batting average," while glossing over his entire career and the fact that he's also struck out 4 times this year.

 

Good times, indeed.

 

But, yes, he is the perfect 25th man - has options and contributes very little on the field so his absence is barely noticed. Could also hold down the fort on defense for a day until Granite could get to town.

For me, the perfect 25th man would contribute quite a bit on the field.

[ThejacKmp]

 

Well, it appears Hughes will be there, so I don't know that the judgment can be overly positive.

 

Meh, is Hughes that much worse of a call the Mejia? I'd like to see Hughes get a shot. As long as the Twins have a quick hook with him and aren't giving him too much rope, I think the difference between Hughes or Mejia being the bridge to Santana is negligible. 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Meh, is Hughes that much worse of a call the Mejia? I'd like to see Hughes get a shot. As long as the Twins have a quick hook with him and aren't giving him too much rope, I think the difference between Hughes or Mejia being the bridge to Santana is negligible. 

 

One pitched pretty well last year, one did not. One is part of the future, possibly, one is not. I prefer One to one.

[ThejacKmp]

 

For me, the perfect 25th man would contribute quite a bit on the field.

 

At that point, doesn't he stop being the 25th man? 

 

A 25th man provides:

• Pinch running late in game
• Pinch hitting pop for late in a game
• Occasional start in getaway game
• Defensive replacement

The Twins don't need a defensive replacement in the OF. Lamarre doesn't have the pop but he's not bad for pinch running or the occasional start in a getaway game. 

 

I've seen people get worked up about Danny Santana or Florimon for years. Never makes much sense - the 25th man doesn't really matter. What matters more is the guy waiting in AAA who comes up if someone is actually hurt. That's Granite/Wade in the OF, Gordon in the IF and Who-Knows-What at C.

 

I think a fairer criticism might be Grossman. He had a great 2016 and an okay 2017 but has started slow this year. Small sample but if he's more 2017 than 2016 by mid-June, the Twins might have to think about hitting the trade market for a better 4th RH hitting 4th OF. That's not a big problem - guys like that never cost much and are usually veterans who can bolster the clubhouse.

[ThejacKmp]

 

One pitched pretty well last year, one did not. One is part of the future, possibly, one is not. I prefer One to one.

 

The odds of Mejia really being a part of the future is pretty low though. With Romero, Gonsalves, Jorge and Thorpe in the minors plus Pineda, Santana, Odorizzi and Berrios at the MLB level next year, Mejia seems like minor league depth. Not ragging on him, I love having a guy like Mejia in that role. But his upside is maybe a #4 starter. Seems like we overstate Mejia a bit.

 

Hughes has worked hard to get back to the ML level. There's a value to demonstrating that you'll stick by veterans who work hard. Hughes is well-liked in the clubhouse. If they were blocking Romero, I'd get the  argument. But giving Hughes a start or two over a 6th/7th starter like Mejia seems pretty defensible. 

[ThejacKmp]

 

Talking about something is literally NOT equivalent to getting worked up about it, or angsting about it, or freaking out about it......

 

I'm constantly amazed on this site, when people have a conversation about something, that so many people think there are HUGE emotions tied up in something, when really, there aren't for most of us (as far as I can tell). It's just a conversation.

 

Agree. But I think you know as well as I do that often people do get worked up - it's not a conversation, it's an argument. I think that's when saying "worked up" is a fair characterization.

[Mike Sixel]

 

The odds of Mejia really being a part of the future is pretty low though. With Romero, Gonsalves, Jorge and Thorpe in the minors plus Pineda, Santana, Odorizzi and Berrios at the MLB level next year, Mejia seems like minor league depth. Not ragging on him, I love having a guy like Mejia in that role. But his upside is maybe a #4 starter. Seems like getting worked up about something small.

 

Hughes has worked hard to get back to the ML level. There's a value to demonstrating that you'll stick by veterans who work hard. Hughes is well-liked in the clubhouse. If they were blocking Romero, I'd get the  argument. But giving Hughes a start or two over a 6th/7th starter like Mejia seems pretty defensible. 

 

 

 

There is value in playing the best players, and rewarding the good ones for their hard work (I'm assuming Mejia is also a hard worker), over keeping a guy around because of money.

[Mr. Brooks]

The odds of Mejia really being a part of the future is pretty low though. With Romero, Gonsalves, Jorge and Thorpe in the minors plus Pineda, Santana, Odorizzi and Berrios at the MLB level next year, Mejia seems like minor league depth. Not ragging on him, I love having a guy like Mejia in that role. But his upside is maybe a #4 starter. Seems like we overstate Mejia a bit.

 

Hughes has worked hard to get back to the ML level. There's a value to demonstrating that you'll stick by veterans who work hard. Hughes is well-liked in the clubhouse. If they were blocking Romero, I'd get the argument. But giving Hughes a start or two over a 6th/7th starter like Mejia seems pretty defensible.

He had a league average ERA his rookie year.

If he can learn how to go longer in games, he can easily be a #3 (league average, by definition), without much improvement.

 

Mejia has both a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Jorge, IMO, not sure why he's even in the conversation for guys ahead of Mejia.

[ThejacKmp]

 

There is value in playing the best players, and rewarding the good ones for their hard work (I'm assuming Mejia is also a hard worker), over keeping a guy around because of money.

 

Absolutely value in getting young guys up too, they bring an energy. And I'm sure Mejia works hard too. 

Still think there's a value in demonstrating that a guy who works incredibly hard to come back from multiple injuries will get a shot. They did it with Nolasco and Perkins last year and I thought that was classy of them. As classy as Hughes not getting that extra 1/3 of an inning. 

 

Big question is: How much better is Mejia than Hughes? I think that's a fair question because we have no idea what Hughes is at this point in time. All we've seen are minor league starts and even then, we don't really know if Hughes was working on something specific or pitching an MLB-like start. I'd like to see what Hughes has left in the tank just to know. That way the Twins can make a decision to move him to the pen, where I could see him being an okay middle reliever. 

[ThejacKmp]

 

He had a league average ERA his rookie year.
If he can learn how to go longer in games, he can easily be a #3 (league average, by definition), without much improvement.

Mejia has both a higher floor and a higher ceiling than Jorge, IMO, not sure why he's even in the conversation for guys ahead of Mejia.

 

He also stands to suffer when teams start to concentrate on him in film. Kind of like Duffey, who proved unable to sustain his start because teams figured out he only had two pitches and they could key on one. I'd bet on Mejia being more #6 starter than #3 starter but hope for the latter obviously. He is only 24 but his stuff isn't amazing so he'll have to figure out how to stop walking guys. 

 

Jorge has better stuff than Mejia. Mejia has had middling K rates throughout the minors while Jorge in the low-minors had relatively high K rates. Jorge may end up in the pen but he's got a higher ceiling if he can put everything together. I'd say he's much more likely to be a #3 starter while Mejia is more likely to be a good #5 starter.

 

P.S. I really disagree with the idea that a #3 starter is by definition a league average starter. I think that's way too simplistic. The Cubs #3 starter is Hendricks, he isn't a league average starter. The Marlins #3 starter might not start on any other team. To me, a #3 is a guy you'd be okay starting in game 3 of a division playoff series. The Twins have had a lot of years with four or five #4 or #5 starters.